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"ALL GO NO SHOW" or "ALL SHOW NO GO"??????????? (pg. 3)
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| M.A.R.K |
| dude you have to understand not all of us has 100+ g's to throw around on a car like the ferrari. we would all love to have a modena or some sort. btw i would be pretty damn proud if i owned a nissan skyline. :D |
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| tiesto14 |
| quote: | Originally posted by Typhoon
I've never been able to understand one thing: What's with Americans & Japanese cars ? I mean here in Europe, ok u have the Toyota Celica & the Mazda RX-7 but that's about it. When people get to talking about real sports cars, they mean Ferrari, Maserati, klp. I mean who in their right mind would buy a Nissan & be proud of it ?I mean, just look at it, look at a pic of a 360 Modena & you'll now what I mean.... This occured to me while watching the movie Fast & Furious which featured only Japanese cars. & I know the guy in the film overtook a Ferrari, but it was a 355 & let's not forget that Ferrari makes better models, including the pinnacle in automobile technology (F2002 anyone ? :D )
Anywayz to the question asked I'd go for a little bit of both. I think that any car above 200bhp is pretty satisfactory performance wise (depends on weight ofcourse, but assuming we mean a normal car)
I drive a Seat Leon 20VT4 with the engine re-tuned to 225bhp (instead of the original 180). It's a pretty good car, pretty fast on the highway & devilishly fast on mountain roads. When I bought it a had to make the same choice. It was between the Leon & an Alfa Romeo 147 2.0 (150bhp atmospherical engine, the Leon has a 1.8 liter turbocharged). The 147 was about 5000$ & was more beautiful & had a 5 speed semi-automatic gearbox, but the Leon was more powerful, 4-wheel drive & had a 6-speed manual gearbox. So I chose the Leon & I am pretty satisfied. |
Well American kids buy Japanese cars because they are cheap to buy and there are lots of performance parts available for them...i personlly beleive that if you are lookign to DRAG race your car (which is what most American kids do with the Japanese cars) then i would not buy a Japanese car...i would by a 68 Camaro and slap in 457 Blown Hemi and completley tude out the entire car...cus if you did that you would not find many peopel who will beat you...in a drag race of course...that engine would smoke and Ferrari, Lambo or Porsche engine in the 1/4 mile...and i ahve seen it doen SO MANY times in NYC street drag races.....
And u say real sports cars meaning ferrari and all...i agree those are REAL sports cars but how many young adults or kids do you know who can buy a $120,000 base line Ferrai.,.,..get real
And in the movie The Fast and The Furious that Toyota Supra was turbocharged and spraying nitrous...there is not any Ferari made to date that would beat that Supra off the line in a race...yes in the TOP END the Ferrari would win but off the line no chance..unless its a Formula 1...or a twin turbo F-50
And i dotn liek Nissan but the Nissan Skyline will blow the doors of any of the cars u mentioned....to bad its ugly
You say your car has 225BHP...you know what BHP means it is not the same as horsepower.,....where did you get that number from...HAVE YOU HAD YOUR CAR DYNO TESTED?...cus if you havent your pulling numbers outta the air...BHP = Blown Horse power...meaning thats how much power get to the wheels after it goes through all the other crap like the flywheel...also what amount Torque do you have?..if you knwo the BHP you should know the torque considering Torque is basically more important when racing....Also what mods have been done to the engine to gain the increase? is it naturally aspirated? |
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| Typhoon |
Umm yes I forgot a little tidbit: Here in Europe when we mean racing, we mean a real race with all twists & turns. The braindead American straight-ahead races are not considered reall racing. To be frank I agree with that. Since tha magik in driving is not how fast you can go, but how fast you can turn. So the Supra & the Skyline might be really fast but can they turn just as fast ?
And I was not saying that anybody should buy a Ferrari. I know that not many (unfortunately) have that much money. But you can buy a BMW M3 for about 50.000$m which is a pretty fast car & you can always tweak it a bit. And there are other similar cars available (the Porsche Boxster S for example).
