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Everyone is right all of the time. (pg. 2)
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| Halcyon+On+On |
| quote: | Originally posted by jdat
so if someone makes a decision which they know is wrong and bad for them does that make them selfish? |
I think this may be where 'knowing' and 'believing' really separate themselves. People may very well 'know' (somewhere) that a choice is going to be bad for them, but they justify the decision to themselves - they 'believe' that the possible outcome (no matter how improbable it is) will be the positive story that they play out in their heads, or they simply underestimate the impact of the decision - I mean, what difference does anything make, really? hmm. I can't think of any instances where a person makes a decision that they just absolutely know will have a negative impact upon them - even when people sacrifice a part of themselves for the sake of another, they are still being self-serving in the fact that they sacrifice for somebody who is close to them, who makes them feel good. Of course, I am likely just generalizing here... |
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| Frenchie |
| quote: | Originally posted by Yan
That just BLEW my mind.
I never even thought of that. |
I giggled. |
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| Space_Marine |
| quote: | Originally posted by Yan
That just BLEW my mind.
I never even thought of that. |
:conf:
Im confused. I know there a hidden meaning to that but can quiet get it.
Plz explain. :p |
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| Synchronicity |
| quote: | Originally posted by jdat
so if someone makes a decision which they know is wrong and bad for them does that make them selfish? |
Only if it's to the detriment of others of course.
| quote: | | The conclusions you have come up are weak, unfounded and appear to be based on nothing but "philosophy" for dummies, or late night stoner let's change the world cause it sucks type of talk. |
I like thinking about this kind of stuff and I thought it would be funny to see the reaction I got in the mental COR!
| quote: | Some of your points have validity and others make sense to me, on a philosophical level, but overall I think you fail to see the significance of human selfishness and self-interest.
As a species, I think that we are much better off as individuals. What you are suggesting -that we unite and work towards common goals in an ideal vision of what a 'peaceful' future might hold, something like that, right?- sounds like just more hive-mind mentality. I wouldn't want to live in a world where I served nothing but the goals that were fed to me through a television 'for the betterment of mankind'; Even if it means the death of our species in the long run (which I highly doubt it does, in fact, I am fairly certain it means quite the contrary). |
Individuality wouldn't have to be lost. If selfishness was completely eliminated, in what way would you be restricted? Nothing major surely? |
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| Ed G |
| quote: | Originally posted by Synchronicity
Everyone is right all of the time.
Every decision a person makes, they make because they think it is right at the time. Even if it goes against their usual morals, or the generally accepted morals of society, they think it is right at the moment they choose to make it.
So in order to understand a persons behaviour, you have to understand why the person feels the choices they make are correct at the time they make them.
At the moment the decision is made, three factors influence the decision: Past experiences, present situation and foresight.
So in order for people to start respecting each other as equals, join together and make the world a better place, people would have to compromise and make decisions based on the betterment of society rather than just themselves.
Most religions seem like an obvious candidate for solving this problem, as they encourage acting for the benefit of society/the greater G(o)od rather than (D)evil. ;) Unfortunately, many religions have set ideas dating back thousands of years, which do not accept believers in other religions, or athiests. Of course, it would be wrong to say 'ditch religion', the point is that some religions could be more tolerant of other beliefs.
A friend of mine and I were discussing this, and agreed that it all comes down to selfishness.. it's the only obstacle (within our control) in the way of everlasting peace and happiness for everyone.
:toocool: |
State that as a question please. |
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| Synchronicity |
| quote: | Originally posted by Yan
That just BLEW my mind.
I never even thought of that. |
Not sure if you're joking or not but I just noticed it a year or two ago and it BLEW my mind! Just made me even more sure 'God' is manmade. |
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| Arbiter |
| quote: | Originally posted by Synchronicity
Everyone is right all of the time.
