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Traktor Questions - TICKS and GRIDDING
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| Azi |
according to the traktor dj studio 3 manual, after ive set my grid marker, i should enable the tick option to make the grid lines audible as ticks added to the track which should be audible on my headphones. i should then compare the timing of the ticks with the beats of the track being played on my speakers and so on...
the problem is, i cant hear ticks on my headphones...all i hear is music...whatever is playing on the main speakers, i hear on the headphones...no ticks though...and suggestions on how i can fix this problem? or what i might be doing wrong?
i currently use an external mixer...numark dm950
could the mixer be the problem?
secondly, as i go along the track, i notice that a minute or two down the track, the beat gridding is not accurate...its fine for the first minute or so, but then the BEAT MARKS or those big lines dont fall on the actual beat anymore...i tried adjusting them as tutorial suggested, by moving them so that those lines align with the beats, but if i fix one portion of the track, the other portion becomes inaccurate...any suggestions on how i can do perfect beat gridding?
or any link to other tutorials or resources would help...thank you!
cheers guys |
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| AnomalyConcept |
The CUE button for the deck has to be active in order to hear it in your headphones. However, since you're using an external mixer, the internal headphone/cue isn't assigned to an output (unless you have it set up), as the decks are outputting to different channels on your mixer.
The ticks weren't all that useful to me (and I only used them when drawing the grid), and you can just use the kick (or some other part of the beat) to do your beatmatching.
I would advise against relying on the clicks, since you only have them in Traktor. You should practice beatmatching, then turn them on to check, or glance at the 'drift-o-meter'. |
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| Azi |
so baiscally the best way to beatmatch is by using the buttons above the 'drift-o-meter' and nothing else?
if the answer is yes, i can't always get it right...i mean it will be fine for a few and then drift and then i haveto adjust again...is it normal to keep adjusting it over and over again during mixing?
if you have any other suggestions on how i can beat match please let me know. |
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| ponsshin |
I don't have an external mixer but I've been using Traktor for quite some time now so maybe I can help you.
With time, I learned that the "drift-o-meter" isn't always right and you shouldn't entirely trust your PC when mixing. Sometimes, it was so obvious that the "sync" button screwed up my whole mix.
The biggest drawbacks with grid points are:
1) you have to beatgrid pretty much all of the tracks you want to mix if you use the "sync" button.
2) "beatgridding" takes a lot of time because the tempo shown by Traktor is NEVER at a 100% correct. You basically hav to set 2 or 3 grid points per tracks to get something decent.
So if you want my advice: FORGET THE "SYNC" BUTTON AND BEATGRIDS.
Use the master/slave buttons so that your tracks are pretty much on the same tempo (never had a problem with that, the algorithms that Traktor uses to detect tempo through beat detection work very well)
Sometimes, a difference with the two tempos can be heard but it's VERY RARE. Only happened twice in 3 years.
Use the mouse wheel or the buttons above the "drift-o-meter" or hold left click on the "drift-o-meter" to actually beatmatch the 2 tracks. It may be tricky at first but you'll get the hang of it and plus, you'll get used to beatmatching when you get real turntables. Don't be surprised if you hear that the beats are matching while the "drift-o-meter" shows you it's not. Traktor is very good at calculating tempo but sucks at matching beats.
Now I got tired of the master/slave buttons, so I try to beatmatch using only standard cue points and pitch controls. No loops, no sync. Just my ears. It's hard at first, almost impossible sometimes but it sounds so much better in the end.
Conclusion: trust only in your ears!! The computer isn't always right. Last month, I went to Barcelona to see Armin and during the warm-up, some guy was mixing using timecoded vynils (therefore using a computer to beatmatch) and some transitions were so off-beat because he believed that his computer was always right.
