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Actual Facism... Actually Happening (pg. 7)
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| Brahman |
| quote: | Originally posted by The17sss
isn't he already? dude is omnipresent. 263 speeches in 233 days, 122 public addresses on healthcare, and this weekend he'll be on all 5 Sunday morning shows doing more. He's on ESPN talking about basketball, Michelle is on the Food Network talking about recipes... we can't escape! The overexposure is making people start to tune out. |
Only to a Republican is that a bad thing. Question, does every government employee have to be confirmed by Congress? |
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| Lebezniatnikov |
| quote: | Originally posted by Brahman
Only to a Republican is that a bad thing. Question, does every government employee have to be confirmed by Congress? |
Seriously. Every time a Republican claims that not enough time was spent debating a bill before voting, I'll remember this argument. |
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| Brahman |
| quote: | Originally posted by Lebezniatnikov
Seriously. Every time a Republican claims that not enough time was spent debating a bill before voting, I'll remember this argument. |
God help the President when he is actually doing his job. |
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| MisterOpus1 |
| quote: | Originally posted by The17sss
As I've explained several times... I have only been posting on here for less than a year and a half. I was not around during all of the rampant bush denunciations that went on prior to that. However, I have said on many occasions and explained that I absolutely detested the direction Bush took the party, from about 2005 on. He abandoned the conservative principles he ran on, and incresed spending and government size beyond the acceptable pale... this is something I hated, and I still hate to this day, and have mentioned on here many times when people wrongly accuse me of being in lock step with Bush's policies, which seems to always be the default argument against me or other conservatives when we show dissent for Obama's decisions.
I am aware that Lebez has brought this to my attention... I just wonder, how many times am I going to have to reiterate my answer?
Lebez: go ahead and crack on 47 czars... that was a total over 8 years. Obama has 36 so far in 8 months, and I don't expect that number to decrease... plus when you compare it to his 15 or so cabinet appointees who actually have to show accountability and go through a confirmation process, it's a problem. Thank god we actually have some Democrats pushing back against this now too, like Rep. Dan Boren of Oklahoma and Robert Byrd (which is the last time I'll be in agreement with a former Klansman). |
I realize your position with Bush, but it's funny how you lambast Obama for such things along with your Conservative mouthpieces who call his policies "fascism" when I heard not a whisper from your mouthpieces about Bush's Czars. You really need to take a look at all of the czars Bush Jr. had - it's quite an impressive list:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...ve_branch_czars
So if you're going to accuse Obama of fascism, I fully expect you and the rest of your Conservative bretheren led by Limbaugh to fully acknowledge just how much fascism we had to put up with under a Republican Administration.
Something tells me, however, that such acknowledgement, at least from the likes of your de facto party leaders Limbaugh and Beck, won't be happening anytime soon. It's pathetic that the White House actually has to have a website that dispells such tripe:
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Take a look at the facts below – the truth about "czars":
Rhetoric: Critics have claimed the Obama Administration is filled with new and unchecked czars.
Glenn Beck Claimed There Were 32 "Czars" In The Obama Administration. "The Brainroom counts 32 czars in the Obama administration, based on media reports from reputable sources that have identified the official in question as a czar." [Glenn Beck Website, 8/21/09]
In Sunday’s Washington Post, Sen. Hutchison Claimed There Were An "Unprecedented 32 Czar Posts." "A few of them have formal titles, but most are simply known as "czars.’ They hold unknown levels of power over broad swaths of policy. Under the Obama administration, we have an unprecedented 32 czar posts (a few of which it has yet to fill), including a ‘car czar,’ a ‘pay czar’ and an ‘information czar.’" [Washington Post, 9/13/09]
Reality: Many of the arbitrarily labeled "czars" on Beck’s list are Senate-confirmed appointees or advisory roles carried over from previous administrations. Others are advisors to the President’s Cabinet Secretaries. Beck himself says on his own website, "Since czar isn't an official job title, the number is somewhat in the eye of the beholder."
Republicans have supported these positions in the past. When asked on Fox News if he had opposed any of President Bush’s "czars," Rep. Darrell Issa admitted "No we didn’t." In fact, the Bush administration had many of the same officials and advisors now described as "czars," including Afghanistan czar, AIDS czar, Drug czar, Faith-based czar, Intelligence czar, Mideast Peace Czar, Regulatory Czar, Science Czar, Sudan Czar, TARP/Bailout Czar, Terrorism Czar, and Weapons Czar.
Of the 32 "czars" on Beck’s list, nine were confirmed by the Senate:
Deputy Interior Secretary David J. Hayes ("California Water Czar")
Director of National Drug Control Policy Gil Kerlikowske ("Drug Czar")
OMB Deputy Director Jeff Zients ("Government Performance Czar")
Director of National Intelligence Adm. Dennis Blair ("Intelligence Czar")
OMB Administrator of the Office of Information and Regulatory Affairs Cass Sunstein ("Regulatory Czar")
Assistant to the President for Science and Technology and OSTP Director John Holdren ("Science Czar")
Treasury Assistant Secretary for Financial Stability Herb Allison ("TARP Czar")
Assistant Secretary of Defense for Acquisition, Technology and Logistics Ashton Carter ("Weapons Czar")
OSTP Associate Director Aneesh Chopra ("Technology Czar")
Many of the same critics who are decrying these roles have applauded or even pushed for them in the past. Sen. Robert Bennett has criticized czars as "undermining the Constitution," but reportedly prodded President Clinton to appoint a Y2K Czar. In a 1999 CNN appearance, Sen. Bennett said "I think John Koskinen has been superb. I wrote the president six months before John was appointed, recommending that he appoint a Y2K czar." At a 1999 National Press Club luncheon, Bennett told reporters the Koskinen was "there to help, prod, give information, and make analyses and reports" and said he spoke with the czar to ensure "we maintain the kind of bipartisan and across-the-government sort of communication that this never becomes a political issue."