As for my car as I said it has a 1.8 Liter turbocharged engine (4 cylinders/5 Valves per cylinder). Actually it's all in the name: 20VT4, meaning 20 Valves (20V), Turbo (T), 4-wheel-drive (4). I know 1.8 liter might seem like a toycar to most Americans but here in Europe we don't share your enthusiasm for cubic centimeters). The car was dyno-tested after the tuning & the result was 224BHP (ok so I added one more, flame me :D ) The torque is 280 Nm at 2,200 rpm. The single mod that was done was to increase the compression ratio. I must say that this is not really a mod. This engine (the Volkswagen group's 1.8 turbocharged) is available in almost a dozen cars (the Volkswagen group consists of the following companies: Volkswagen, Audi, Seat & Skoda) & the engine is tuned to perform anywhere from 125HP (in the Seat Toledo, a family car) to 225HP (in the Audi TT, a sport coupe & the Audi S3 a GTi hatchback). And the only thing that differs is the compression ratio, the engine is exactly the same. So you see it wasn't really a mod. |
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| kolkiewolkie |
| quote: | Originally posted by Typhoon
Umm yes I forgot a little tidbit: Here in Europe when we mean racing, we mean a real race with all twists & turns. The braindead American straight-ahead races are not considered reall racing. To be frank I agree with that. Since tha magik in driving is not how fast you can go, but how fast you can turn. So the Supra & the Skyline might be really fast but can they turn just as fast ?
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LOL finally another european carmaniac to back me up :p
about the racing: that is EXACTLY what I sometimes forget to mention...
allthough I must admit dragracing is gaining popularity around here as well
| quote: |
As for my car as I said it has a 1.8 Liter turbocharged engine (4 cylinders/5 Valves per cylinder). Actually it's all in the name: 20VT4, meaning 20 Valves (20V), Turbo (T), 4-wheel-drive (4). I know 1.8 liter might seem like a toycar to most Americans but here in Europe we don't share your enthusiasm for cubic centimeters). The car was dyno-tested after the tuning & the result was 224BHP (ok so I added one more, flame me :D ) The torque is 280 Nm at 2,200 rpm. The single mod that was done was to increase the compression ratio. I must say that this is not really a mod. This engine (the Volkswagen group's 1.8 turbocharged) is available in almost a dozen cars (the Volkswagen group consists of the following companies: Volkswagen, Audi, Seat & Skoda) & the engine is tuned to perform anywhere from 125HP (in the Seat Toledo, a family car) to 225HP (in the Audi TT, a sport coupe & the Audi S3 a GTi hatchback). And the only thing that differs is the compression ratio, the engine is exactly the same. So you see it wasn't really a mod. |
Exactly the same?? correct me if I am wrong, but the 125 hp is, from what I know, without the turbocharger...
the rest of the increasing number of hp's: it actually means the engineers of VW are pretty good in chiptuning :D :D
greetz |
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| tiesto14 |
| quote: | Originally posted by Typhoon
Umm yes I forgot a little tidbit: Here in Europe when we mean racing, we mean a real race with all twists & turns. The braindead American straight-ahead races are not considered reall racing. To be frank I agree with that. |
First of all dont call Americans BRAINDEAD...there is no need for that...i personlly dont like drag -racing and think u show WAY more skills when u race on a track or as you would say with "twists and turns"....as for American racing u must not know much...u ever hear of a little group called the SCCA?
| quote: | Originally posted by Typhoon
Since tha magik in driving is not how fast you can go, but how fast you can turn. So the Supra & the Skyline might be really fast but can they turn just as fast ? |
Well that all depends on the type of modifications that are done to the suspespension...
As for that Supra in the video..that car is VeRy well known in the California show and race cirsuit and is owned by a guy named Brian O'Connor , so i know ALOT about that particular Supra (meaning the orange Supra from the Fast and Furious)...and as far as his suspension mods he has done the following :
1. Eibach Coilovers with Koni Shocks
2. Eibach Sway Bars
3. Energy Suspension FULL Bushing kit
4. Trust Front Upper Strut Bar
5. Trust Lower Rear Strut Bar
6. Trust Rear Upper Strut Bar
7. Cusco Pillow Ball Upper Mounts
8. TRD Race Front Camber Kit
9. MFS Custom Built 8 Point Welded Roll Cage
so the answer to your question on whether or not he could HANDLE the turns...LOL...i think he would out corner most cars u could fine that are still street daily driven.....if anyone knows about suspensions you would see that his suspension is absolutley INSANE...it is perfect for road,strip and "twists and turns"... he has KONI's that says enough...
