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The Lexixon mx200
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| G-Con |
Can anybody help me with abit of info on this hardware effects unit. I constantly hear how software reverb plugins just dont compare in anyway to hardware ones. I also hear how lexicon are renowned for their reverb units.
So I've done some searching and came across the lexicon mx200.
www.dv247.com/invt/26180/
Its cheap at only £149 and Sound on sound magazine gave it a good review saying the reverb effects were very good but not as good as high end models.
Would it still be noticeably better than software reverb plugins or would a good software reverb sound better?
Also something I am completely crap at understanding is inputs and outputs and what cables are required etc.
I have a delta 44 soundcard with 4 1/4" jack outs and 4 1/4" ins. Am I right in thinking that i would have two cables going from the outs of my soundcard into the ins of the lexicon. Then two cables going from the outs of the lexicon to the ins of my soundcard. Is this correct or am i missing something?
To summarise in two key questions
1)Will it sound NOTICEABLY better than good software plugins?
2)Can i use it with an maudio delta 44 soundcard?
I really like the look of this unit. I like the fact it can be used as a plugin in my sequencer. I like the fact I can have two different reverb settings running at once. And I like the fact it will take a lot of pressure off my comp usage.
But I dont wanna waste money on something if it doesnt really improve the sound quality of my productions (effects wise)
Any help?? |
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| Eric J |
I have one of these and here are my thoughts:
It definitely sounds better than any of my Alesis Reverb units. The reverb just has a quality to it that sounds "right". I don't know but thats the best way I can put that.
I have my JP-8080 running through it and it definitely improves the sound of it, especially on a synth like the JP that does not have built in reverb (which is usually crap anyway).
To answer your two questions:
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1)Will it sound NOTICEABLY better than good software plugins?
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It depends how how good your software reverbs are. I think it sounds better than my Waves Reverb plugins, but I don't think it sounds better then the UAD Reverbs I have.
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2)Can i use it with an maudio delta 44 soundcard?
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Yes, but you have to make a few decisions on how to connect it.
Connecting through USB:
If you connect it up with USB, it will show up in your VST Plugins list and you can use it as a VST Plugin, it simply sends all the FX processing to the hardware unit, but other than that it works exactly as a software reverb plugin would. If you go this route, you do not have to connect the IN/OUT's at all. The unit works in much the same way as a DSP card would.
ONE IMPORTANT NOTE FOR CUBASE USERS: In Cubase 3, you must have the SX version in order to make this work. For Cubase, you have to set the unit up as an External Instrument or it will not work as a VST Plugin. You can still use it for hardware, though. Lower versions of Cubase (SL/SE) do not have the External Instrument capability.
Connecting through the IN/OUT's:
If you want to use it as an FX box for a hardware synth, you either connect the synth's outs directly to the IN's in the MX200 and the MX 200 OUT's go to the IN's on your soundcard. You will not be able to run your VST synths through it this way.
| quote: | | I have a delta 44 soundcard with 4 1/4" jack outs and 4 1/4" ins. Am I right in thinking that i would have two cables going from the outs of my soundcard into the ins of the lexicon. Then two cables going from the outs of the lexicon to the ins of my soundcard. Is this correct or am i missing something? |
Do not connect it this way. The delta 44 does not have the ability to send audio to different OUT's (At least I could never figure it out) Even though you have 2 pairs of stereo out's, try routing HW IN 1/2 to OUT 3/4. I could never get this to work right. Maybe I missed something. YMMV. AS far as I can tell this is a limitation of the soundcard.
I recently replaced my Delta 66 with a MOTU 24IO (highly recommended!), and I am able to run a software VST synth through the box but only because the MOTU card has a DSP chip on it, so my latency is sub 20ms. The CueMix DSP software allows me to do some crazy routing scenarios. A Delta 44 will not be able to do this as far as i know.
One personal note, if you can save a couple of extra hundred bucks, go ahead and spring for a UAD-1 DSP card. The PCI version is only $400 US and you can buy tons of plugins once you have the card. I think you'll be more impressed with the all the effects overall, but thats just my opinion.
I like my MX200, but I think I get a better value for my money with the UAD-1 card.
