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supersaw - good or bad? (pg. 2)
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| Mr.Mystery |
| quote: | Originally posted by G-Con
Could someone post a sample of a typical supersaw sound. Whilst I think I know what it is, I'm not 100% certain |
Think the breakdown of Rank 1 - Airwave. |
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| AirPole |
| Supersaw has been one of the most essential sounds to Trance ever. Supersaw is still good, it depends on how you use it. |
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| G-Con |
| quote: | Originally posted by Mr.Mystery
Think the breakdown of Rank 1 - Airwave. |
So basically its that warm pad sound you get?? And this is created with a bunch of sawtooth waveforms??
Just started getting into production and I would never have guessed that sawtooth's would create that type of sound, I'd have thought the opposite in fact.
Back to the topic, yes its overused, but still has a place in trance |
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| Mr.Mystery |
| quote: | Originally posted by G-Con
So basically its that warm pad sound you get?? And this is created with a bunch of sawtooth waveforms??
Just started getting into production and I would never have guessed that sawtooth's would create that type of sound, I'd have thought the opposite in fact.
Back to the topic, yes its overused, but still has a place in trance |
Well it's one of the sounds - other good example would be the lead of Carte Blanche. |
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| Spirit5 |
| quote: | Originally posted by Mr.Mystery
Well it's one of the sounds - other good example would be the lead of Carte Blanche. |
Thats a better example. That is classic super-saw right there. I think super saw nowadays is over used. Back in 99, 00 and 01 it was a cool sound but like Miamitranceman said, nowadays there are so many new sounds that can be used, that still using super saws sounds cheap and dated. The whole point should be for this music to progress, to grow and not sound exactly like it did back in 99 and 00. What I like about the progressive side of trance/house is that it doesn't rely so much on super-saws. The sounds are much more smooth, and the melodies don't sound as overtly electronic or cheap. In some tracks it can sound okay, just as long as it's not ripping off stuff from 99 and 00. |
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| DJ Intrigue |
| quote: | Originally posted by Spirit5
What I like about the progressive side of trance/house is that it doesn't rely so much on super-saws. The sounds are much more smooth, and the melodies don't sound as overtly electronic or cheap. |
My thoughts exactly. |
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| Zombie0915 |
I enjoy "overly electonic" sounds personally. I always enjoyed the supersaw, except when it gets really really obnoxious. There are lotsa computerish noises that are great fun. Why try to emulate a real instrument, you know it will never compare to the real thing, why not try to make noises that are unique to the machines.
But yeah, supersaws, that old "PC Speaker" buzz, those amiga chip noises, that is sweetness right there, I can't get enough of it. I also lke the granular synthesis noises, and those bell-like sounds you get from FM synths.
Anoter fun thing to try is taking a simple noise, like a little beep or buzz, and writing some sort of pattern for adding a great many variations of those simple noises together, its surprising the fun sounds you can get out of that, I tried to add a bunch of buzzez together in my Abiogenesis tune(in my sig) and I thought it turned out really neat. |
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| Spirit5 |
To me with electronic music comes progress and in the future, electronics will sound less and less like electronic noise. Thats one of the reasons why i'm not as into techno or electro sounds as much as the more progressive, melodic variety. I do see that as technology becomes more and more advanced, those old noises wont sound like they used to. Just because something is electronic, doesn't mean it needs to sound as such. I guess i'm into the idea of putting a human element inside the machine, or inside of electronic music. I think this is one of the reasons why I gravitate towards either the more progressive stuff that is more melodic and warm-sounding. I guess it stems from this idea.
It could be that in the future and even today to a certain extent, a real acoustic guitar and an electronically created acoustic guitar melody will sound indistinguishable. This may sound like a bad thing, however it does mean that that acoustic sounds could be created to sound more realistic. After all those electronic reproductions need to come from somewhere. I'm not saying that electronic synthesis should replace acoustic playing, but with electronic producers, those sounds could be utilized. I think it would be cool to have more tracks with people actually playing the guitar as well because it would give it a live element. But if there isn't, the next best thing is utilizing these sounds reproduced electronically.
This idea could go with almost any instrument, and thus wield something far greater IMO than the super-saws of the past. I'm already seeing this with trance to a certain extent. I think Envio is one of the most well known producers utilizing the guitar in trance music. I'm sure there were plenty of others before him, but he really took it to a new level with "Touched By The Sun" and "Time To Say Goodbye", and "Yet Another Day" by Armin was also quite good. And with progressive and house, there's plenty of guitar stuff too, hence why there's these guitar threads that pop up on here often. |
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| Zombie0915 |
My idea of progess is not to bother emulating the things that we already have, but rather creating unique new things that are different from what we already have. I guess we can use the computer graphics analogy here, things are moving more towards the ability to render lifelike images, but I get off more on the images that those devices can make which are beyond the things that we can see in person, things which don't exist in nature. The games I enjoy most aren't the ones that best emulate reality (especially the ones that attempt to accurately represent the horrors of war), but rather the ones that deviate from reality in the most interesting ways.
I like the idea that as these devices get more capable, they get better at reproducing any sounds we can imagine, not just the sounds we have heard before from physical instruments. Who would have thought that a supersaw could sound so pleseant? Maybe there is some other aritificial noise that causes such a reaction in people that we haven't found yet.
I don't think we will ever have electronics sounding indistinguishable from live instruments, there is one crucial bottleneck: the speaker. Everything we create merely controls these speakers, which are just air-shaking machines that vibrate according the the voltage that you shoot at a little magnet which is attached to the speaker membrane. Speakers alter sound, they will never sound like a guitar pluck or a piano indistinguishably, and many of your talented instrument players will tell you that listening to recorded piano frustrates them and makes them wonder why nobody is playing the thing live, we could make a robot that plays a physical instrument though, maybe give it a finger for each key, that would be both our ideas of progress put together, to play an instument in ways physically impossible for people. |
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| Spirit5 |
Well it's the argument does art reflect reality or does reality reflect art? The guitar was just an example of the idea of a human element, it doesn't have to be as familiar as this. I understand what your saying about new sounds, and new sounds should be created, and have been. I guess what I am getting at is that even if the sounds are recreations of existing sounds or not, the point being that there should be a human element to this music. I think that is what is important, well to me at least.
Others might want some really abstract, alien sound, but if you could make that abstract, alien sound...sound human then you have there some really great music. I think the two more identifiable things which gives it a human element are 1. melody and 2. beat. Something about that beat reminds one of the beating of the heart. That melody then is a reproduction of the voice, the music speaks to you.
Sparse, alien sounding music is good in an experimental sense, but if you can take that and make it sound less alien (using some alien sounds), and more familiar or identifable, then i'de say that's definitely where this music, or any electronic music, can go. Take Ulrich Schnauss's music for example, it is very warm and melodic, yet it's very ethereal. It's created almost entirely through electronic means. I think he is one example of what i'm talking about, but there's plenty. I mean this is just a personal thing, the way I view this music but some might like the more alien sounding stuff. So i'm not saying i'm right about this, merely stating my opinion as where this music could go or is going...I guess i'm talking about electronic music in general and not just trance. |
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| Subtle |
| its not the supersaw that is the problem, but the melodies people puke out of it. :rolleyes: |
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| RapidFire |
| quote: | Originally posted by G-Con
Could someone post a sample of a typical supersaw sound. Whilst I think I know what it is, I'm not 100% certain |
its basically a saw like sound....thats super. |
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