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WIP - Could use some ears
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| cryophonik |
I hate posting snippets of my work before it's done, but I'm having trouble hearing this clearly after far too many listens and could use an extra set of ears and some technical input. The problem I'm having is with the interplay between the sidechained pad and the plucks at the beginning of the following track:
http://soundcloud.com/cryophonik/wip-taking-me-on
To me, they sound perfectly in time when they play along with the drums (e.g., at 0:31 and during the chorus), but they sound out of time to me at the intro (i.e., 0:00-0:30). I was up until 3:30 this morning trying to get them in time and I'm starting to wonder if it's all in my mind listening to it too many times. Any thoughts or suggestions appreciated. Also, this is very much a work in progress and I know it has a long way to go, so I'm not asking for advice on the song, arrangement, mix, etc. - I'm just interested in getting the timing right on these two sounds so I can move on. Thanks!
BTW - I'm only going to leave the track snippet up for a few hours. |
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| Kysora |
| Hmm, it's saying it's not available. Did you already take it down? |
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| cryophonik |
| quote: | Originally posted by Kysora
Hmm, it's saying it's not available. Did you already take it down? |
No - it's still up. It's set for public viewing as well, so there shouldn't be a problem. Maybe you have to be logged in?
edit: oops, I guess it was set to private. I could've sworn I checked the public checkbox, but I guess not. It's public now. |
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| tehlord |
The plucks are slightly off beat and mildy triplet(ised), which works with the reinforcement of a 4/4 kick but is 'difficult' to resolve without that foundation drumbeat.
Perhaps a slight 1/8 hat or shaker in the intro would help. |
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| cryophonik |
| quote: | Originally posted by tehlord
triplet(ised)
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Good word! :p OK, so I'm not just losing my mind then? That's good to know!
| quote: | Originally posted by tehlord
Perhaps a slight 1/8 hat or shaker in the intro would help. |
Good suggestion - I'll give that one a try. I tried keeping a little bit of heavily filtered kick drum in there at one point to anchor it, but it really ruined the minimalist intro I'm looking for. I even tried carrying the 16th-note shaker patter through the intro, but it was too much. But, an 8th-note pattern just may do the trick. |
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| Subtle |
| Nice track, overall i do feel the plucks doesnt have to be there at all. |
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| Kysora |
Yeah, I hear that too... I don't think it's as much of a problem as listening to it over and over might make it seem to you, but I think it's because if you played those plucks on their own, the pattern would sound like beat 1 is different than where it rests played in the context of the track. If that makes sense...
I know the rhythm of it changes throughout but it sounds like the main rhythm of the plucks is this:
1 2 3 4 1 2 3 4 1 2 3 4 1 2 3 4
x - x x x - x - - x x - x - x -
I know that's not the actual rhythm, it's syncopated a 16th note off from that, but on its own without the backing beat I'm just getting a natural tendency to hear the rhythm in that pattern instead, which is making the backing pad sound like it's a 16th note off.
I don't really know what you could do to fix that.. I hope this made sense. In a shorter way to explain it, people establish a different beat to syncopated rhythms when they're played without a backing beat, and the background pad behind it isn't strong enough to replace that.
..yeah, this is hard to explain, haha, does this make any sense?
edit:
| quote: | Originally posted by tehlord
The plucks are slightly off beat and mildy triplet(ised), which works with the reinforcement of a 4/4 kick but is 'difficult' to resolve without that foundation drumbeat. |
Well that's a much easier way of saying it, haha.. yeah it just lacks the foundation of a rhythm, +1 for 8th note shakers |
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| Owsey2008 |
Soothing synths. I think the plucks sound fine. The vocals are pretty sweet!
Edit: Guess I didn't read things properly - they do sound a little out of time, but it's still quite a nice effect. |
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| tehlord |
LOL @ Kysora.
I've never been one to waste words :cool:
Another idea might be to cut a vocal syllable out of the main vocals and use that as a percussive 8th note instead. It'll blend a bit better and won't sound so forced.
Or it'll sound . That's the frustration and wonder of musical creativity. |
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| Kysora |
I really just think quiet 8th note shakers or hi-hats would do the trick, they don't have to draw any attention to themselves at all.
I should probably also mention that it's nothing terribly noticeable, I personally like it when I hear a melody as having one rhythm and the beat makes it sound like something different, it's a pretty neat effect. And in this case I probably wouldn't have even noticed, since the plucks take a back seat to the vocals when the beat comes in anyway. |
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| cryophonik |
| quote: | Originally posted by Kysora
I know that's not the actual rhythm, it's syncopated a 16th note off from that, but on its own without the backing beat I'm just getting a natural tendency to hear the rhythm in that pattern instead, which is making the backing pad sound like it's a 16th note off.
..yeah, this is hard to explain, haha, does this make any sense?
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Yeah, actually that does make sense! I'll definitely try some of the suggestions here, including tehlord's vocal idea, which sounds like an intriguing idea. Thanks guys! |
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| TranceLover007 |
| quote: | Originally posted by tehlord
The plucks are slightly off beat and mildy triplet(ised), which works with the reinforcement of a 4/4 kick but is 'difficult' to resolve without that foundation drumbeat.
Perhaps a slight 1/8 hat or shaker in the intro would help. |
Sorry guys I'm little bit late on this thread and looks like you covered this subject very well. +1 for Geoff, this is spot on observation (couldn't agree more with him) and all those suggestion above should help you resolved this issue.
Btw - lovely track Dave and this vocal is sweet and very worm, nice work.
Cheers |
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