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Tories abandon Liberal amnesty plan for illegal workers
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| MarkT |
discuss...
tough one...illegal is illegal...but the flipside is that many people who are legally here do nothing but suck the welfare system dry while many of those being deported contribute to the community...particularly in an industry woefully low on skilled labour.
tough call.
btw...the situation is Canada is *nothing* compared to the size of the illegal workforce in the U.S. where the numbers are absolutely staggering...to the point where they're looking at some more practical solutions other than deportation which is a logistal nightmare when the #s are so big there.
| quote: | Tories begin deporting illegal workers
Portuguese families caught in immigration crackdown
Mar. 21, 2006. 02:19 PM
PETER GORRIE
STAFF REPORTER
Illegal workers in Toronto's underground economy are being deported as the new Conservative government abandons a Liberal amnesty plan, immigration lawyers and consultants say.
Some families who have been in Canada five years or more are being given less than two weeks to pack up and leave.
Toronto's Portuguese community with up to 15,000 undocumented members, working mainly in the booming construction industry is especially concerned.
Early last year, then-Immigration Minister Joe Volpe said he would try to find a way to get legal status for undocumented workers.
"They are here already and have proven themselves to be integrated," Volpe said at the time.
Last May, he said he had signed off on a final draft and the plan was set to go to cabinet. But nothing was done during the following six months before the Liberals were defeated.
Immigration officials now say they will continue to enforce the existing policy, with increased resources.
In February, Immigration Canada notified the Portuguese embassy in Ottawa that it would continue with the current law and be strict in applying it, Maria Amιlia Paiva, the consul-general in Toronto, told the Star's Isabel Teotonio.
Portugal's ambassador to Canada, Joγo Silveira Carvalho, has publicly told people to avoid trouble and to "stop feeding the myth" in Portugal that you can come to Canada without documents, several community members said.
And yesterday, Immigration Minister Monte Solberg called the issue a "low priority," indicating that Volpe's approach is dead.
A spokesperson for the Canadian Border Services Agency said she couldn't give figures on the number being deported.
Immigration consultant Tony Dutra said he knows of 20 families that have been given less than two weeks to leave. "People are being hustled out ... Three or four years ago, there seemed to be more flexibility. It was humane. Now, it's rush, rush, rush."
The agency has booked seats on a Sunday Skyservice charter. According to a voice mail message from one of its officers, the agency had filled another 50 seats on a March 30 Air Transat flight.
"I've seen a larger number of (removal) letters going out to people," Peter Ferreira, president of the Portuguese National Council and a former senior immigration officer, said in an interview. "I've been getting more calls from people who are concerned. They see the writing is on the wall."
Apart from personal hardship for people now firmly entrenched in Canada, the flurry of deportations could devastate the construction industry, Ferreira said. "This group it's been proven and any union president or employer will say don't get rid of these people because we need them.
"Imagine expelling thousands of construction workers when the construction industry is desperate for skilled labour ... Consider the contribution made by these people.
"It doesn't make sense. These people are contributing to Canada's well-being and economy."
To ease the shortage, Canada offers one-year temporary work permits for people with construction skills. The annual quota of 500 is never met, Ferreira said. "So we need these (undocumented) people even more."
Among those impacted is the Ferreira family (no relation) parents Joe and Elizabeth, both 39, their son Licinio, 21, and daughter Alicia, 18 who were ordered on March 17 to be on this Sunday's Skyservice flight.
The Ferreiras who came to Toronto in March 1999, to visit relatives and decided to stay illegally are typical.
The children went to school, Joe worked as a bricklayer and Elizabeth got a job in a window factory.
"Life was good, but we were scared to get caught," Licinio, who now works in construction, said in a weekend interview. The family had to be careful because if anyone got injured or sick, medicare wouldn't cover their hospital costs.
About three years ago, at a time when rumours of an amnesty first began, they went to an immigration consultant who advised them to apply for legal status, first on humanitarian grounds and then, when that failed, as refugees. The consultant charged $4,500, the Ferreiras said.
