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Smells Like Socialist Spirit (pg. 2)
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| jerZ07002 |
| quote: | Originally posted by George Smiley
Because people born into money have an unfair advantage over those not born into money, even somebody like you can't possibly be pig headed enough to deny that?! Fairness means equal opportunities for all... |
what about people not born into money, but those who have become very succesful by working hard?
I agree that inherited wealth should be taxed heavily. I'm a little hesitant to agree that earned income should be taxed too heavily to re-distribute wealth. I agree though that basic human needs should be government funded (i.e., health care, education up to college, retirement benefits). However, I think that can be accomplished by reducing spending on other government programs (e.g., the huge 600 billion military budget). Taxing the out of inherited wealth would also go a long way. To escape that tax, people have the option to contribute the wealth to any domestic charity of their choice, save charities promoting religious education, or that person can just spend the money before they die. In that way, the government isn't making any choices for you. If you can't spend the money before you die, that is a sign that you have more money than you need. In that sense, the person is deciding for the government what is too much money. |
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| George Smiley |
| quote: | Originally posted by Shakka
So money is the scale by which we determine what defines fairness? What if I have more friends than you--is that unfair? What if I have a stronger sense of ethics and honor than you--is that unfair? Seems to me you just have a case of money envy. |
In our societies the amount of money available to you equals the amount of opportunities open to you. I don't agree that everyone should have the same amount of money, nor necessarily that they should have the same opportunities as everyone. What I do believe is that there are certain minimum services that should be available to everyone, no matter what their personal circumstances, to ensure that, through their own hard work, they can make the most out of their lives. That includes, amongst others, free eduction up to university, free health etc etc
| quote: | | Furthermore, where does it say that the role of government |
Where does "it" say the role of the government is anything?
And what the is "it" anyway? |
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| George Smiley |
| quote: | Originally posted by jerZ07002
what about people not born into money, but those who have become very succesful by working hard? |
What exactly have they got to worry about in life then? |
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| Kapedano |
George,
If you look at most of the successful people throughout the world, liberal or conservative, it is not because they had more money to pursue greater things, but because they had the working ethics and the passion for achieving a certain goal. Many people think that money fixes everything, but in fact, it destroys it if it is not used correctly. Giving a poor man more money doesn't help him, because in most cases, he is poor for the decisions that he constantly made throughout his life. The worst thing you can do for a poor man is give him money. |
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| Zild |
Hey so it is in there! Thanks. |
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| George Smiley |
| quote: | Originally posted by Kapedano
George,
If you look at most of the successful people throughout the world, liberal or conservative, it is not because they had more money to pursue greater things, but because they had the working ethics and the passion for achieving a certain goal. Many people think that money fixes everything, but in fact, it destroys it if it is not used correctly. Giving a poor man more money doesn't help him, because in most cases, he is poor for the decisions that he constantly made throughout his life. The worst thing you can do for a poor man is give him money. |
What a load of ing bollocks
That doesn't even deserve an answer |
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| jerZ07002 |
| quote: | Originally posted by George Smiley
What exactly have they got to worry about in life then? |
i'm just wondering how their wealth should be taxed. Should their wealth be subject to re-distribution? Like i said, i agree with you that we should re-distributing accumulated wealth. However, i hesitate to say we should re-distribute earned income more than the burden they should bear to support the minimum necessary government programs (i.e., health care, education, etc...). I guess my policy is that if you earn it, you should keep as much as possible, except to support the minimum level of government programs to ensure the basic human needs of all citizens. |
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| jerZ07002 |
| quote: | Originally posted by Zild
Hey so it is in there! Thanks. |
I wouldn't have a job if it wasn't. |
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| Kapedano |
| quote: | Originally posted by George Smiley
What a load of ing bollocks
That doesn't even deserve an answer |
This clearly shows your ignorance towards the subject of wealth and how you view the system of it. |
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| George Smiley |
| quote: | Originally posted by jerZ07002
i'm just wondering how their wealth should be taxed. Should their wealth be subject to re-distribution? Like i said, i agree with you that we should re-distributing accumulated wealth. However, i hesitate to say we should re-distribute earned income more than the burden they should bear to support the minimum necessary government programs (i.e., health care, education, etc...). I guess my policy is that if you earn it, you should keep as much as possible, except to support the minimum level of government programs to ensure the basic human needs of all citizens. |
How they should be taxed is equal to their wealth. If they have worked their socks off and become very well off, then they should pay more than those working on minimum wage. It is not called "redistribution" in any other country other than the one trying to convince the electorate that one candidate will turn America into the USSR! It is accepted in most countries as the fairest way to ensure the minimum essential government services you refer to above. The problem in America is that you DON'T have what most would consider the essential minimum services! Poor people in America get substandard health care (if any at all) and substandard levels of education. In my country, everyone is entitled to the same level of health care no matter that their wealth. All education has to adhere to minimum standards and must be available for free. Is Britain a Marxist (or even socialist) country? No. It's one of the most right wing economic countries is Europe! |
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| George Smiley |
| quote: | Originally posted by Kapedano
This clearly shows your ignorance towards the subject of wealth and how you view the system of it. |
No it shows my ignorance the drivel that just left your mouth |
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| Zild |
| Where did the myth that if you work your ass off you will become rich? Because I know a lot of low income families who work their ass off to barely scrape by, and I do think they could use a tax break and a few social programs like health care, school, etc... |
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