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illegal or Legal Termination? (pg. 2)
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View this Thread in Original format
| Joe Drust |
I assume this is a non-union environment. Most companies especially ones the size of Roots have handbooks with some sign offs on your orientation day. These sign offs are usually related to basic policies and procedures but all that I have come across include a section for willful misconduct. Typically items under this are related to stealing, theft, or creating a loss of revenue. There is usually a disclaimer that states that anyone who commits an act under this umbrella can and will be terminated without notice or pay in lieu of notice. People tend to read through these WAY to quickly when I orientate new associates.
Other issues do tend to follow a more strict 3 strikes and your out policy, and with those they need to be documented. A verbal warning is pretty much meaningless in the HR / PD world unfortunately. I do feel bad and awkward when I have to ask people to sign off on "verbal warnings" while explaining that it is not actually a write up, but rather an agreement that you were warned.
So those other "warnings" you got may really mean nothing even when brought up here unless they were documented and singed off on by you and your manager.
These days their is way too much sloppy progressive discipline... and it it always leads to confusion and situations like this. It seems pretty clear from your post that proper procedures were not followed at all. People too often think writing someone up means that they are getting fired, etc and it is not the case.. it is a tool to help both the employer and the employee.
Out of curiosity, were you written up for any of the early closings? And did you sign off on a notice of termination? Or did they just verbally "fire" you?
You really don't have any case worth pursuing due to the short length of employment there but you can have the peace of mind and the re-enforcement of what a ty job they have been doing there!
As a manager and an employee it is important to know the procedures for things like this as it can protect you and your job in the future. (Especially when you have ty bosses!)
End of rant/info/etc |
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| TheDemon |
| quote: | Originally posted by El K Dee
LOL |
what are you laughing at? |
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| TheDemon |
| quote: | Originally posted by Joe Drust
I assume this is a non-union environment. Most companies especially ones the size of Roots have handbooks with some sign offs on your orientation day. These sign offs are usually related to basic policies and procedures but all that I have come across include a section for willful misconduct. Typically items under this are related to stealing, theft, or creating a loss of revenue. There is usually a disclaimer that states that anyone who commits an act under this umbrella can and will be terminated without notice or pay in lieu of notice. People tend to read through these WAY to quickly when I orientate new associates.
Other issues do tend to follow a more strict 3 strikes and your out policy, and with those they need to be documented. A verbal warning is pretty much meaningless in the HR / PD world unfortunately. I do feel bad and awkward when I have to ask people to sign off on "verbal warnings" while explaining that it is not actually a write up, but rather an agreement that you were warned.
So those other "warnings" you got may really mean nothing even when brought up here unless they were documented and singed off on by you and your manager.
These days their is way too much sloppy progressive discipline... and it it always leads to confusion and situations like this. It seems pretty clear from your post that proper procedures were not followed at all. People too often think writing someone up means that they are getting fired, etc and it is not the case.. it is a tool to help both the employer and the employee.
Out of curiosity, were you written up for any of the early closings? And did you sign off on a notice of termination? Or did they just verbally "fire" you?
You really don't have any case worth pursuing due to the short length of employment there but you can have the peace of mind and the re-enforcement of what a ty job they have been doing there!
As a manager and an employee it is important to know the procedures for things like this as it can protect you and your job in the future. (Especially when you have ty bosses!)
End of rant/info/etc |
I still think he needs to do some research before it safe to say whether or not he has a case. |
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| Jayx1 |
| Closing the store early? Ive fired people for that several times in the past. There is NO justification for causing an owner to lose revenue like that. On the flip side, Ive had employees stay open an extra 10 minutes to accomodate a customer. They were usually the ones that got the fringe benefit bonuses such as free movie passes or various other incentives that teens and 20 somethings could appreciate and were always the first in line for a raise. |
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| VDub |
I ING HATE IT when ppl close a store early...
It's not about the staff...it's about the customer...and when I'm standing there 5 mins before close, and the door is locked with the staff staring at me...screw that store...
