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Building a new Studio computer. Need a sanity check.
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| Eric J |
OK, I'm looking at building a new machine for my main studio computer, and the research i have so far leads me to this:
This machine is going to be running Cubase 4 with a MOTU 24IO audio interface, Serial Unitor8 MIDI Interface, and a Glyph external drive.
- Intel Core 2 Quad Q6600 Kentsfield 2.4GHz 2 x 4MB L2 Cache LGA 775 Processor
4 cores should be enough.
- Crucial 2GB (2 x 1GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 800 (PC2 6400) Dual Channel Kit Desktop Memory
Only need 2 GB of ram at the moment, since I do not run a lot of software samplers.
- ASUS P5B Premium Vista Edition LGA 775 Intel P965 Express ATX Intel Motherboard
This is critical because it is the only motherboard that has the following:
A serial port for my Unitor 8 MIDI Interface (most newer MOBOs do not have a serial port)
1 PCIe slot for my PCIe UAD-1 card
2 PCI slots for my other UAD-1 Card and my MOTU-424 Audio interface card
Built in firewire port for my Glyph external drive.
- XFX PVT84JUDF3 GeForce 8600GT 256MB 128-bit GDDR3 PCI Express x16
Getting this for the dual DVI outputs.
- Western Digital Caviar SE WD1600AAJS 160GB 7200 RPM 8MB Cache SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard Drive
Dont need a large drive here, because its only going to be my system drive.
- Thermaltake TR2 W0070RUC ATX 430W Power Supply 115/230 V
Reviews on this said it was a quiet power supply
- Thermaltake Armor Series VA8003BWS Black Full Tower Case w/ 25CM Fan
Seems like a well-designed case with plenty of cooling and room for expansion. And its not Antec ;).
Anyone see anything here that is unnecessary or anything I am missing?
I figure this system should be good enough to last 3 or 4 years and have plenty of power. it is replacing a Dell Dimension 8400 with an old 3.2 Ghz Hyperthreaded Processor.
What do you all think? |
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| Allied Nations |
Honestly I'd put at least 200Gb on the main CPU...
Give yourself the freedom... logic 8 is like 80 gb....
maybe some sound proofing for your cpu case.. everything is just going to bounce right out of those windows... id skip the gimmicky cases.
i know you said you didnt like antec, but this sort of case would be a much better solution
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...N82E16811129154
also, dont just stop at hardware, make sure the whole package does what you need, check this out about soundproofing cpus...
http://www.frostytech.com/articleview.cfm?articleID=982 |
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| phantom limb |
| quote: | Originally posted by Eric J
OK, I'm looking at building a new machine for my main studio computer, and the research i have so far leads me to this:
This machine is going to be running Cubase 4 with a MOTU 24IO audio interface, Serial Unitor8 MIDI Interface, and a Glyph external drive.
- Intel Core 2 Quad Q6600 Kentsfield 2.4GHz 2 x 4MB L2 Cache LGA 775 Processor
4 cores should be enough.
- Crucial 2GB (2 x 1GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 800 (PC2 6400) Dual Channel Kit Desktop Memory
Only need 2 GB of ram at the moment, since I do not run a lot of software samplers.
- ASUS P5B Premium Vista Edition LGA 775 Intel P965 Express ATX Intel Motherboard
This is critical because it is the only motherboard that has the following:
A serial port for my Unitor 8 MIDI Interface (most newer MOBOs do not have a serial port)
1 PCIe slot for my PCIe UAD-1 card
2 PCI slots for my other UAD-1 Card and my MOTU-424 Audio interface card
Built in firewire port for my Glyph external drive.
- XFX PVT84JUDF3 GeForce 8600GT 256MB 128-bit GDDR3 PCI Express x16
Getting this for the dual DVI outputs.
- Western Digital Caviar SE WD1600AAJS 160GB 7200 RPM 8MB Cache SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard Drive
Dont need a large drive here, because its only going to be my system drive.
- Thermaltake TR2 W0070RUC ATX 430W Power Supply 115/230 V
Reviews on this said it was a quiet power supply
- Thermaltake Armor Series VA8003BWS Black Full Tower Case w/ 25CM Fan
Seems like a well-designed case with plenty of cooling and room for expansion. And its not Antec ;).
Anyone see anything here that is unnecessary or anything I am missing?
