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House Music structure question? (pg. 2)
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| crazedonee |
yeah there is no structure for all of edm
i been there too i made some tracks that were a mess but i listend to people and learned music theory
once you study and learn music theory ,you basically take what you learn and arrange it in a pleasing manner.
i do agree with derivative
if you have 16 bars of a then 16 bars of b then 32 bars of c
your stuff wil lsound to mechanical and like everyone else.
and copying someones arrangement is not music theory or structure.
just do what feels right and what sounds good and in the end whatever you have is your house track. |
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| thoughtlessjex |
| quote: | Originally posted by Lepanto
so is the 2/4th beat snare. and offbeat high hats. |
Are they?
House certainly has structure, but so does any other music. The thing about house, or any music, for that matter, is that you don't have to follow that structure exactly. You can have a track evolve mechanically, or organically. It's your choice, so experiment a bit. |
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| substorm |
Yes, all music have structure, BUT i cant say that there is any rules on how it should be built.
The structure of a track, often grows with time as soon as u start working with it. Personaly, i almost never stick to the image i have of the track in my mind. U will find out, that u will get new ideas while working on it. |
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| DJ Shibby |
Wow, this post is seriously scary and disheartening.
House music often involves actual musicians, not just nerds sitting behind a computer screen (though us nerds are half the work!), and it hasn't experienced the same kind of "it must sound like this!!" that trance has, since people who listen to house aren't necessarily largely a teenage/just-post-teenage crowd.
So you don't know what house music is yet?
House music is groove. It's all percussion; it's all about getting that special motion.
You want rules and a manual? This is the biggest joke that you even said that, but I'll give you a rule: make it 4/4.
That's it, the rest is all you.
Sorry if I came across harsh in this post, but seriously, come on. |
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| PutBoy |
There is no simple structure to House music, though most follow a 16 bar structure.
16 bars intro without bassline (the bassline never starts before 16 bars, in general of course)
16 bars with bassline
16/32 bar break (sometimes 24 bars, but it's not as common as in Trance)
There is no real 'standard' House structure, but most commersial tracks start out this way.
Sometimes there is a 16 bar intro without kick before the 16 bars without bassline too. |
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| Derivative |
| quote: | | House music is groove. |
I should have this. This is what I wanted to say.
There are alot of ways to go about writing House music and none of them would be 'wrong' per se, but a key point to house has always been the way you swing it. You can go about that in whatever way you want too but Axwell, Laurent Garnier, in' Spiller even. It all comes down to the groove.
If you play an instrument, you dont think of how many bars you are going to play before you change riff or play a lick or fill or whatever. You go on feel and what seems appropriate next. At least I do with my guitar anyway. This will come down to some kind of structure in the end, but the point is I am not aware of it when I am playing.
The best music I ever wrote I did on autopilot and I did it quickly. In the zone - I just go on feel and instinct. But I like those qualities in music so its good enough for me. |
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| crazedonee |
There are no rules
the only rule you need to follow is music theory
muisc theory is for all kinds of music there is no such thing as house music structure ,trance structure
but once you do learn music theory you wont need this forum.
but i think you are after a template (but dont listen to these guys who tell you to listen to a song and copy there
template or thats how you make your tracks no).
i learned the hard way that you dont need a template to make music
if you have one delete it.
just make your tune ,make each phrase at a time ,as long as your in the right key signature
the right tempo using the right timbre and synth for the genre you want to produce then your good.
but if a template is what your after then
you have an intro,a build,percusiion,build,drop ,drop-build,build - percussion drop,strings,build - main riff,drop repeat
thats a template but it could go any way you wanted.
for example most people start with everything and then go into a breakdown,then gradually build
me i like to start with the fx,pads and whatever and then gradually build the track its all up to you.
but if you want structure do a search on music theory and search phrases and form
structure is basically parts of a song and each phrase is a different part you would put together.
in a musical way for example
intro ,verse,pre chorus,chorus,bridge - middle eight ,instrument solo ,some ending
so you basically label them for example a is your first phrase b is your second phrase and c is your third phrase
a being the first verse b being the chorus and c being the bridge
so your structure would be something like
a a b a a c a b
or aaba
aabc
aaa bb cc
its all up to you but you need to learn music theory before you start making your form.
its kind of like riding a bike before you learn how to walk, dont jump out in the wilderness too soon.
but one thing to keep in mind is that your stucture ,your form ,can go anywhere once you have the basics down so you dont
need a template just do what you feel. |
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| Derivative |
You dont even really need to know music theory although it helps. Even then, the point isnt to slavishly copy but rather to find interesting ways of breaking the theory.
Music that is theoretically and mathematically perfect isnt really music. Well it is, but it wont have a soul if thats all you do.
Some artists get by without knowing anything about music theory and still make wonderful emotive music, using just sound and timbre - check out any ambient/industrial work to see that in effect. |
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| DJSentinel |
Not to be a party pooper, but its funny to see people arguing about the "predictableness" (if that is a word) of music when they happen to be on the forum for one of the most repeditive/predictable genres.
My strategy is to work on something until it sounds good to me. Others can make up their own mind after that. For now I am going to find a way to mesh house and trance into a set.
Peace |
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| Derivative |
If you think trance is predictable you are listening to some ty trance.
Check out a few Space Cat tune like 'Beam Me Up' and tell me that in any way is predictable. Trance has *always* been a state of mind, *not* a structure in music. A state of mind in the writing of the music and/or a state of mind you want to put the listener in. It does not really have any specific form except in commercial tpyes of Trance.
And rightly so, because I have seen Orchestras playing where some of the muscians in the pack are so far gone that you can see it all over their face and hear it in the instrument they are playing. And I found that experience mesmerising and very trance like. Its not something which has borders or genres or which can be pigeon holed into 1 style of writing music. It doesnt work like that.
The repetition in 'Trance music' is necessary so that you lose your orientation in the mix but beyond that you have free artistic license to do whatever the hell you want. You definitely hear that on 'Beam Me Up' because it not only has irregular phrases but whole instruments sit in the background of the mix for minutes before you even realise they are there. Instruments come in and they are completely out of tune and audibly so.
The whole experience is deranged and it is totally hypnotic. It feels about 3 minutes long when its actually 8. |
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| DJSentinel |
Well then we are on different pages. I don't like those tracks "although I do appriciate the work that went into them" because they are not the sound or style or drive I go for. I like the more fast paced hands in the air dutch trance. Some may say its cheesy or predictable or too commercial "music these days is commercial to buck up and realize it, just don't let that hinder your creativity" but I don't really care, because If I can get a club to move, then I did my job. I listen to unpredictable music like Squarepusher and I am much happier making dutch cheese "HI-NRG Alphazone trance if you know what I mean ;-)"
Don't take everything so seriously, some people don't think electronic music IS music. |
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| DJSentinel |
| quote: | [i][b]
The repetition in 'Trance music' is necessary so that you lose your orientation in the mix but beyond that you have free artistic license to do whatever the hell you want |
Just a side note, I always thought, historically, the repetition was so it could be danced to. Tell me if I am wrong. :conf: |
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