and for those who care...that car is FAST as ,,,,
LOOK AT THE ENGINE MODS ON THAT SUPRA:
1. 3.0L DOHC Turbocharged Inline 6
2. Turbonetics T-66 Ball-Bearing Turbo
3. Q-Trim Compressor
4. Turbonetics Delta II Wastegate
5. RPS Stainless Steel Turbo Piping
6. HPC-Coated Custom Race Headers
7. NOS (Nitrous) 100HP Shot System
8. AEBS Turbo Downpipe
9. Greddy Front Mount Intercooler
10. Greddy Power Extreme Exhaust
11. Greddy Pro-Fec B Boost Controller
12. Greddy Power Pullys
13. Greddy Oil Cooler Kit
14. Greddy Cam Gears
15. A'Pex Blow off Valve
16. G-Force Racing ROM
17. Powerhouse Racing Port & Polished Throttle Body
18. Powerhouse Racing Port & Polished Cylinder Head
19. HKS Fuel Regulator
20. HKS Fuel Pump
21. TRD Ignition System
22. Race Pulleys
23. Clutch Masters Stage-3 Race Clutch
24. Lightened Flywheel
thats mean ing car...thats all i can say...and hes running high 9's in the 1/4 still being street legal...
| quote: | Originally posted by Typhoon
And I was not saying that anybody should buy a Ferrari. I know that not many (unfortunately) have that much money. But you can buy a BMW M3 for about 50.000$m which is a pretty fast car & you can always tweak it a bit. And there are other similar cars available (the Porsche Boxster S for example). |
M3 is very expensive aswell for young kids...and the Porshe Boxster Type S is the turbo charged Boxster that is very expensive..its not the regular Boxster
Your car may be fast...but beleive me that Supra woudl make u look like a toy...thats for sure...and making a car handle good is NOT hard to do the turns.,..its a matetr of money and planning....u can take ANY car and make it handle like its on rails... |
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| kolkiewolkie |
about the supra...
weren't there build 7 or so (of which 6 'died' and 1 is owned by a southern neighbour of mine... a belgium dude :p )???
and about the koni's: dutch quality :) |
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| tiesto14 |
| quote: | Originally posted by kolkiewolkie
about the supra...
weren't there build 7 or so (of which 6 'died' and 1 is owned by a southern neighbour of mine... a belgium dude :p )???
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I am talking about the REAL orange Supra the one they copied to make the movie...u relaly think they would take the real one and put it in all those stunts...be real....why would they risk that car when they could build crappy look alikes to do all the stunts and ....and please dont try and tell me that the real one si crap..if you think it is then you know absolutley NOTHING about cars and are making yourself look VERY dumb |
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| tiesto14 |
Typhoon....i for got to mention u ragged on American kids for tuning Japanese cars making it like they are crap cars and all that...and making it seem as if you drive a Ferrari or a Maserati...well i did some research on the Seat Leon and it is just as much a BUDGET ECONOMY car as most Japanese ones ...it would be in the same class as the Acura Integra GSR or Subaru WRX or a GTi...so please dont act as if you drive some top if the line Italian sports car....
and YOUR car IS NOT in the same class as a BMW M3 or a Porsche Boxster so why did you imply that it was.....u must be joking....
And not for nothing...but unless u did some suspension mods to your car , i would say that your suspension is VERY BASIC and nothing to brag about...it is the average suspension that BUDGET cars have....nothing special about it at all...to be honest the Acura Integra GSR has a better suspension then your car stock...so i hope u did some mods...cus from the factory ur suspension sucks....so dont act as if your car is a pro-rally or super-touring car with a badass suspension...unless u did some mods to it, it will handle no better then most cheap cars.