Senator Lamar Alexander has also criticized President Obama’s "czars," calling them "an affront to the Constitution." But during remarks delivered on the Senate floor in 2003, Sen. Alexander said "I would welcome" President Bush’s "manufacturing job czar." That same day in the Senate, he also expressed support for President Bush’s AIDS czar Randall Tobias.
When asked on Fox News if he had opposed any of President Bush’s "czars," Rep. Darrell Issa responded "No we didn’t," despite previously claiming that czars "undermine" transparency and accountability.
In fact, last year, 176 House Republicans, including Issa, voted for a bill that would create an "Intellectual Property Enforcement Coordinator" that would advise the President and serve in the White House. By the time the bill passed the Senate, it was co-sponsored by 20 additional senators, including Sen. Alexander.
Anita Dunn is Director of Communications for the White House
http://www.whitehouse.gov/blog/The-Truth-About-Czars/ |
This falls completely in line with the double standard of your Republican party. It's perfectly alright for a Republican to hold so many czar positions, but get a Democrat in the Executive, then we all have to yell "HOLY " because he's going to be just like Hitler and take over our country!!!!! |
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| The17sss |
| quote: | Originally posted by MisterOpus1
You really need to take a look at all of the czars Bush Jr. had - it's quite an impressive list:
This falls completely in line with the double standard of your Republican party. It's perfectly alright for a Republican to hold so many czar positions, but get a Democrat in the Executive, then we all have to yell "HOLY " because he's going to be just like Hitler and take over our country!!!!! |
Saw this in the Washington Post. Are we both wrong? According to this list, under Bush, in 8 years only 5 were appointed as czars that did not require confirmation, and despite Obama's list of 36 by name and title I posted earlier in the video, it says he has 17 czars (which would still be 3 x as many as W in only 8 months).
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dy...ST2009091501436 |
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| pkcRAISTLIN |
Jesus, who gives a ?
Do you guys have anything of substance to whinge about? Because im getting seriously ing bored. |
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| Brahman |
| quote: | Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN
Jesus, who gives a ?
Do you guys have anything of substance to whinge about? Because im getting seriously ing bored. |
We have Hitlarx incarnated in the White House. |
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| Lebezniatnikov |
| Wait, so special envoys are czars now? Glad to know George Mitchell wields unlimited power in his conflict resolution attempts in the Middle East. Half the rest of them are staffers in the White House if you look at their actual title. God this topic is dumb. |
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| Clovis |
| Never have straws been grasped at, so hard. |
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| occrider |
| quote: | Originally posted by Lebezniatnikov
God this topic is dumb. |
Only because you're being short sighted. Rarely is it that we have such fine barometers of mental retardation. |
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| pkcRAISTLIN |
| quote: | Originally posted by Shakka
And PKC, I usually don't like to respond to you because I think it's a waste of breath, but I have to agree--your MO seems to be to call an argument stupid because it fails to meet your intellectually superior precise definitions of particular terminology, which is to sidestep the real debate, imho, which is that the U.S. government is slowly bleeding away more and more individual liberties under the guise of making the populace more secure. Until one day we wake up and we have forfeited our greatest gifts to the all powerful government. That's the slope I worry about. I don't think we're anywhere close to that, but I think we are dangerously close to starting to meander down that path. |
i missed this post. and i completely agree with you; not so much about it being a waste of breath (im always happy to consider a GOOD post), but that ridiculous rhetoric certainly detracts from the "real" debate by being alarmist, inaccurate and making horrible generalisations.
i have no problem with a "real" discussion on the role of government, im sure had the OP's quote been an attempt at one this thead would have been different.
if the terminology isn't right, then don't use it. especially not to enflame or senationalise the topic. |
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| Shakka |
Gotta love this video Drudge pointed out today. Frankly, I wouldn't really give a , but I particularly don't like the bit about "equal work for equal pay."
un-embeddable.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0aqMTD5UFmU
Lyrics
========
Mmm, mmm, mm!
Barack Hussein Obama
He said that all must lend a hand [?]
To make this country strong again
Mmm, mmm, mm!
Barack Hussein Obama
He said we must be clear today
Equal work means equal pay
Mmm, mmm, mm!
Barack Hussein Obama
He said that we must take a stand
To make sure everyone gets a chance
Mmm, mmm, mm!
Barack Hussein Obama
He said Red, Yellow, Black or White
All are equal in his sight
Mmm, mmm, mm!
Barack Hussein Obama
Yes
Mmm, mmm, mm!
Barack Hussein Obama
segue to
Hello, Mr. President we honor you today!
For all your great accomplishments, we all [do? doth??] say "hooray!"
Hooray Mr. President! You're number one!
The first Black American to lead this great na-TION!
Hooray, Mr. President something-something-some
A-something-something-something-some economy is number one again!
Hooray Mr. President, we're really proud of you!
And the same for all Americans [in?] the great Red White and Blue!
So something Mr. President we all just something-some,
So here's a hearty hip-hooray a-something-something-some!
Hip, hip hooray! (3x) |
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