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The Congressional Record of Ron Paul (Or, Why He Is Batshit Crazy) (pg. 4)
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| Lebezniatnikov |
| quote: | Originally posted by Spirit5
Ron Paul just so happens to be both a politician and a doctor. |
NOTE: And not an economist.
I think I missed the memo that said making a career of looking at women's vajayjays, and then cozying up to anarchists and conspiracy theorists makes one qualified to be President. |
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| NeoPhono |
| quote: | Originally posted by Lebezniatnikov
NOTE: And not an economist.
I think I missed the memo that said making a career of looking at women's vajayjays, and then cozying up to anarchists and conspiracy theorists makes one qualified to be President. |
And a career politician, who makes a career out of women's vajayjays, cozying up to lobby groups and big money/corporations makes one qualified to be president? I'd go for intelligence and integrity long before I'd go with someone just because they've spent the entirety of their career in politics. Exactly how many trained economists have been president by the way? |
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| Krypton |
| quote: | For someone who rails against corporate interests in government, I "think the immediate answer is obvious. But let's look at the assertion. Lower taxes means increased purchasing power among consumers, which drives up demand. As demand increases, so do prices, and industries profit. So in reality, the consumers haven't really benefited; as Consumer Price Indexes go up, the corporations have. I take it that's fine with you. But for someone who hates inflation (I recall you calling it a "tax" itself, yes?), I would think you wouldn't want that.
And in addition, basic social services like healthcare, education, and investing in infrastructure will be cut if we lower taxes. But you won't feel that burden - the already disadvantaged will. |
Inflation caused by consumer demand is normal. Inflation caused by an increase in the money supply greater than the amount of goods and services isn't. Lower taxes stimulate the economy much better than infusions of billions of dollars into decrepit banks with bad lending practices.
As I've said before, government's sole responsibility is to protect the life, liberty, and property of its citizens, so the government, in my opinion has an obligation to ensure its citizens have adequate healthcare, and education. But these institutions should be private, because privately owned companies can do everything the government can do at HALF the cost. That's just the nature of the profit motive. Government can provide vouchers and assistance for people to seek out these services, no problem.
With the abolition of income taxes will come increased spending thus helping the economy advance. With a 20 something % tax rate on all goods and services sold, the more you buy, the more you pay in taxes, so the rich obviously will pay more. Add a stipend for all in the amount of the poverty level, the poor will actually benefit for RP's proposed reforms, if they ever happen.
I know RP is a long-shot, but my fall-back may be Mike Hukabee who seems to be a man of integrity, and who also supports the Fair Tax Reform...
EDIT: But on social issues, my fav mainstream candidate is Obama.. |
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| venomX |
| Good going deleting your thread Capitalizt! You sure are interested in debating and looking at ideas objectively. |
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| Halcyon+On+On |
| It's hardly a debate when everyone else's views are wrong. |
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| Lebezniatnikov |
| quote: | Originally posted by venomX
Good going deleting your thread Capitalizt! You sure are interested in debating and looking at ideas objectively. |
| quote: | Originally posted by spc
loooooooooool looks like the Ron Paul thread got removed because Lebez was owning that entire thread showing how much of an assclown Ron Paul is. |
| quote: | Originally posted by mezzir
hah!
i was just wondering where it went :haha: |
| quote: | Originally posted by jennypie
LOL!!!!!! |
| quote: | Originally posted by Lebezniatnikov
WHAT. THE. . :mad: :mad: :mad:
Who deleted it?! I spent so much goddamn time countering their points in that thread... there are no words to describe my disappointment in whoever deleted it.
There were some really funny posts in there too. :mad: :mad: :mad:
EDIT: I'm sorry, but since there was no reason for a mod to have closed the thread, much less deleted it, I can only conclude that Capitalizt closed his own thread, just proving how ing hypocritical he really is. His level of thinking is above "90% of the country" because he supports a complete nutjob, and everyone else is just a sheep incapable of independent thought? And yet he is the one censoring. Well goddamn, looks like our liberty to say what we want stop at making him look like a fool. Which is sad, because closing that thread makes him look like even more of a fool. He's truly shown that he is incapable of tolerating any opinion other than his own high and mighty one.
He starts a thread in support of a particular view, gets legitimate questions and counterpoints in response to said view, tries to deflect them with broad generalizations like "I'm for less government" and such, and then cuts and runs when the pressure gets too much for him. True intellectual courage people, right there.