Well, hopes this helps. |
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| david.michael |
| quote: |
Conclusion: trust only in your ears!! |
+1
I use Traktor, but I use them "just like turntables" in that I don't use grids or any other real "PC help" other than an maybe having it detect the tempo (which I still adjust often). I beatmatch with my ears, I cue with my ears, and I correct with my ears. I use Traktor mainly because it is economically and organizationally convenient to me.
I have a set of older CDJs but I'm finding myself not as interested in mixing on them as I thought I would be, just because of the convenience factor... and I find myself being more creative/open when I'm using the laptop simply because I have my entire music collection at my disposal... which, contrary to popular belief, makes me more spontaneous. |
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| AnomalyConcept |
The sync button only works if your tracks are gridded properly, or at least reasonably close.
One thing I did not like about using Traktor was the lack of a fader-type input for the pitch fader, say on a CDJ or a turntable. However, some CD players only have a +/- button for pitch control, with pitch bend buttons, which you can emulate by mapping keys to control the appropriate ones.
You should beatmatch with your ears. You can use the grid and drift meter to check your beatmatch, though. |
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| david.michael |
| I like to map my pitch-bend buttons to the pitch-bend wheel on my MIDI controller. Have to get used to being gentle with it though, or it will be very obvious that you're making corrections... especially if there is a melody/pad playing. |
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| Azi |
thanks for all your replies guys
i tried playing with the buttons above the drift-o-meter and i find that its kinda working...but i find myself constantly playing with those buttons to make sure the beats are matching...in order to make sure the beats are matching well, i haveto make sure my mouse is on those two buttons so i can quickly correct any off sets in the beats...and since one hand is occupied with the mouse trying to make sure the beats are matching, i find it difficult to use my mixer at the same time...is this normal that the beats keep messing up and i keep having to re adjust them like every few seconds?
what i usually do is match the bpm of both the tracks and then try and beat match...as suggested, i use only my ears and then hit whatever bvutton i need to above the drift-o-meter to adjust the beats...is this how its done? and is it normal to keep adjusting the beats through driftometer buttons every 3 seconds or so? |
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| tvmann |
Even if you use beat-gridded tracks they may require a quick initial manual adjustment to get the "phase" of the match sounding exactly right, due to the different types of drum beat sounds used in different tracks.
After that is done, if both tracks are beat-gridded they should stay beatmatched for several minutes (5 minutes, maybe as much as 10 minutes) without any more adjustments. If they need to be adjusted every 3 seconds there is probably a big error in the beatgridding and somehow you haven't got the BPM accurate enough (if you can get the BPM accurate to about .01 BPM the tracks should stay in sync for 5-10 minutes).
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Another possibility, if the beatgrids are OK, is that if you are monitoring the mix in headphones, you will be sensitive to much smaller mismatches than can be heard from the main speakers. The mix can actually have a fairly big beat mismatch in the 'phones that will be very noticeable to you and a big worry, but it might not be heard from the big speakers, depending on the actual event place/equipment. So you might be making adjustments every 3 seconds that really don't matter very much. |
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| Ryan0751 |
Well, to clarify... using timecoded vinyl, the computer doesn't beatmatch FOR you. The only reason the guy would be getting into trouble would be:
1. He was trying to beatmatch souly by looking at the waveforms on the screen, which is terribly inaccurate.
2. He wasn't very good :)
Ears win every time. Put the practice in, and you'll be able to beatmatch any two tracks ableton-tight in like 20 seconds.
| quote: | Originally posted by ponsshin
Last month, I went to Barcelona to see Armin and during the warm-up, some guy was mixing using timecoded vynils (therefore using a computer to beatmatch) and some transitions were so off-beat because he believed that his computer was always right.
Well, hopes this helps. |
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| Azi |
| well see if not using the beat gridding formuala nor the sync button...im just matching the bpms of both the tracks by just clicking on the sync button once. after ive unpressed the sync button, i try and beat match both tracks only by using my ears and the buttons above the driftometer...but in doing so, i can only get it to stay beatmatched for a tops 4 to 8 seconds! am i doing something wrong? |
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