Like all refugee claims filed by Portuguese immigrants, theirs was rejected.
Portugal has a democratic government with no record of torture or other activities that could justify refugee claims. However, some unscrupulous consultants recommended that course of action. Other undocumented workers applied on different grounds, possibly expecting a repeat of an amnesty in the mid-1980s.
The policy applies to undocumented immigrants from any country, but the hopeless refugee claims mean it has a big impact on the Portuguese community.
"I blame 99 per cent of the problem on consultants," Dutra said.
Border agency spokesperson Anna Pape says the GTA enforcement centre has averaged a steady 4,500 "removals" in each of the past five years.
"I expect those numbers will be up," she said.
The increase is in part because many of the failed applications have reached the end of the road around the same time, Ferreira said.
As well, Ottawa has given the agency more resources "to focus on removals," in line with increased staffing at the board that rules on refugee appeals, Pape said.
"We said, if they (the board) got more resources, it would make sense for us to get more to process the increased number of negative decisions.
"It's like if you have more police on the street, you'll get more arrests."
The Ferreiras acknowledge they were here illegally and must go. But they think the policy doesn't make sense, and they don't like how they've been treated.
"We're working and go to school," Licinio said. "We pay income tax, do everything by the book, but we're treated like garbage."
"It's not fair, sending people home in two weeks," said cousin Paula Goncalves. "If you own a home or car, what are you supposed to do? People who work their asses off here, who aren't any trouble whatsoever, are sent home. They're hard-working people."
Since receiving their "direction to report" the final notification to be on a particular flight the Ferreiras have scrambled to prepare to leave.
"A week isn't enough to get rid of the car and do everything I need to do," Licinio says. "It's a huge commotion. A lot of other people are in the same situation. They're being completely unfair to us."
The family arranged for seats on a different flight, saving a total of more than $3,500 compared to what they'd have paid the border agency for tickets.
"I love it in Canada," Licinio said. "I have great friends and family. It's a great life. I want to come back."
Pape said families usually get three or four weeks to depart. But, she said, once their final appeal has failed, and before they get the "direction to report," they should start getting ready.
"They should have a sense they're going to be asked to leave. It's the end of the road." |
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| Jayx1 |
i know people who have gone through hell and high water to get into this country the proper way. Why should the illegals get a break?
Sorry but if you want to come here do so legally. What the government should be doing in tandem is to reform the immigration laws so that we get the tradesmen and professionals that we need. And if that happens to be farm work or other so called unskilled work then so be it as well.
The only sympathy i have for illegals is that they probably had to do it that way due to our dumb immigration policies. However that doesnt mean they should have an unfair advantage to others whom spent years and literally thousands of dollars in fees to do it the right way. |
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| drgoodvibe |
| quote: | Originally posted by Jayx1
i know people who have gone through hell and high water to get into this country the proper way. Why should the illegals get a break?
Sorry but if you want to come here do so legally. What the government should be doing in tandem is to reform the immigration laws so that we get the tradesmen and professionals that we need. And if that happens to be farm work or other so called unskilled work then so be it as well.
The only sympathy i have for illegals is that they probably had to do it that way due to our dumb immigration policies. However that doesnt mean they should have an unfair advantage to others whom spent years and literally thousands of dollars in fees to do it the right way. |
holy crap.. I actually agree. |
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| Fir3start3r |
| quote: | Originally posted by Jayx1
i know people who have gone through hell and high water to get into this country the proper way. Why should the illegals get a break?
Sorry but if you want to come here do so legally. What the government should be doing in tandem is to reform the immigration laws so that we get the tradesmen and professionals that we need. And if that happens to be farm work or other so called unskilled work then so be it as well.