Congratulations Capitalizt. Your bravery is duly noted. Coward. |
| quote: | Originally posted by mezzir
lol see if you can get a mod to save it for you, or maybe undelete it and keep it closed
cause yeah, i was liking that thread
finally some intelligent discourse in the cor, and it gets deleted :(
also, who can blame him, he's just rolling with the beliefs; he's acting as an individual, not relying on the government (mods) to help us. which, as fits in my analogy, makes him look like an idiot. |
| quote: | Originally posted by Halcyon+On+On
And people wonder why I am so cynical when it comes to those who preach things such as 'free thought'.
Politicians are all people as well - people with even more of an incentive to stem the flow of information regarding them, as they have a very large, lucrative agenda - no matter their political orientation. |
| quote: | Originally posted by Lebezniatnikov
Haha, nice quote edit.
I don't think it would piss me off nearly as much if it weren't so rank with hypocrisy. He used the "everyone else is just a sheep" defense, and then he so clearly went against the freedom of thought and exchange of information by censoring a thread just because he couldn't defend his views adequately against opposition. A real triumph of his cherished "freedom". This is why I think I inherently don't trust anybody who describes himself as a libertarian. Freedom only extends so far as it is profitable to themselves. |
| quote: | Originally posted by goodgreef
YOU can't handle the truth.. |
| quote: | Originally posted by mezzir
bringing philosophy into it? oh no you di'nt!
but yeah. hypocracy at its finest :( |
| quote: | Originally posted by Lebezniatnikov
Actually, the thing that REALLY pisses me off the most (I could create a list if you'd like) is that they bumped a Ron Paul thread in PDD where it's just the fanboys self-congratulating each other. Nobody has spent the effort in that thread to debunk every one of his whack-job positions, like in the thread that was deleted. So now whenever someone disagrees with them, they'll delete the thread, and a few more threads will pop up to pat each other on the back for being on the same team. Nobody has the energy to post the truth about Ron Paul in each of them, so any noob looking for a presidential candidate will now say "gee, everyone on TA loves Ron Paul, I guess I should vote for him because he's 'against taking my money and for America'"
It's like a ing cult. |
| quote: | Originally posted by mezzir
yeah...fixed :/
its the conclusion i've come to |
Just in case that thread gets deleted too, here it is again. For posterity's sake. |
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| Capitalizt |
haha..damn lez don't take it so personally. That is the chillout room, not the politics room. I posted it two days ago to promote Tea Party 2007. I did the same thing on several other forums I visit, and deleted them afterwards too. It was getting wildly off topic anyway, with 6+ pages off-topic silliness. Don't worry...I'll probably post an official "Ron Paul for President" thread over there in a few months once he gets the GOP nomination, so you can have plenty of fun until election day. ;)
Please stop getting so worked up over a "fringe" candidate. If his views are truly whacked out, then they will be soundly rejected by the American people next year. If he is going to lose anyway, why waste HOURS upon HOURS trying to bash poor Dr. Paul? What scares you so much about him? ABORTION is your main issue (from what I gathered). That being the case, so you should be MUCH more concerned about Mike Huckabee! The uber religious Baptist minister is now leading the polls in Iowa which holds the first primary next month...and he is nearly tied with Giuliani in several polls nationally. Not only would he like to see Roe V Wade overturned, but he wouldn't hesitate to sign a national ban on abortion and gay marriage (something Paul said he would not do).
Forget Ron Paul...Seriously man. Even if he were to be elected, we would have gridlock with Congress. They wouldn't pass his agenda...The IRS and FED are never going to be abolished. The best he could hope for is to restrain government growth down to the 1-2% range, and possibly close down some of the 800 military bases we have overseas.
It's not going to happen anyway right? This being the case, maybe you should do something productive with your time...Find a part time job in the real word perhaps? You should leave the comfortable halls of academe for a few minutes and see how your theories hold up on mainstreet. Stop working yourself into a tizzy over a candidate you think doesn't stand a chance. That's my advice. |
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| pkcRAISTLIN |
| quote: | Originally posted by Capitalizt
haha..damn lez don't take it so personally. That is the chillout room, not the politics room. I posted it two days ago to promote Tea Party 2007. I did the same thing on several other forums I visit, and deleted them afterwards too. It was getting wildly off topic anyway, with 6+ pages off-topic silliness. Don't worry...I'll probably post an official "Ron Paul for President" thread over there in a few months once he gets the GOP nomination, so you can have plenty of fun until election day. ;)
Please stop getting so worked up over a "fringe" candidate. If his views are truly whacked out, then they will be soundly rejected by the American people next year. If he is going to lose anyway, why waste HOURS upon HOURS trying to bash poor Dr. Paul? What scares you so much about him? ABORTION is your main issue (from what I gathered). That being the case, so you should be MUCH more concerned about Mike Huckabee! The uber religious Baptist minister is now leading the polls in Iowa which holds the first primary next month...and he is nearly tied with Giuliani in several polls nationally. Not only would he like to see Roe V Wade overturned, but he wouldn't hesitate to sign a national ban on abortion and gay marriage (something Paul said he would not do).
