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Remastering a digital release of a track made in the late 90's (pg. 2)
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| Existo22 |
Don't touch it. Unless you got real mastering equipment you will be ruining an already mastered track and making it sound like ass.
The key here is what is doing the volume pushing. The digital threshhold is zero db. Try to push it harder in the digital realm and you will be making it sound like ass. With a real compressor for example you can exceed zero db and get away with it. And you can really push a track with out making it sound like ass. But with software you are looking at 4-5 db gain reduction max before it starts sounding like hell and that is good software. And stay away from multiband limiters too. These can really really a track up. Finilizers ect are a big no no no. The cure is a lot worse then the disease. If all you want is a mix cd do it like the big boys do it. Import all your tracks into a single song and put them on different stereo tracks. Fix the timing. Ableton is easy for that but you can always use traktor. Draw your long fades and eqs changes filters ect. Then put a Waves L2 over the master and pull the fader down a LITTLE bit to give it some volume so the whole CD sounds a bit more consistent in volume. As you can understand the limiter will only work if A louder part kicks in by bringing up the softer tracks and evening the thing out a little bit. Your cealing should be -0.5 to -0.1 db. 0 can cause distortion in consumer cd players. Then bounce and export the whole 74 minute file and edit down the tracks so there is no gap when the new track starts. Burn the cd down send it to the duplication house. |
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| DjStephenWiley |
| quote: | Originally posted by Existo22
Don't touch it. Unless you got real mastering equipment you will be ruining an already mastered track and making it sound like ass.
The key here is what is doing the volume pushing. The digital threshhold is zero db. Try to push it harder in the digital realm and you will be making it sound like ass. With a real compressor for example you can exceed zero db and get away with it. And you can really push a track with out making it sound like ass. But with software you are looking at 4-5 db gain reduction max before it starts sounding like hell and that is good software. And stay away from multiband limiters too. These can really really a track up. Finilizers ect are a big no no no. The cure is a lot worse then the disease. If all you want is a mix cd do it like the big boys do it. Import all your tracks into a single song and put them on different stereo tracks. Fix the timing. Ableton is easy for that but you can always use traktor. Draw your long fades and eqs changes filters ect. Then put a Waves L2 over the master and pull the fader down a LITTLE bit to give it some volume so the whole CD sounds a bit more consistent in volume. As you can understand the limiter will only work if A louder part kicks in by bringing up the softer tracks and evening the thing out a little bit. Your cealing should be -0.5 to -0.1 db. 0 can cause distortion in consumer cd players. Then bounce and export the whole 74 minute file and edit down the tracks so there is no gap when the new track starts. Burn the cd down send it to the duplication house. |
I know how to make a mix, lol.
Thanks for your input/opinion. Will trust my ears and go with what I hear (or don't hear) - You may be right in that I am wasting my time but I'm going to try. And I am of course not going to be making the track available to anybody if I do any editing without talking to the original producer AND label first. |
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| Existo22 |
| quote: | Originally posted by DjStephenWiley
I know how to make a mix, lol.
Thanks for your input/opinion. Will trust my ears and go with what I hear (or don't hear) - You may be right in that I am wasting my time but I'm going to try. And I am of course not going to be making the track available to anybody if I do any editing without talking to the original producer AND label first. |
Just out of curiosity what are you planning to use to ''re-master'' the record? |
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| Existo22 |
| quote: | Originally posted by Existo22
Just out of curiosity what are you planning to use to ''re-master'' the record? |
Are you going to mix the record with the cdj-200s you got in your sig for extra authenticity and DJ street cred? |
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| Subtle |
| quote: | Originally posted by DjStephenWiley
It's for a release compilation. For what it's worth, it is "L-Vee - Look Inside (Fire & Ice Remix)" |
The thing with that kick is that the transient of the kick peaks in the middle of the kick, which gives it a kinda boomy sound.
I think you should use the track as it is. I doubt you can "fix" this with mastering. |
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| DjStephenWiley |
| quote: | Originally posted by Subtle
The thing with that kick is that the transient of the kick peaks in the middle of the kick, which gives it a kinda boomy sound.