For me the MX200 is just a stop gap until I can save up enough for a PCM81, but thats like $1,800 so it'll be a little while.
Let me know if you have any other questions. |
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| Enigmatic XTC |
| what controls do the lexicons have on them (as far as room size, decay time, etc)? |
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| Eric J |
You can see a photo of it here
The thing is that the controls functions will change depending on what effect you have selected. Its a multi FX unit, meaning it has Reverb, Delay, Compressor, etc. The MX 200 series actually is 2 FX processors in one.
What that means for this unit is that you can have 2 FX on ONE sound at any one time, so you can have, for example, a reverb and a delay. What you cannot do is treat 2 seperate sound sources with different FX with the MX200. The unit only has one set of stereo IN/OUT pairs.
As far as I know this is also true when it is used as a VST FX plugin (I can't use it that way, so I'm not entirely certain).
The MX400 unit expands this capability to 4 FX on TWO sounds, so it actually has 2 sets of STEREO IN/OUT's effectively making is 2 MX200's in one box.
Oh yeah, both units also feature S/PDIF for you digital types. |
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| G-Con |
Thanks for the indepth reply eric j. That really helps a lot.
I've heard a lot of people talk about this UAD-1 card you mentioned. Sorry but I'm really crap at understanding this stuff. If you click on the link below, it shows various models of this uad-1 card. Which one would be suitable?
What is it exactly? A soundcard with built in effects? Can I use this on as many different sound sources as i want or is it limited to one at a time?
Can anyone explain to me in baby language exactly how it works?
http://www.dolphinmusic.co.uk/?page...display=preview |
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| echosystm |
| quote: | Originally posted by G-Con
Thanks for the indepth reply eric j. That really helps a lot.
I've heard a lot of people talk about this UAD-1 card you mentioned. Sorry but I'm really crap at understanding this stuff. If you click on the link below, it shows various models of this uad-1 card. Which one would be suitable?
What is it exactly? A soundcard with built in effects? Can I use this on as many different sound sources as i want or is it limited to one at a time?
Can anyone explain to me in baby language exactly how it works?
http://www.dolphinmusic.co.uk/?page...display=preview |
A DSP chip is a digital signal processor (i think :p), so it's basically the guts of an fx unit. It does nothing on it's own, you use software to tell it what to do. It's basically like using a VST reverb, except all the processing is done on the card. A big benefit is that it CAN alleviate some CPU usage ;) |
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| G-Con |
| quote: | Originally posted by echosystm
A DSP chip is a digital signal processor (i think :p), so it's basically the guts of an fx unit. It does nothing on it's own, you use software to tell it what to do. It's basically like using a VST reverb, except all the processing is done on the card. A big benefit is that it CAN alleviate some CPU usage ;) |
Does that mean that the quality of the effects are the same as software vsts rather than hardware effects?
I see that the dsp card can come bundled with various effects. Is this basically like buying a load of vst effects but rather than using the comps processor they use a seperate card?
Due to the price, I cant help but feel there must be more to it than this but not sure what? |
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| thecYrus |
| quote: | Originally posted by G-Con
Does that mean that the quality of the effects are the same as software vsts rather than hardware effects? |
all lexicon reverbs are software too! it's not that outboard gear is always analog..
and btw. i don't think the 200 sounds superb. you should probably look more into the mx 500.. but there's still a big difference to a pcm 81/91 |
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| Eric J |
echosystm is correct. The UAD-1 card is basically a dedicated processor unit for UAD VST effects. There are several benefits for going this route:
- All the UAD VST Plugins run directly off of the card, so your computer CPU is freed up for other tasks
- You can combine one or more UAD cards in your system to add additional processing power
- The quality of the UAD effects are top notch, several of the effects they offer are modeled after classic hardware units that are prohibitively expensive and largely unavailable. One example would be the Fairchild 670 compressor. This hardware compressor is valued at $30,000 and that's IF you could find one. It also weighs over 100 lbs and generates insane amounts of heat. You can get the faithful software recreation of this for like 200 bucks.
- They offer nearly every type of standard effect you'd ever need: Reverb, Delay, Compressor, Limiter, etc. They also have 3 new Precision Mastering plugins designed specifically for mastering.