Every decision a person makes, they make because they think it is right at the time. Even if it goes against their usual morals, or the generally accepted morals of society, they think it is right at the moment they choose to make it. |
Ok, there's a couple of things here that you should consider. First, there's a big difference between being actually right and thinking you are right at the time. Also, you might want to clarify what exactly your mean when you say "right" to avoid accidental equivocation. In particular, distinguish between moral "rightness," justifiability (in terms of what criteria?), and accuracy or correctness.
| quote: | | So in order to understand a persons behaviour, you have to understand why the person feels the choices they make are correct at the time they make them. |
Okay, is the person "thinking" they are right at the time or "feeling" they are right at the time? There is a difference. I'm also a little confused with the use of the word "correct" here: correct in what sense? Are these things objectively verifiable or are they correct in some person's subjective opinion?
| quote: | At the moment the decision is made, three factors influence the decision: Past experiences, present situation and foresight.
So in order for people to start respecting each other as equals, join together and make the world a better place, people would have to compromise and make decisions based on the betterment of society rather than just themselves. |
Ok, now you're just sounding naive. Given the evident diversity of the human species, how can we really believe that everyone is "equal?" And even if we could, how would that facilitate making the world a "better" place? Better in what way?
As for the "betterment" of society - everyone's going to have different opinions about what is better for society, so even if everyone were making decisions based on it, there still wouldn't be consensus.
| quote: | A friend of mine and I were discussing this, and agreed that it all comes down to selfishness.. it's the only obstacle (within our control) in the way of everlasting peace and happiness for everyone.
:toocool: |
Make no mistake, if it weren't for selfishness, none of us would even be here to contemplate such matters. No offense, but the ideal of "everlasting peace and happiness" sounds like something out of a children's book. The desire for nothing but peace is not one that all people share - and even those that desire it would likely not find themselves more fulfilled if they actually found it. As for happiness... it is really not realistic to expect continuous happiness regardless of one's circumstances. No matter how favorable those circumstances might be, they will eventually become the baseline and only things "better" than usual will elicit happiness. |
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| Halcyon+On+On |
| quote: | Originally posted by Synchronicity
Individuality wouldn't have to be lost. If selfishness was completely eliminated, in what way would you be restricted? Nothing major surely? |
Selfishness and Self-interest are two sides of the same coin... the coin that seems to flip at a moment's notice for some people. :/
I see what you mean - if humans worked with another more and less for themselves, it would be much easier to deal with many of the issues in our world right now that are neglected simply due to lack of support. Also, many of the blaring 'popular' issues that people seem to take heart in (war, famine, plague, pestilence?) would be dulled as people began to realize that these struggles are only caused by selfish peoples' preservation. But what would the world become were it not for selfishness and self-interest? In theory, I think that many of the problems people face on a larger scale would fade, but how would the quality of lifestyle be if people could not and would not do things for themselves? Eliminating selfishness is like taking out the ability to have chocolate ice cream - if all you have is vanilla, what does vanilla really taste like without chocolate to compare it to? I know metaphors of duality don't really get us anywhere, but my point is that people's self-interest is a good thing because it helps us survive through the extremes - selfishness is just overindulgence in this creed, and is usually considered bad, sure, but it's absolutely necessary to the human condition because it is what sets us apart from one another in most cases. Who are we if we have no investment in ourselves? |
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| Synchronicity |
| quote: | Originally posted by Ed G
State that as a question please. |
Is selfishness ultimately the only crime?
Should you give up all hope of an unselfish world? |
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| Ed G |
| quote: | Originally posted by Synchronicity
Is selfishness ultimately the only crime?
Should you give up all hope of an unselfish world? |
Crime is a lie.
Selflessness is a lie. |
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| Psy-T |
| quote: | Originally posted by Arbiter
Make no mistake, if it weren't for selfishness, none of us would even be here to contemplate such matters. No offense, but the ideal of "everlasting peace and happiness" sounds like something out of a children's book. The desire for nothing but peace is not one that all people share - and even those that desire it would likely not find themselves more fulfilled if they actually found it. |
+1 |
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| Psy-T |
| quote: | Originally posted by Synchronicity
Is selfishness ultimately the only crime? |
criminalize selfishness and you're criminilzing the human condition.
| quote: | Originally posted by Synchronicity
Should you give up all hope of an unselfish world? |
yes, you should, unless you want a world that does not support life. |
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