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You think Muslim fundamentalists are bad?! Check out the whackos in America!! (pg. 2)
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| George Smiley |
| quote: | Originally posted by LazFX
Well I am all about pointing out absurdities of all religions.. :tongue2 |
In that case, does it not strike you as incredibly frightening that you have a President who claims he hears voices in his head talking to him telling him what to do? Or even scarier, that those voices told him to take the nation to war and he did? Now I don't know much about what goes on inside America's borders, but if that's who you have running the country it must be an absolute nightmare to live in that kind of society! |
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| Moral Hazard |
| quote: | Originally posted by George Smiley
Secular does not mean not religious. It means a seperation of Chuch and State, something I suspect the current US regime are not entirely in favour of considering the funding of Christian schools and the promotion of creationism. |
Now, now, glass houses and stones my friend. It seems rather odd for a Brit to criticize the US for not seperating church and state... after-all your head of state (and mine) is titled "Defender of the Faith" and is the head of, not one but, two christian churches.
BTW, I don't disagree with you, I just wanted to point out that bit of irony. |
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| George Smiley |
| quote: | Originally posted by Moral Hazard
Now, now, glass houses and stones my friend. It seems rather odd for a Brit to criticize the US for not seperating church and state... after-all your head of state (and mine) is titled "Defender of the Faith" and is the head of, not one but, two christian churches.
BTW, I don't disagree with you, I just wanted to point out that bit of irony. |
But I'm not criticising the seperation of Church and State! Of course not!
(And my "head of state" is a purely symbolic and powerless position!) |
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| Moral Hazard |
| quote: | Originally posted by George Smiley
But I'm not criticising the seperation of Church and State! Of course not!
(And my "head of state" is a purely symbolic and powerless position!) |
You've criticising the US for failing to seperate church and state... all I'm pointing out is that the UK (and the commonwealth) also fail spectacularly in that regard. Symbolic or no, the head of state is the head of state... officially the crown is in charge of both your (and my) state and the church. |
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| George Smiley |
| quote: | Originally posted by Moral Hazard
You've criticising the US for failing to seperate church and state... all I'm pointing out is that the UK (and the commonwealth) also fail spectacularly in that regard. Symbolic or no, the head of state is the head of state... officially the crown is in charge of both your (and my) state and the church. |
I haven't criticised America for not being secular cos it clearly is secular!
But that doesn't mean they haven't elected a religious fundamenatlist to lead the country because they have!
And no, the Queen has no powers whatsoever and is purely symbolic, so there is no comparison to be made there... |
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| Lebezniatnikov |
| lol @ the first three responses proving the original post's point. Why is it not ok to paint all Christians as one and the same, but it is ok to paint all Muslims as such? And why is it ok to immediately see nuance in the religiosity of an American president, but not in the religiosity of a foreign head of state? |
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| Fir3start3r |
| quote: | Originally posted by George Smiley
Anyway, America has a religious fundamentalist as President - agree? |
America, from the beginning, was built on religious fundamentalism - agree? |
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| MisterOpus1 |
| quote: | Originally posted by Fir3start3r
America, from the beginning, was built on religious fundamentalism - agree? |
Strongly disagree. In fact some of the guiding forefathers went to great lengths to ensure religion was not part of our governmental infrastructure.
Not that I agree with everything George is saying, mind you, but I did want to address this minor point. |
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| Krypton |
George Washington seemed to be very religious...
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George Washington Fairwell Speech parapgraph 27
27 Of all the dispositions and habits, which lead to political prosperity, Religion and Morality are indispensable supports. In vain would that man claim the tribute of Patriotism, who should labor to subvert these great pillars of human happiness, these firmest props of the duties of Men and Citizens. The mere Politician, equally with the pious man, ought to respect and to cherish them. A volume could not trace all their connexions with private and public felicity. Let it simply be asked, Where is the security for property, for reputation, for life, if the sense of religious obligation desert the oaths, which are the instruments of investigation in Courts of Justice? And let us with caution indulge the supposition, that morality can be maintained without religion. Whatever may be conceded to the influence of refined education on minds of peculiar structure, reason and experience both forbid us to expect, that national morality can prevail in exclusion of religious principle.
28 It is substantially true, that virtue or morality is a necessary spring of popular government. The rule, indeed, extends with more or less force to every species of free government. Who, that is a sincere friend to it, can look with indifference upon attempts to shake the foundation of the fabric ?
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Neocons, please read what our real mission in the world is supposed to be... as George Washington saw it...;)
Fairwell Address
"32 In the execution of such a plan, nothing is more essential, than that permanent, inveterate antipathies against particular Nations, and passionate attachments for others, should be excluded; and that, in place of them, just and amicable feelings towards all should be cultivated. The Nation, which indulges towards another an habitual hatred, or an habitual fondness, is in some degree a slave. It is a slave to its animosity or to its affection, either of which is sufficient to lead it astray from its duty and its interest.
Antipathy in one nation against another disposes each more readily to offer insult and injury, to lay hold of slight causes of umbrage, and to be haughty and intractable, when accidental or trifling occasions of dispute occur. Hence frequent collisions, obstinate, envenomed, and bloody contests. The Nation, prompted by ill-will and resentment, sometimes impels to war the Government, contrary to the best calculations of policy. The Government sometimes participates in the national propensity, and adopts through passion what reason would reject; at other times, it makes the animosity of the nation subservient to projects of hostility instigated by pride, ambition, and other sinister and pernicious motives. The peace often, sometimes perhaps the liberty, of Nations has been the victim." |
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| Fir3start3r |
| quote: | Originally posted by MisterOpus1
Strongly disagree. In fact some of the guiding forefathers went to great lengths to ensure religion was not part of our governmental infrastructure.
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As true as that may be regarding the constitution, that still doesn't take away the fact many of them were. |
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| CHRles |
Fundamental Christians to that extent George Smiley points out can be counted to be at a few dozen at best.
Moslim fundamentalists make up parge percentages of certain countries.
As has been rightfully pointed out, religious extremist in the US or Europe, regardless of faith, are prosecuted. The same is not true for many countries in the developing world. |
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| Lebezniatnikov |
| quote: | Originally posted by CHRles
Fundamental Christians to that extent George Smiley points out can be counted to be at a few dozen at best.
Moslim fundamentalists make up parge percentages of certain countries.
As has been rightfully pointed out, religious extremist in the US or Europe, regardless of faith, are prosecuted. The same is not true for many countries in the developing world. |
Fundamentalist Islam is a lot less popular than NewsCorp would have you believe. And where is it most popular? Particularly places like Saudi Arabia and Egypt, and notably not Iran, Syria, or Iraq. |
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