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Somalia & the Islamic Courts Union
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| Krypton |
Unreported World - Somalia & the Islamic Courts Union
If you don't know much about recent Somali events, this video will help you understand. After over a decade of constant civil war, a group calling themselves the Islamic Courts Union gained prominence as a trustworthy authority for Somalis tired of corruption, warfare, and economic collapse. They took over the capital in 2006. They opened Mogadishu International Airport for the first time in over a decade. They reopened the Port of Mogadishu after a decade of closure. A legitamite court system began administering justice in civic AND criminal cases. They had massive support of the populace for bringing law and order back and actually doing something to restore the Somali country.
Unfortunately, foreign powers decided the party was over, and Ethiopia, along with US support destroyed what could have been a return from failed-state status for Somalia. Regime-change, as always is what really matters, not domestic self-determination.
Well, the map below is how it went down in 2006, with Ethiopia using superior forces to obliterate the ICU forces, and now today, is Mogadishu safer? I think the answer is a resounding HELL NO. It's stuff like this that really pisses me off with this neoconservatism bull that's hijacked US policy.
What domestic progress was destroyed in Somalia...
| quote: | On 6 June 2006 the ICU further claimed it was in control of all the lands up to 100 kilometers (62 miles) inland from Mogadishu. The warlords were reported to have either been captured or to have fled the city, abandoning most of their weapons, with the majority fleeing to Jowhar, which was taken by the ICU militia on 14 June. This brought ICU in control of much of the weaponry in the country, which made a resurgence by the warlords difficult without outside support. The ICU also controlled significant territory outside the capital, including the important town of Balad. In mid-August, ICU militiamen swept into the port town of Hobyo, 500 kilometers north of Mogadishu, meeting no opposition. The ICU organized a clean-up campaign for the streets of Mogadishu on 20 July. This was the first time litter and rubbish had been collected in the entire city since it collapsed into chaos over a decade earlier.
On July 15, 2006, the Islamic Courts reopened Mogadishu international airport, which had been closed since the withdrawal of the international forces in 1995. The first airplane chartered by the Arab League flew from the airport for the first time in 11 years picking up Islamic Courts delegates to the Sudanese capital of Khartoum.
On August 15, 2006, the ICU captured Haradhere, some 500km northeast of Mogadishu, which had become a safe haven for pirates, who had forced shipping firms and international organisations to pay large ransoms for the release of vessels and crews.
On August 25, 2006 the Islamic Courts reopened historic Mogadishu seaport, which was formerly one of the busiest in East Africa but had been shut down for 10 years.
On October 5, 2006 the Islamic Courts declared the formation of the supreme Islamic Sharia court of Banadir province, ending all tribal Islamic Courts in the capital. |
Law and order...gone.
Long-sought stability...gone.
Functioning civil services...gone.
And for what? Because they practiced sharia law? Regime change policy continues its destruction of third world self-determination...
Bush administration involvement...
| quote: | | Meanwhile, in the United States the Bush administration neither confirmed nor denied support for either side. However, it was reported that American officials had anonymously confirmed that the U.S. government was funding the ARPCT, due to concerns that the ICU is linked to al-Qaeda and is sheltering three al-Qaeda leaders involved in past terror attacks, including the 1998 U.S. Embassy bombings in Kenya and Tanzania. |
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| Krypton |
Anybody watch the video?
The Islamists are fighting back and slowly taking back what they won in 2006. I hope they win and destroy the useless corrupt puppet government which exists only because foreign troops occupy the country. Reminds me a lot of a couple other countries...
| quote: | Somali Islamists seize port as insurgency gains
NAIROBI, Kenya – An increasingly powerful Islamic insurgency is advancing toward Somalia's seaside capital, capturing town after town and seizing territory from the weak U.N.-backed government often without firing a shot.
But analysts say the hardline militants cannot achieve their ultimate goal of laying siege to Mogadishu, the capital, while powerful Ethiopian troops remain stationed in the once-beautiful city on the shore of the Indian Ocean.
Somalia's two-year insurgency has already killed thousands and will likely continue as fighters consolidate territory, undermining peace talks between more moderate opposition members and the government. The U.N. has tried to advance the talks, but a recent deal seems only to have worsened the violence.