The only sympathy i have for illegals is that they probably had to do it that way due to our dumb immigration policies. However that doesnt mean they should have an unfair advantage to others whom spent years and literally thousands of dollars in fees to do it the right way. |
WINNAR!
hit the nail right on the head Jayx1... |
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| MarkT |
I think you guys have nailed the "right" or "wrong" argument for whether or not illegal immigration is acceptable...but what about looking at the practical implications of the current situation?
So to play devil's advocate here ;) (playing devil's advocate here...
Should we pump resources (i.e. actually spend money) on deporting people who are substantially contributing to our economy...they pay taxes, they buy goods, they work in a sector desperately short on skilled labour across the country.
I'm suggesting that while we need to prevent illegal immigration, that there should be an alternative to just turfing people who've been here for years and aren't a leech on our resources. These aren't people on welfare...they aren't taking jobs away from anyone.
Not only are we spending money to locate and deport these people...but we're hurting our own trade sector by removing thousands and thousands of skilled workers.
I agree that we can't condone and legitimze illegal immigration by turning a blind eye, particularly when people toil for years to get here through legal channels, but there must be some practical solution other than "get out"?
| quote: | Don't deport `honest' workers: Builder
Skills are critical for construction
Crackdown could affect thousands
Mar. 22, 2006. 05:22 AM
RICHARD BRENNAN AND TONY WONG
STAFF REPORTERS
A prominent GTA developer has condemned the federal government for wanting to toss "honest, hard-working" illegal immigrants from Portugal and other countries out of Canada.
"There is definitely a shortage of workers in the construction industry right now, and it doesn't matter from road building to plumber to bricklayers there is a shortage," Silvio De Gasperis told the Toronto Star yesterday.
"This process should be stopped until they get a chance to review and assess the entire situation," said De Gasperis, one of the country's largest private developers. "Maybe if they did they would realize that the good families, the honest people, should be staying and working."
It has been estimated that there are between 10,000 and 15,000 illegal immigrants working in southern Ontario's construction and hospitality industries; some estimates put the number of undocumented workers across the country as high as 300,000.
Neither the federal immigration department nor Immigration Minister Monte Solberg's office would comment yesterday on whether the government would consider any kind of regularization program. On Monday, Solberg called it "a low priority."
A Star report this week expressed concerns by immigration lawyers and consultants that illegal workers were being deported as the Conservatives abandon Liberal moves toward an amnesty plan.
The deportations threaten to rock Canada's booming construction industry. Construction represents 9.5 per cent of Canada's total Gross Domestic Product and 7.5 per cent of Ontario's alone, according to figures from the Greater Toronto Home Builders' Association.
Yesterday the association reported that new home sales in the GTA were up 11 per cent year over year, as the industry continues to break records.
"As the construction season gears up, any sudden loss in industry capacity will have significant deleterious effects on production," warned GTHBA executive vice president Stephen Dupuis yesterday.
Local companies such as Granolite Co. Ltd., Toronto's oldest stucco specialist, are already feeling the pinch. Demand is so high that owner John Faienza needed another 40 workers last fall, but couldn't find any.
"I went to the union, I went everywhere, but it was impossible to find workers," said Faienza.
Faienza currently sponsors about seven workers under a program administered by the Greater Toronto Home Builders' Association. But that is not nearly enough, he says.
"There is always a shortage of skilled labour, especially since most Canadians don't want to do this kind of job. When they come here they are willing to work hard. That's good for them and it's good for the economy," said Faienza.
Since 2001, the GTHBA has helped the construction industry fill about 300 jobs in Ontario under a temporary foreign worker program, said program manager Silvia Bendo.
Still, concedes Bendo, that's a drop in the bucket compared with the numbers needed.
The GTHBA estimates that construction employs 226,961 people in Ontario, more than the auto industry. It represents 6 per cent of all GTA jobs.
"This could potentially have a very big impact, since there are so many shortages," said housing analyst Will Dunning.
The economist forecasts that housing starts this year will roughly equal last year's before trending down slightly next year.
