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Hooking up an EFX1000 with a Xone:92
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| Neo Hacker |
This thread is not about how to hook it up, because I know there's another one, I just can't find it to reply to it. Anyway, here's how I hooked up my EFX to my Xone. If I remember correctly, it was Ryan's idea.
Xone's AUX1 -> EFX Inputs -> EFX Outputs -> Xone's Channel 4
It was Ryan's idea to use the Xone's crossfader as a wet/dry slider, but it's not working well on my setup. There's a noticeable delay between the Channel 2 (where my original sound is playing) and my Channel 4 (the EFX returns). I wasn't really sure what was making the problem, but when I slide from X (original sound) to Y (EFX), there's an echo like sound while I'm not at full X or full Y.
I don't know if you see what I mean. Of course, I knew there would be a delay between the original sound and the EFX returns, because the EFX processes. If I hit the bypass button on the EFX (or turn it off), there's no delay between the original and EFX.
I tried something. I switched to ON the Delay function on the EFX and then reduced the Effect Time to 1ms and put the Depth knob to Max, Character to Min and Mix to full EFX. It did the same sound as it does when I slide my crossfader on my Xone.
So my final thoughts are, the EFX doesn't process fast enought to use the Xone crossfader as a wet/dry control. Any of you did this setup without the latency effect ? It might be something in the EFX I missed or might be because I'm hooked up as RCA jacks and not 1/8" ? There might be some slow conversions for RCA that I'm not aware of...
For the moment I just use the Mix knob on the EFX as the wet/dry control, and switch fastly to Y when I want to use the EFX or stays at X if I wanna use the original sound. I don't see that method as a good one, but that's the best I could find so far.
So I'm waiting for comments and this topic could also be used for people who are looking how to hook up an EFX to a Xone (because this question comes back each month).
Thanks !
Neo :) |
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| Ryan0751 |
Thanks for the plug, but I must confess it's not my idea... I had read about it on the xone forums :)
I have an EFX-1000 on order. Now that I have the Rane, I really only have the option of throwing on the master.
Well it sounds to me like based on your testing you've eliminated the Xone 92 as the cause of the latency. As it's an analog device, there's essentially imperceptible latency.
So that means it's something in the EFX unit. I wouldn't imagine using the RCA inputs versus the 1/4" would make any difference...
The other odd thing is that for any mixer with a true "wet/dry" effects insert, it would be doing the exact same thing you are trying to do, fade between the dry and wet signals.
Does it sound odd with all the effects? You mention playing with the delay, which would obviously create a flanging/echo sound... |
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| Neo Hacker |
Yeah this is odd and I would not recommend it. You'll know what I mean when you get the EFX. It's a delay under 1ms, but enought to add a delay when you mix the original with the EFX unit. I might give a try to plug with 1/4 jacks and into the AUX Returns of the Xone. There might be something we're missing there. I just need to get the cables ;)
Well on a mixer with a true wet/dry control, there might be a difference. I guess that the control is for built-in (in the mixer) effects and not for an external device such as the EFX ? If so, then I'd say that the latency is much higher compared to a built-in unit because the built-in use the PCB itself of the mixer while the EFX uses cables and audio conversions (from RCA - 1/8 to EFX's PCB).
There might be nothing we can do to reduce that latency. I'll try the 1/8 cables and the AUX Returns channel, but other than that, I don't know what to do :(
| quote: | Originally posted by Ryan0751
Thanks for the plug, but I must confess it's not my idea... I had read about it on the xone forums :)
I have an EFX-1000 on order. Now that I have the Rane, I really only have the option of throwing on the master.
Well it sounds to me like based on your testing you've eliminated the Xone 92 as the cause of the latency. As it's an analog device, there's essentially imperceptible latency.
So that means it's something in the EFX unit. I wouldn't imagine using the RCA inputs versus the 1/4" would make any difference...
The other odd thing is that for any mixer with a true "wet/dry" effects insert, it would be doing the exact same thing you are trying to do, fade between the dry and wet signals.
Does it sound odd with all the effects? You mention playing with the delay, which would obviously create a flanging/echo sound... |
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| Ryan0751 |
Since electricity travels at just less than the speed of light, I don't think it's your cables...
| quote: | Originally posted by Neo Hacker
Yeah this is odd and I would not recommend it. You'll know what I mean when you get the EFX. It's a delay under 1ms, but enought to add a delay when you mix the original with the EFX unit. I might give a try to plug with 1/4 jacks and into the AUX Returns of the Xone. There might be something we're missing there. I just need to get the cables ;)
Well on a mixer with a true wet/dry control, there might be a difference. I guess that the control is for built-in (in the mixer) effects and not for an external device such as the EFX ? If so, then I'd say that the latency is much higher compared to a built-in unit because the built-in use the PCB itself of the mixer while the EFX uses cables and audio conversions (from RCA - 1/8 to EFX's PCB).
There might be nothing we can do to reduce that latency. I'll try the 1/8 cables and the AUX Returns channel, but other than that, I don't know what to do :( |
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| Neo Hacker |
Still,
there's a difference between a built-in device, directly on the PCB and an external device with cables. Not big, but in term of latency, there's a difference. And the EFX might do some conversions that a built-in device won't have to do since it's built-in. I'm not an electrician, but I think what I'm saying is not bad ;)
Because there's only this lag when the EFX is turned ON and not on bypass. So it has something to do in the EFX. When the EFX is on bypass, it does not go through the whole PCB of the EFX, so this is a direct connection...thinking about it, no the cables aren't a problem. So it's IN the PCB of the EFX. I guess I can't do anything.
Anyone from Pioneer to help me out ? lol
| quote: | Originally posted by Ryan0751
Since electricity travels at just less than the speed of light, I don't think it's your cables... |
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| Ryan0751 |
But when you disable the efx, you get zero noticeable latency. That kind of eliminates the mixer path as the culprit (I think).
| quote: | Originally posted by Neo Hacker
Still,
there's a difference between a built-in device, directly on the PCB and an external device with cables. Not big, but in term of latency, there's a difference. And the EFX might do some conversions that a built-in device won't have to do since it's built-in. I'm not an electrician, but I think what I'm saying is not bad ;)
Because there's only this lag when the EFX is turned ON and not on bypass. So it has something to do in the EFX. When the EFX is on bypass, it does not go through the whole PCB of the EFX, so this is a direct connection...thinking about it, no the cables aren't a problem. So it's IN the PCB of the EFX. I guess I can't do anything.
Anyone from Pioneer to help me out ? lol |
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| Neo Hacker |
Exactly, and it eliminates the cables. So only the EFX's PCB stills in the game.
I found this topic about the EFX on a Xone :
http://forums.pioneerdj.com/eve/for...04/m/6281031134
thejp, a user who seems to have a very good knowledge into Pioneer products, seems to be aware of this latency problem since he stated this :
| quote: | Originally posted by Ryan0751
But when you disable the efx, you get zero noticeable latency. That kind of eliminates the mixer path as the culprit (I think). |
| quote: | Originally posted by thejp on Pioneer's forums
So, how do you simplify this? Using the tip I was hinting at - use the crossfader...
set the left side (for example) on the xfader to the original channel and the right side to your efx-return channel (this is why it has to be a "normal" channel, the returns can't be assigned to the xfader)...
...set a linear, aka "x" curve, to the xfader (so that the transition is as smooth as possible) and when you want to use your effects, just turn the AUX knob on the channel you want to use to about mid way (12 o'clock - make sure you test this out prior to get optimum levels), and quickly cross the xfader ^_^ |
read the last : quickly cross the xfader... |
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