Militants from Al-Shabab — which the U.S. considers a terrorist organization — have refused to take part in the peace talks, saying Ethiopians troops that support the government must leave first. The group aims to impose Shariah law on Somalia.
Somalia has not had a functioning government since 1991, when warlords overthrew a socialist dictator and turned their clan-based militias on each other. After decades of violence, half the population is expected to be dependent on aid by the end of the year.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20081112/ap_on_re_af/af_somalia
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| diesel_tron3000 |
they got another ship today. yeahh modern day pirates kick some ass and protect those fishing waters from greedy japanese fisherman who shouldn't fish there anyway
http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=80313
that's some that went unddddder the radar, i'm not even sure anyone knows what the real deal is |
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| Krypton |
| quote: | Originally posted by diesel_tron3000
they got another ship today. yeahh modern day pirates kick some ass and protect those fishing waters from greedy japanese fisherman who shouldn't fish there anyway
http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=80313
that's some that went unddddder the radar, i'm not even sure anyone knows what the real deal is |
What do you expect of a country whose "transitional federal government" can't even control it's own police force? No wonder the ICU is so popular. |
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| The17sss |
| quote: | Originally posted by Krypton
The Islamists are fighting back and slowly taking back what they won in 2006. I hope they win and destroy the useless corrupt puppet government which exists only because foreign troops occupy the country. |
Islamic Rage Boy approves!
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| Magnetonium |
I disagree that ICU provides "stability" and security ... they're a lot like Taliban to me. In particularly when it comes to human rights (women's rights), democracy, freedoms and all the fancy. They dont control the situation, they feud constantly, civil war is in full force, violence in Mogadishu is almost daily.
Previous socialist dictators were horrible, but now the situation is nowhere better.
Its hard to fight the radical Islamists, whether or not their case is good/bad or whether you support them or not. If you like Taliban, then ICU is down your valley. ICU can bring "stability" and "peace" to the country, but at what cost - and will they guarantee that the feuds will end? The country is made up of many clans and provinces which will be hard to control by force if ICU takes control, make no mistake about it. The pirates have been in full force ever since Socialist leader was toppled, and last time I checked, the Islamists could care less about the pirates ...
ICU is not going to make friends with Kenya or especially Ethiopia, who are bitter enemies. Perpetual war between ICU and Ethiopia will be in the books if ICU takes the upper hand in Somalia.
Ethiopia will never accept ICU ... |
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| Krypton |
| quote: | Originally posted by Magnetonium
I disagree that ICU provides "stability" and security ... they're a lot like Taliban to me. In particularly when it comes to human rights (women's rights), democracy, freedoms and all the fancy. They dont control the situation, they feud constantly, civil war is in full force, violence in Mogadishu is almost daily.
Previous socialist dictators were horrible, but now the situation is nowhere better.
Its hard to fight the radical Islamists, whether or not their case is good/bad or whether you support them or not. If you like Taliban, then ICU is down your valley. ICU can bring "stability" and "peace" to the country, but at what cost - and will they guarantee that the feuds will end? The country is made up of many clans and provinces which will be hard to control by force if ICU takes control, make no mistake about it. The pirates have been in full force ever since Socialist leader was toppled, and last time I checked, the Islamists could care less about the pirates ...
ICU is not going to make friends with Kenya or especially Ethiopia, who are bitter enemies. Perpetual war between ICU and Ethiopia will be in the books if ICU takes the upper hand in Somalia.
Ethiopia will never accept ICU ... |
Did you watch the video expose? |
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| Magnetonium |
| quote: | Originally posted by Krypton
Did you watch the video expose? |
Now I did. Surely there are some good points there. Surprising to find they are establishing some law and order in a non-oppressive way. But that was a guided tour, for sure - you won't get to see or understand everything unless you live there for a bit. One of the kids clearly said that things were better in the UK, LOL ....
But obviously extremists and Al-Qaeda are strong there. Islamic Courts, aka militant Islamic fighters have been accused of killing foreigners and aid workers. Plus I think that the group will pursue more Islamic/Wahhabist approach once it seizes control over the country. In the meantime they are playing a smart game of tolerance to groups and people who are not threatening them.