The issue has been so pressing that the Canadian Home Builders' Association wrote a letter on the issue to Solberg's office last month.
"The labour shortage is a very serious concern for us, and especially in areas such as Toronto," said John Kenward, chief operating officer of the CHBA in Ottawa. "We are hoping there is some sensible resolution to this."
Kenward said his organization hopes to meet with the minister soon.
Kenward said the workers are "real assets to Canada, and even if there wasn't a labour shortage, these are exactly the type of people you want here. They are hard-working, and they have earned a place here."
Fernando Martins, an immigration lawyer who works in the Portuguese community, describes these workers as "stuck between a rock and a hard place."
"My fear is that instead of them seeking help, this may actually drive them deeper underground where they're open to the possibility of exploitation."
Martins supports regularization of those who are healthy, have worked here at least two years, have skills needed in construction, are employed and have no criminal record.
Bendo said she has been getting frantic calls from employers whose employees may have failed refugee claims.
"They may be able to re-hire the deported employee, but the employee would have to wait six months before he can reapply to Canada," said Bendo.
That's not an acceptable solution to De Gasperis.
De Gasperis said Ottawa should consider declaring an amnesty for illegal immigrants from Portugal and elsewhere if they are providing a badly needed service.
He said his own grandfather emigrated to Canada from Italy in 1930 and when he couldn't find any work he "skipped across the border" to Canton, Ohio, and worked in the same brick factory for 30 years. |
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| Jayx1 |
perhaps a comprimise would be to allow them to stay but have them reapply under the rules that everyone else has to apply.
Have their case treated equally with others in line. If they are rejected then they have to go back. That would be as far as id be willing to go but even then they still are given an unfair advantage over those who did it the right way. |
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| Moral Hazard |
| As much as I agree that we should not suffer people to live and work in our country illegally and without documentation I think that this is a poor use of resources at present. There are far more pressing matters that need to be addressed then this. |
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| Jayx1 |
| quote: | Originally posted by Moral Hazard
As much as I agree that we should not suffer people to live and work in our country illegally and without documentation I think that this is a poor use of resources at present. There are far more pressing matters that need to be addressed then this. |
But harper has to bring in the cleanup crew. Because the liberals had started this mess and he has to clean it up now. Yes the timing sucks but thats the stage that this is in at the moment and it needs to be dealt with. |
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| Wurm |
| But who will drive our cabs, flip our burgers, build our houses and wash our toilets? |
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| MarkT |
I don't buy the "cleanup crew" crap...
the Liberal 'plan' of not addressing our ty immgration policy (or lack thereof) for skilled foreign workers and having this amnesty plan hardly inspired confidence...but I don't think turfing everyone is "cleaning" anything up.
I really don't like Harper's agenda of just scrapping everything and starting from scratch...there needs to be some sort of interim plan to bridge the gap.
he's ditching the agreement made between the federal gov't and all provinces for aboriginal people in favour of his own plan...so in the meantime, they get nothing?
he's ditching the Liberal daycare plan, albeit over time, to give people a measley $1200/year and only for those with kids under 6?
so now he's ditching an admitedly flawed, band-aid amnesty program before doing anything to address the ty immigration policy we have.
IMHO, a good incoming gov't doesn't just erase the status quo and policies of the previous gov't...you introduce significant changes more gradually so as not to over the affected people in the meantime. |
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| Jayx1 |
| quote: | Originally posted by Wurm
But who will drive our cabs, flip our burgers, build our houses and wash our toilets? |
answer: the legal immigrants who were fooled into coming here thinking they could continue being doctors, lawyers and teachers as they were in their homeland. And the biggest fraud about that is that the canadian government actually leads immigrants into believing that they can be those things here based on their foreign education. It's one of the biggest and most undocumented cases of fraud in canadian history |
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| ChemEnhanced |
| quote: | Originally posted by Wurm
But who will drive our cabs, flip our burgers, build our houses and wash our toilets? |
university graduates |
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