You sound like a very poor asst mngr... |
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| Cuzo |
| quote: | Originally posted by Joe Drust
I assume this is a non-union environment. Most companies especially ones the size of Roots have handbooks with some sign offs on your orientation day. These sign offs are usually related to basic policies and procedures but all that I have come across include a section for willful misconduct. Typically items under this are related to stealing, theft, or creating a loss of revenue. There is usually a disclaimer that states that anyone who commits an act under this umbrella can and will be terminated without notice or pay in lieu of notice. People tend to read through these WAY to quickly when I orientate new associates.
Other issues do tend to follow a more strict 3 strikes and your out policy, and with those they need to be documented. A verbal warning is pretty much meaningless in the HR / PD world unfortunately. I do feel bad and awkward when I have to ask people to sign off on "verbal warnings" while explaining that it is not actually a write up, but rather an agreement that you were warned.
So those other "warnings" you got may really mean nothing even when brought up here unless they were documented and singed off on by you and your manager.
These days their is way too much sloppy progressive discipline... and it it always leads to confusion and situations like this. It seems pretty clear from your post that proper procedures were not followed at all. People too often think writing someone up means that they are getting fired, etc and it is not the case.. it is a tool to help both the employer and the employee.
Out of curiosity, were you written up for any of the early closings? And did you sign off on a notice of termination? Or did they just verbally "fire" you?
You really don't have any case worth pursuing due to the short length of employment there but you can have the peace of mind and the re-enforcement of what a ty job they have been doing there!
As a manager and an employee it is important to know the procedures for things like this as it can protect you and your job in the future. (Especially when you have ty bosses!)
End of rant/info/etc |
YO JOE FTW! |
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| DigiNut |
Whether or not your actions were grounds for termination is not even the issue. Ontario labour law doesn't care about why you were terminated, it only guarantees you approximately 1 week of written notice or pay per year of employment upon termination.
If they fired you on the spot and refused to pay anything further, then you're entitled to 1 week of pay because you've been there more than 3 months. That's all you're going to get from the labour board. They will probably tell you that if you want to sue for wrongful dismissal, then you need to get yourself a lawyer, but you then forfeit your right to the aforementioned termination pay (it actually says this right in the ESA).
And while I am not a lawyer and can't say anything about your specific circumstances, I can tell you that wrongful dismissal suits are extremely rare here compared to the USA, and successful ones are almost nonexistent. There have been cases much more serious and complicated than yours (employment over 20 years + new ownership + twisted politics + termination based on false accusations of fraud etc. - this happened to a family friend) which have still gone nowhere in court.
Even if you won, chances are the legal fees would dwarf whatever wrongful dismissal penalties you could suck out of some retail job. Just find another job; you'll be better off in the end.
This business about warnings and notices - if your company has a 3-strike policy or some similar thing, then you could try taking your "case" higher up in the chain, but not to court. |
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| Silky Johnson |
| Has everyone really taken in all that this guy is saying though? Just look at all the ing drama in that post. People like him are the reason it sucks so bad to work in retail. |
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| El K Dee |
*scratches head*
Hey dustx, you mentioned you already had 2 notices/letters against you. were you hoping for a 3rd and then a termination on your 4th strike? Cos your 3rd strike IS your last. |
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| TheDemon |
| quote: | Originally posted by El K Dee
*scratches head*
Hey dustx, you mentioned you already had 2 notices/letters against you. were you hoping for a 3rd and then a termination on your 4th strike? Cos your 3rd strike IS your last. |
Honestly, the more i read his story, the more i am beginning to think something is missing. None of it adds up. Even i know you can't fire someone for 2 lates, especially if its family reasons. He could even be fired for reasons he's not aware of. |
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| VDub |
| quote: | Originally posted by Cuzo
YO JOE FTW! |
Dude he's from buffalo...
What the hell does he know??? |
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| VDub |
| quote: | Originally posted by El K Dee
*scratches head*
Hey dustx, you mentioned you already had 2 notices/letters against you. were you hoping for a 3rd and then a termination on your 4th strike? Cos your 3rd strike IS your last. |
Maybe he doesn't know baseball... |
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