They dont appear to be extermists, but the way they proclaim jihad and bring their children to the front lines is scary.
But by all accounts it appears that ICU will provide better security and stability to Somalia than the American/Ethiopian backed forces. Its the fear of militant Islam, I suppose. Though warlords have failed to provide security and stability that ICU may be able to provide. |
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| Krypton |
| quote: | Originally posted by Magnetonium
Now I did. Surely there are some good points there. Surprising to find they are establishing some law and order in a non-oppressive way. But that was a guided tour, for sure - you won't get to see or understand everything unless you live there for a bit. One of the kids clearly said that things were better in the UK, LOL ....
But obviously extremists and Al-Qaeda are strong there. Islamic Courts, aka militant Islamic fighters have been accused of killing foreigners and aid workers. Plus I think that the group will pursue more Islamic/Wahhabist approach once it seizes control over the country. In the meantime they are playing a smart game of tolerance to groups and people who are not threatening them.
They dont appear to be extermists, but the way they proclaim jihad and bring their children to the front lines is scary.
But by all accounts it appears that ICU will provide better security and stability to Somalia than the American/Ethiopian backed forces. Its the fear of militant Islam, I suppose. Though warlords have failed to provide security and stability that ICU may be able to provide. |
What do you expect in a conflict zone? That foreigners are somehow going to be protected?:stongue:
Al-Qaeda is nothing more than a name. Do you actually think the ICU is a threat to your country? LOL...
What is the War on Terror? If not our own form of "jihad"... |
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| Magnetonium |
| quote: | Originally posted by Krypton
What do you expect in a conflict zone? That foreigners are somehow going to be protected?:stongue:
Al-Qaeda is nothing more than a name. Do you actually think the ICU is a threat to your country? LOL...
What is the War on Terror? If not our own form of "jihad"... |
Good points. I also agree that the whole Al Qaeda thing is just a label that politicians and even average people attach to any Muslims who preach anti-American agenda.
ICU is pretty harmless, I cant imagine them taking control over Africa or the region for that matter. I think the issue is about the whole Islamic sharia-centered system, which is considered to be a threat to the neighbours ... not all Somalis are associated with that branch of Islam anyway, and Somaliland and Puntland seem to enjoy their current semi-independent position.
I still dont want ICU to run the country. Of course any radical religious system will be better at controlling a country, whether its Islamic or else, but I dont think in the long run its a good thing for its people. I wont get into details about other reasons, I dont get into details about all my beliefs and things I support, if you know what I mean ;) I am quite a private person despite my participation on this forum - I'm far from the person like you imagine I am on the forums, once you get to know me - and you won't - not on the forums ;) |
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| Krypton |
| quote: | Originally posted by Magnetonium
Good points. I also agree that the whole Al Qaeda thing is just a label that politicians and even average people attach to any Muslims who preach anti-American agenda.
ICU is pretty harmless, I cant imagine them taking control over Africa or the region for that matter. I think the issue is about the whole Islamic sharia-centered system, which is considered to be a threat to the neighbours ... not all Somalis are associated with that branch of Islam anyway, and Somaliland and Puntland seem to enjoy their current semi-independent position.
I still dont want ICU to run the country. Of course any radical religious system will be better at controlling a country, whether its Islamic or else, but I dont think in the long run its a good thing for its people. I wont get into details about other reasons, I dont get into details about all my beliefs and things I support, if you know what I mean ;) I am quite a private person despite my participation on this forum - I'm far from the person like you imagine I am on the forums, once you get to know me - and you won't - not on the forums ;) |
I understand what YOU think. But what really matters is what THEY think. It's their country, you know. The ICU wouldn't be this strong if they didn't have popular support. We can always say democracy is always the best form of governance, but realistically, it's not for everyone, at all times, everywhere. Especially in Somalia. I'm for the self-determination of Somalis and it is obvious where their loyalties lie. It certainly isn't with the puppet regime from Baidoa. |
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| DrUg_Tit0 |
| It's basically a choice between the Talibans and anarchy. Neither is good, but I somehow resent Talibans a bit more. |
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