And please dont come back at me saying that your car would not be in the same class as the Acura Integra because the integra is not turbocharged...cus i will come back right at you and tell you that someone can easily add a T3/T4 Turbo to an Acura Integra and surpass your 225 BHP by far.....so infact your car is less in power then the Japanese cars....since the Integra has a better suspension and more power if it also had a turbo (which is easy to do). ...
sorry pal... |
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| kolkiewolkie |
| quote: | Originally posted by tiesto14
I am talking about the REAL orange Supra the one they copied to make the movie...u relaly think they would take the real one and put it in all those stunts...be real....why would they risk that car when they could build crappy look alikes to do all the stunts and ....and please dont try and tell me that the real one si crap..if you think it is then you know absolutley NOTHING about cars and are making yourself look VERY dumb |
LOL, I was just sharing some thought.. cos I did not know whether they build 7 all tuned up cars or only one for the close ups...
and, what you apparantly did not notice, I LOVE THAT SUPRA!!!!
it is a VERY RARE car around here... what I've read there where only 25 officially imported to holland... probably this number is now a little bit higher because of the import of used supra's... cause new these cars are VERY expensive, and we dutch folks do not tend to spend tons & tons of money on a car which has no practical use at all (therefor a look at or traffic is kinda boring..:( ) |
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| tiesto14 |
| oh sorry...LOL....by the way Toyoya stopped making the Supra in 97 i think... |
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| Typhoon |
First of all: I did not say that Americans are braindead. There are as many brilliant American people as there are Greek (well probably more since America has 25 times the population of Greece). Anywayz I meant in proportion. I just pointed out that I find this drag racing, & those oval circuits dumb. I do not know of the SCCA. As I said we do not know much about the American races here. It's all F1 & WRC here.
I agree that Koni's rule & that car would probably be ably to handle pretty much any corner, but what about the cost to implement all those mods ? I'm pretty sure they aren't cheap in the USA either...
As for the M3 & the Boxster S I simply reffered to them because they are relatively cheap for their performance. I have no idea how much a Supra or Skyline costs since these models are not imported in Europe. (Btw if you could tell me I would be grateful)
kolkiewolkie: I'm pretty sure the Toledo is turbocharged, since I've driven one & it had the 20VT markings in the rear. To be frank I didn't look at the engine & it could be that the owner simply added a T just for showing off, but you could be right. If that's the case then the smallest HP for th 1.8l T engine is 150 in a number of models (Audi A4,Skoda Octavia.....).
I was not trying to say that my car is anywhere near as good as any of those cars. I wish it was :-) But it's problably the best car you can get for 20.000$ (with the mod). About the suspensions I was thinking about it. I am in the process of collecting cash & suggestions. Have u got any ? (suggestion I mean :) )
For the record I am 21 & a Computer Engineering student. I cannot afford anything more expensive, not so much from the cost point of view but I cannot pay the taxes for it. (In Greece tha car taxing system is so that over 2 liters the tax grows extremely much. I.e. my car is classed in the 12.200$ while a 3 liter car is classed at 72.000 $. What this means is that the IRS assumes that to have this car I make at least that money in a year. And since I don't make 72.000$ or anywhere near that, I cannot afford any car above 2 liters. |
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| kolkiewolkie |
| quote: | Originally posted by Typhoon
kolkiewolkie: I'm pretty sure the Toledo is turbocharged, since I've driven one & it had the 20VT markings in the rear. To be frank I didn't look at the engine & it could be that the owner simply added a T just for showing off, but you could be right. If that's the case then the smallest HP for th 1.8l T engine is 150 in a number of models (Audi A4,Skoda Octavia.....).
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well, I looked it up for you
assuming you had the latest model:
in holland!!! it was ONLY deliverable WITHOUT the turbo, and in that case it delivers a 125 hp. Ofcourse it is possible that other countries get a turbocharged type, but that 1 usually will have more hp's.
IF, and only IF you had an older 1.8 litre model (91-99): that 1 came with an 1.8 litre 90 hp's (wow)(sarcastic)
1.8T at its 'weakest' form is IMO indeed 150 bhp, which came in our first golf 4 GTI (can you believe that? 150 bhp and they dare to call it a gti)
well, gotta get myself some tickets for a fine party :)
have a nice weekend
btw: your system sucks bigtime |
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