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Plato's Euthydemus
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| Psy-T |
i just read it and i can't figure out why Socrates was so fascinated with the 'wisdom' of Euthydemus & Dionysodorus; it comes a bit contradictory to every preconceived notion of socrates i've had...
to me, Dionysodorus & Euthydemus were being completely childish.
Euthydemus from the Gutenberg Project
what do you think? |
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| Psy-T |
| are you people just being lazy, or did you not read it? :o |
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| Psy-T |
| quote: | SOCRATES: As to their origin, I believe that they are natives of this part
of the world, and have migrated from Chios to Thurii; they were driven out
of Thurii, and have been living for many years past in these regions. As
to their wisdom, about which you ask, Crito, they are wonderful--
consummate! I never knew what the true pancratiast was before; they are
simply made up of fighting, not like the two Acarnanian brothers who fight
with their bodies only, but this pair of heroes, besides being perfect in
the use of their bodies, are invincible in every sort of warfare; for they
are capital at fighting in armour, and will teach the art to any one who
pays them; and also they are most skilful in legal warfare; they will plead
themselves and teach others to speak and to compose speeches which will
have an effect upon the courts. And this was only the beginning of their
wisdom, but they have at last carried out the pancratiastic art to the very
end, and have mastered the only mode of fighting which had been hitherto
neglected by them; and now no one dares even to stand up against them:
such is their skill in the war of words, that they can refute any
proposition whether true or false. Now I am thinking, Crito, of placing
myself in their hands; for they say that in a short time they can impart
their skill to any one. |
| quote: | Here Ctesippus, as his manner was, burst into a roar of laughter; he said,
That brother of yours, Euthydemus, has got into a dilemma; all is over with
him. This delighted Cleinias, whose laughter made Ctesippus ten times as
uproarious; but I cannot help thinking that the rogue must have picked up
this answer from them; for there has been no wisdom like theirs in our
time. Why do you laugh, Cleinias, I said, at such solemn and beautiful
things? |
| quote: | Poseidon, I said, this is the crown of wisdom; can I ever hope to have such
wisdom of my own? |
| quote: | Yes, I do, subject to your correction; for you are the bottom, and
Euthydemus is the top, of all my wisdom. |
| quote: | To such a pitch was I affected myself, that I made a speech,
in which I acknowledged that I had never seen the like of their wisdom; I
was their devoted servant, and fell to praising and admiring of them. What
marvellous dexterity of wit, I said, enabled you to acquire this great
perfection in such a short time? There is much, indeed, to admire in your
words, Euthydemus and Dionysodorus, but there is nothing that I admire more
than your magnanimous disregard of any opinion--whether of the many, or of
the grave and reverend seigniors--you regard only those who are like
yourselves. And I do verily believe that there are few who are like you,
and who would approve of such arguments; the majority of mankind are so
ignorant of their value, that they would be more ashamed of employing them
in the refutation of others than of being refuted by them. I must further
express my approval of your kind and public-spirited denial of all
differences, whether of good and evil, white or black, or any other; the
result of which is that, as you say, every mouth is sewn up, not excepting
your own, which graciously follows the example of others; and thus all
ground of offence is taken away. |
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| Psy-T |
| thanks for the correct link aswell, didn't know gutenberg doesnt allow direct linking |
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