I figure this system should be good enough to last 3 or 4 years and have plenty of power. it is replacing a Dell Dimension 8400 with an old 3.2 Ghz Hyperthreaded Processor.
What do you all think? |
Sounds pretty solid to me; although, I might recommend anteing-up the memory on that machine. Since you are planning to use it for 3-4 years and most DAWs I'm familiar with are tremendous memory hogs--it might not hurt to do 4 Gigs of RAM. Plus, if you're running Vista and not XP, you might want to ante-up. Just a recommendation though--you clearly have a better comprehension of contructing a kick-ass system. Good luck on your future productions! |
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| Chronosis |
If you really need that serial port, then it's fine. Otherwise I would recommend an IP35 chipset -based mobo (Abit IP35 Pro for example). They came out this summer (vs. P965 last year) and have better support for upcoming hardware.
Great choice for a CPU. There are two models of the Q6600; older B3 and later G0, of which G0 produces less heat. |
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| Eric J |
| quote: | Originally posted by Allied Nations
Honestly I'd put at least 200Gb on the main CPU...
Give yourself the freedom... logic 8 is like 80 gb....
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I'm assuming you are referring to the Main Hard Disk, not the CPU? If so, then yes, I can probably get 250GB for not much more money, but I figure nothing is going on the system drive other than the OS, and the applications. I have the Glyph disk for all my audio and project files.
| quote: | Originally posted by Allied Nations
maybe some sound proofing for your cpu case.. everything is just going to bounce right out of those windows... id skip the gimmicky cases.
i know you said you didnt like antec, but this sort of case would be a much better solution
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...N82E16811129154
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Good Point, you're definitely right on that one, that case seems much better. I'm not really concerned with that it looks like, only how it works. It's not that I dont like Antec, I just have had problems with their cases in the past.
Excellent, thank you.
| quote: | Originally posted by phantom limb
Sounds pretty solid to me; although, I might recommend anteing-up the memory on that machine. Since you are planning to use it for 3-4 years and most DAWs I'm familiar with are tremendous memory hogs--it might not hurt to do 4 Gigs of RAM. Plus, if you're running Vista and not XP, you might want to ante-up. Just a recommendation though--you clearly have a better comprehension of contructing a kick-ass system. Good luck on your future productions! |
Yes This was definitely in the plans. The thing is that memory is an easy upgrade, so I figure I'll just sink my money into the "not-so-easy-to-upgrade" parts now and then i can add things like extra RAM or more disk as the need arises. Since I'm replacing a machine now that has 2GB, then I figure that this should do for a short time.
| quote: | Originally posted by Chronosis
If you really need that serial port, then it's fine.
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Well the decision for this is as such: I already have a perfectly good MIDI interface, although it is a bit old. I'd have to tack on an extra $300-$400 to this upgrade just to replace a perfectly good 8x8 MIDI interface with a comparable USB one. I could get a PCI Serial port card, but it seems silly to waste a PCI slot on something like that.
In addition most new interfaces are USB now and I remember reading somewhere that serial port activity receives a higher priority in the motherboard bus than USB activity PLUS I'm not sharing the serial bus with anything else where as with USB I'm sharing that bus bandwidth with all my other USB devices. That may be total BS or dated information, so do not take my word on that one. Granted, we're only talking about MIDI data here, so its not like it is a real bandwidth hog or anything, but it seems silly to replace a perfectly good interface.
| quote: | Originally posted by Chronosis
Otherwise I would recommend an IP35 chipset -based mobo (Abit IP35 Pro for example). They came out this summer (vs. P965 last year) and have better support for upcoming hardware.
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Can you expand on this a bit?
| quote: | Originally posted by Chronosis
Great choice for a CPU. There are two models of the Q6600; older B3 and later G0, of which G0 produces less heat. |
Thank you, I'll take that into consideration for sure. |
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| echosystm |
I wouldn't get a quad core. Windows XP doesn't handle quad cores too good as it is, but programs just aren't that well optimised yet either. A faster dual core is better IMO.