I think you should use the track as it is. I doubt you can "fix" this with mastering. |
Mastering is a bad word here I think. I probably misspoke there. I'm not trying to re-master the track as a whole. I just want the kick to hit so it can "mesh" as much as possible with its predecessor and successor in the mix. To take it a step further, here is the 3 track sequence if it helps!
8. Cantus - Campfires At Dusk (Joost Glazenburg Remix)
9. L-Vee - Look Inside (Fire & Ice Remix)
10. Roy Hayumi - Sanative Way (Aurosonic Weekend Mix)
"Audio editing" would fit better here. I probably should have said I can easily get in contact with the producer at any time but the project file is not available, so there is obviously nothing he can do to help me except give the best advice as possible to the best of his ability. I'm going to do this, but I figured others might have done this before, and would have some words of wisdom. Or others would chime in with their opinions, which is what has happened so far. I appreciate everybodies input. Obviously some differing opinions and suggestions which is good. |
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| Ry Thomas |
| I think editing a mastered track will do more harm than good tbh |
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| kitphillips |
| quote: | Originally posted by Existo22
Don't touch it. Unless you got real mastering equipment you will be ruining an already mastered track and making it sound like ass.
The key here is what is doing the volume pushing. The digital threshhold is zero db. Try to push it harder in the digital realm and you will be making it sound like ass. With a real compressor for example you can exceed zero db and get away with it. And you can really push a track with out making it sound like ass. But with software you are looking at 4-5 db gain reduction max before it starts sounding like hell and that is good software. And stay away from multiband limiters too. These can really really a track up. Finilizers ect are a big no no no. |
You truly reveal your mental deficits more with each passing day. |
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| Existo22 |
| quote: | Originally posted by kitphillips
You truly reveal your mental deficits more with each passing day. |
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| DJ RANN |
Stephen, I would try layering another kick over it, but make sure it's completely EQ to be within a tight band (i.e. if it's just more "click" that you want out of the kick the bandpass it and leave the rest out etc.).
The problem you're going to have is getting it sit perfectlyand I would suggest using two things:
1, A multiband comp to take the levels down ever so slightly of each band (so you're not going above 0dbfs when adding the kick) and this will also give you the option although somewhat limited to rebalance the bands.
2, A simple, subtle compressor over the output from the multiband and combine the kick - I'm basically suggesting a glue compressor so they sit together.
The main thing is to be incredibly surgical with EQ (sharp rolloffs, paramtric in nature and equally subtle with compression.
Remeber if you're having trouble layer a new kick on top of the old one, try to EQ out the old one as much as possible, so it's a replacement rather than a extra - this does avoid phasing and frequency clashes.
It's not prefect and could be more trouble that it's worth but I've done it with decent results in the past when I've found tracks I love that just don't have the right drive in terms of the kick.
Hope this helps. |
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| Existo22 |
Just leave it alone ;)
Hope this helps. |
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| Ry Thomas |
| quote: | Originally posted by DJ RANN
Stephen, I would try layering another kick over it, but make sure it's completely EQ to be within a tight band (i.e. if it's just more "click" that you want out of the kick the bandpass it and leave the rest out etc.).
The problem you're going to have is getting it sit perfectlyand I would suggest using two things:
1, A multiband comp to take the levels down ever so slightly of each band (so you're not going above 0dbfs when adding the kick) and this will also give you the option although somewhat limited to rebalance the bands.
2, A simple, subtle compressor over the output from the multiband and combine the kick - I'm basically suggesting a glue compressor so they sit together.
The main thing is to be incredibly surgical with EQ (sharp rolloffs, paramtric in nature and equally subtle with compression.
Remeber if you're having trouble layer a new kick on top of the old one, try to EQ out the old one as much as possible, so it's a replacement rather than a extra - this does avoid phasing and frequency clashes.
It's not prefect and could be more trouble that it's worth but I've done it with decent results in the past when I've found tracks I love that just don't have the right drive in terms of the kick.
Hope this helps. |
Surprised you replied with a reply like that Tom, i thought you'd say to forget the task altogether somehow.
If you think ahead to the mastering, which will inevitably need to be done, you're gonna master a file which has already been mastered, basically the quiet parts are gonna be lifted(AGAIN), this may end up one very noisy mix, just my thoughts and something to think about, not a rant at all |
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