Forget Ron Paul...Seriously man. Even if he were to be elected, we would have gridlock with Congress. They wouldn't pass his agenda...The IRS and FED are never going to be abolished. The best he could hope for is to restrain government growth down to the 1-2% range, and possibly close down some of the 800 military bases we have overseas.
It's not going to happen anyway right? This being the case, maybe you should do something productive with your time...Find a part time job in the real word perhaps? You should leave the comfortable halls of academe for a few minutes and see how your theories hold up on mainstreet. Stop working yourself into a tizzy over a candidate you think doesn't stand a chance. That's my advice. |
its not "personal". its just irritating if someone does decide to contribute to your thread and you don't give many (if any) cogent replies. and then after all that you delete it. it was hardly off-topic, we were discussing paul's platforms and/or voting habits. i think that's a pretty salient discussion when you're trying to raise money for a candidate.
deleting a thread = poor form. and yes, lebkalashnikov was handing you your bottom ;) |
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| Q5echo |
its pretty clear he won't get the nomination.
the question then becomes aftrer all the effort and money raised on his behalf, will he be forced to run Independent?
if he doesn't, well, ! i see a pretty pissed off slice of the electorate in the near future.
the pressure he must be feeling. |
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| Capitalizt |
| Pk, I realized a few pages in that there really was no point trying to debate economics with lez considering we come from two different universes of thought. I let him spout his Keynesian "we need huge government watching over us" dogma without a response because I prefer not to waste time trying to convert people who have been brainwashed to believe that nonsense. Lez admires KUCINICH...the closest thing to a rabid socialist we have in congress. Amazingly he believes that Dennis follows the Constitution and that his views on the role of government that are closer to the founding founders than Ron Paul. That's all you need to know about him. :) |
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| Lebezniatnikov |
| quote: | Originally posted by Capitalizt
Pk, I realized a few pages in that there really was no point trying to debate economics with lez considering we come from two different universes of thought. I let him spout his Keynesian "we need huge government watching over us" dogma without a response because I prefer not to waste time trying to convert people who have been brainwashed to believe that nonsense. Lez admires KUCINICH...the closest thing to a rabid socialist we have in congress. Amazingly he believes that Dennis follows the Constitution and that his views on the role of government that are closer to the founding founders than Ron Paul. That's all you need to know about him. :) |
It's very clear that you didn't read any of my posts, much less formulate a response to any of them, considering A. I never advocated higher government spending (since when is the fiat exchange rate "Keynesian dogma"? and B. I certainly do not support Dennis Kucinich.
Believe me, my beef is not with Ron Paul. My beef is with blind automatons like you. Who close threads just because the people participating in them make you look silly.
EDIT: And C. Abortion? Seriously, that's all you got out of that thread? Because I seem to remember posting numerous reasons, and several articles from academics stomping on the stupidity of the gold standard, and maybe mentioning abortion twice when NeoPhono took the conversation there. But you're damn right on one thing - I would never even consider voting for a "libertarian" who thinks liberty stretches only so far as his personal religious beliefs. |
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| MisterOpus1 |
I'm sure it's been said numerous times before, but I can understand the appeal of Ron Paul. God knows people want change badly, and people get tired of the two-party -slinging at the same time. I get tired as hell of it too. Combine that with being worn out and sick of this war, and you've got a situation ripe for "change". Ron Paul fits that bill terrifically upon initial glance. And I will also add that on many instances (not all of them), he is a decent version of a constructionist. As Lebez has pointed out in detail, however, his libertarianism only carries him as far as he chooses to believe (and thus is not absolute by any stretch), but I think it's worth noting that in comparison to the other choices I do feel he carries that torch further than any other candidate.
But when you start peeling back the skin and start examining the layers of his philosophy, statements, and past votes, unfortunately the appeal starts to fade as we start to see contradiction with his rhetoric and rationale. I think he means well, and he certainly wants what's best for this country, but these problems with his philosophy and beliefs cannot merely be hand waved away as nonexistent or inconsequential as we swoon for the appeal to "change", appeal to stop the war, appeal to libertarianism as a guiding political philosophy and isolationism from the rest of the world. It just doesn't work.
So while I'm glad to tip my hat to Paul for a number of his stances as well as his terrific grassroot support, I also cannot ignore the "what the " moments that his past record and rhetoric have brought. |
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