On the topic of a case and cooling, look into the Antec Solo. It has hard drive elastics etc. and comes with no PSU. Corsair HX520/640 are the quietest PSU on the market, so look into those too. Buy a Scythe Ninja CPU heatsink, but don't put the fan on the heatsink itself, put it on the CASE MOUNT below the PSU. This way you cool your CPU and have positive air pressure inside the case at the same time. Hence, that is the only fan needed inside your computer. |
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| RichieV |
| i think your choices are pretty good. PRetty much what everyone suggests on most forums |
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| farris |
| quote: | Originally posted by echosystm
I wouldn't get a quad core. Windows XP doesn't handle quad cores too good as it is, but programs just aren't that well optimised yet either. A faster dual core is better IMO. |
That's the first thing I thought of too, but maybe his option is more future-proof.
Seeing as he wants it to last approx. 3 to 4 years, chances are big that
Cubase might get the necessary updates for quad-core support (in the form of 4.x updates or Cubase 5)
and maybe, maybe Vista will get its act together and have support for it too. Just a thought though.
- farris |
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| Eric J |
| quote: | Originally posted by echosystm
I wouldn't get a quad core. Windows XP doesn't handle quad cores too good as it is, but programs just aren't that well optimised yet either. A faster dual core is better IMO.
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Interesting, this is the first I'm hearing of this. Can you expand on this a little? I'm not saying your wrong, I just want to make sure I'm not making a mistake. I'm working on Windows XP Professional and I know there a lots of people that are working on XP Pro with Cubase 4 on Quad Core with no problems (so they say). I'll do some more research on this before I commit.
I guess I can always go with an Intel E6850 Core 2 Duo @ 3.0 Ghz. Its the same price as the Q6600. SInce the E6850 is a 1333 FSB, will it still work if my MOBO is only 1066? WIll the processor shift down?
Since I'm not planninug going to Vista anytime soon, would it be better to look into getting a dual processor configuration with two dual-cores or is that going to be the same problem? |
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| echosystm |
| quote: | Originally posted by Eric J
dual processor configuration with two dual-cores or is that going to be the same problem? |
same problem :D
it's all to do with scheduling and splitting of processes into threads. vista has a redeveloped scheduling algorithm. xp (as far as i am aware) still uses the same methods as windows nt. i can't really provide empirical evidence for my next statement, but the general consensus is that the windows kernel doesnt have the depth of smp support or good scheduling of linux/freebsd/osx. number crunching has always been the number one priority of *nix kernels, hence why they have generally been crap for desktop use in the past.
the next part is how the actual program has been developed. splitting the workload between cpus is not an easy task. there are all kinds of synchronisation problems that make it near impossible for some to achieve it well, if at all. Also, this splitting process itself incurrs some overhead. the more cores you have to split things between, the more resources will be wasted on co-ordinating that. in other words, you would see higher relative cpu utilisation on a quad core than a dual core, for the same processing intensity.
since the whole multi-core movement has only just started, i'm convinced it will take a long time for existing programs to reach great efficiencies. the reason for this is that we're talking about the basic fundamentals of the program; the ammount of code that would need to be rewritten is enormous. some companies (eg. fl studio) probably won't ever have awesome multi-core support, because they just weren't designed for it in the first place. |
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| DJDIRTY |
Read this and you should get some idea regarding cpu performance and other interesting stuff Eric...
DAW BENCH
:) |
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| Eric J |
| quote: | Originally posted by DJDIRTY
Read this and you should be fine Eric...
DAW BENCH
:) |
Awesome, thanks. I knew you'd come through for me :)
According to the results on the above site, the Quad Core performance is more than double the performance of a similar Dual Core when the two processors are compared at the same clock speed. Without having any reference to how the host system is handling the thread scheduling, it seems that the Quad Core used with Nuendo/SX is miles ahead of a comparable Dual Core processor.
From the site:
"Where the New Intel Core2Duo architecture litterly ' hit the ball out of the park ', the new Quadcore chips have raised the Performance Bar to levels never experienced or even thought possible in a Single CPU environment."
What I take away from these numbers is that the Quad Core seems to be the way to go, especially in the Nuendo/Cubase environment.
echosystem - I'm not saying you are wrong, and I did find several people on forums that were basically echoing your sentiments. I acknowledge that it is a risk, but I feel a little better knowing it is an informed risk and that if it does not work out as I hope that I didnt go into it blindly.
However, I think I'm going to go ahead and take the plunge and get the Quad Core chip. I really do appreciate the advice from you.
I'll surely keep this forum updated with the results of this experiment. |
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