One thing to remember is that the card will only work with UAD plugins. You can still use your regular VST FX (DX, VST, etc.), but only the UAD plugins run off of the card. Once you start using them, you may find yourself rarely turning to other FX. I know I use them almost exclusively.
Above and Beyond and Thrillseekers are big proponents of these plugins and for good reason, they simply sound amazing. The quality of these effects are arguably the best you can get in a software recreation of a hardware unit. NEVE and Roland both commissioned UA to recreate some of their most heralded and hard to find hardware units in software. The quality of these effects is second to none IMO.
As for which one to get:
It depends on your budget. The important thing to remember is that you can get any of the UAD cards offerings listed on that page and they are all pretty much the same thing, the only difference being which plugins are included.
So if you go with the Universal Audio UAD-1 PCI Express Pak (369.00), then you get one PCIe card and several included plugins. You also get a 100 voucher at the UAD online store to buy more plugins. If you buy the 799.00 version, you still get the exact same card, except that you get more plugins included in the bundle.
If I were you, Id buy the 369 version. Then you have the card and you can always go to UAD's online store and buy more plugins when you need them. Once you have the card, any plugins you buy from UAD will work with it, so you can buy only the plugins you need, when you need them.
In addition to that, if you find that you are maxing out the UAD Card's CPU, it easy to just buy a second UAD-1 card, pop it in your system and you instantly have double the power to run UAD plugins. Up to 4 UAD cards can be installed in a single system.
This is what I did:
I bought the UAD-1e PCI Express version (369.00), which came with:
* UAD-1 Channel Strip, which includes a Simple Reverb, Delay, EQ and Compressor all in one unit.
* 1176 SE Compressor (a much heralded compressor unit)
* RealVerb Pro Reverb
* Pultec Pro EQ unit (a classic and much lauded hardware unit)
* Nigel Guitar FX (strange, but suprisingly useful)
The package included a $100 voucher at the UAD store to buy more plugins. I wanted a graphical parametric EQ, so I spent that voucher on the Cambridge EQ unit (amazing).
I still have about $700 worth of plugins I want to get, including the 3 Precison mastering plugins, Fairchild 670 compressor and the Teletronix LA2A Limiting Amplifier, but the beauty of it is, I can get these as I need them, and they all work with the card.
Basically, if you need good quality VST FX, you can't really go wrong with the UAD series. I'm sure many on this board would agree. |
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| Agenz |
| quote: | Originally posted by Eric J
Basically, if you need good quality VST FX, you can't really go wrong with the UAD series. I'm sure many on this board would agree. |
I would Eric...I own 2 of these cards and must admit that they sound great.
I also run a Poco with the VSS3 stereo reverb and this stills sounds fantastic.
I'm sure that quite a few of us would love to own a Lexicon 81/91 but these 2 cards should not be overlooked as they produce fantastic results.
I'd go for the DSP card as I think it can offer more in the long run
;) |
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| camsr |
DSP cards are dinosaur-ific. You could just as well get UAD emulations to run on a dual core and still have processor to spare. But if they did that there wouldn't be a market for DSP cards now would there? :rolleyes:
Unless there is somekind of hardware coloration thing going on with UAD that I don't know about? |
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| Eric J |
| quote: | | You could just as well get UAD emulations to run on a dual core and still have processor to spare. But if they did that there wouldn't be a market for DSP cards now would there? |
I won't disagree with you, however 2 things come to mind:
1. UAD only makes plugins that run off of their DSP card.
2. For me, I like having the flexibility to just add more processing power by adding more cards. It saves me the trouble of upgrading my entire machine, which is much more expensive.
Offloading the FX processing to dedicated DSP processors is nothing new. The Pro Tools system has been doing that for years, which is why you can have a fairly low-spec machine and still run a Pro Tools HD system with very little problem. Hell, an old G4 with a sub 1GHz processor can run a fairly modern Pro Tools HD system because Pro Tools gets its power from dedicated outboard DSP processors. Need more power? Just add more DSP Processors. The Kyma system works this way as well.
I like this system because it gets me out of the business of upgrading to a new computer every few years and all the hassles that come with that. The system is scalable without being cumbersome.
I'm not saying that UAD-1 is for everyone, but for me they provide the power and quality I need at a reasonable price. |
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