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Who's more innovative at edm, Europeans or N Americans?
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| Richard Butler |
Further to cryophoniks thread on the forum perhaps running low on new discussions, I thought I'd try this one.
The thought police may move it to another section, but then no one will bother with it.
I think it's a valid topic and fun. A little inflamitory but c'mon guys we're grown ups and can handle it surely.
Feel free to diuscuss Aussies versus Nepalese if you think the scope is too narrow.
I include Canadians in with Americans.
Have fun:D |
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| tehlord |
Europeans obviously.
Although the yanks do innovate better sandwiches imo. |
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| Seandroid |
Canadians.
Duh.
:p
Really though, probably Europeans, if not only because dance music is way more popular over there. |
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| MrJiveBoJingles |
These days, probably Europeans. Think about genres:
House and techno were born in 1980s America.
Trance, gabber, drum and bass, dubstep were born in 1990s / 2000s Europe. |
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| -FSP- |
North Americans invent it, Europeans push it to it's limit, and North Americans ruin what the Europeans have done.
I mean, have you guys heard American dubstep? It's all wobble wobble and "mosh pitty" for lack of a better word. The British sound is just better imo. How about when North American hipsters gentrify house music with their rock vocals and rock aesthetics? I think the only thing North America's got over the rest of the world is the soulful "American" sounding house music (like Chicago influenced stuff).
Have you guys heard American dance-rap's combo of auto-tune and the "euro" preset lead? That's just awful. I'm pretty sure the whole continent of Europe ditched that preset long ago in 1999--2001 at the latest.
Look, I respect what those scenes do as craftsmen, but I just don't feel the music most of my countrymen make.
Basically, Americans never have liked dance music. We hated disco. We like superstars. Disco had none, and EDM is sort of a faceless and lyricless genre built around ELECTRONICS and SAMPLING and the DJs are the faces. According to us, using technology is cheating and we should make music the old fashioned way with pots and pans, and there is nothing spectacular about a jukebox. We never had a chance to innovate, society was against this music. Cops still raid legitimate clubs FFS and "raves" (who the hell uses that term these days? Only dinosaurs and media people do. and they use it to refer to festivials) are like scape goats here!
I feel that post-disco dance music has never been as big as it has been in the states. Americans like hip hop, and rock music. We like dubstep because it reminds us of hip hop and mosh pits or something. We like hipster-house because the indie scene was rock based. In America those sounds are edgy and underground, but I follow what the continent of Europe does because that's what's current. What's Wunderground, fresh, and edgy in America today is what's played out and old in Europe.
I really don't see the British sound (kode9, burial etc) being a hit with Americans as a whole even though I think that stuff is way better than the wobble bro-step we like. I'm not going to complain though, that wobble stuff is gateway stuff.
I personally think Americans should make new genres, and then have Bristol make it better.
TLDR VERSION: America makes it, Europe pushes it to it's limit. Americans think it's cool after decades of hatred to like the European sounds, only to be left 5 years behind.
What's edgy in the USA isn't edgy and innovative in Europe. This wobble stuff is totally new, fresh, and innovative to us. That stuff seems to be obnoxoius, old, and "doofy/clowny" to folks in the continent. Electro house and dubstep are edgy to us Americans, but that was so 5-7 years ago. That said, we are catching up with what's happening in the continent. |
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| MrJiveBoJingles |
Americans don't invent much of anything anymore, as far as dance music. Well, I guess a few trends on the poppy side of things.
Autotune everywhere? Yeah, that was us. :stongue: |
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| Richard Butler |
| quote: | Originally posted by -FSP-
North Americans invent it, Europeans push it to it's limit, and North Americans ruin what the Europeans have done.
I mean, have you guys heard American dubstep? It's all wobble wobble and "mosh pitty" for lack of a better word. The British sound is just better imo. How about when North American hipsters gentrify house music with their rock vocals and rock aesthetics? I think the only thing North America's got over the rest of the world is the soulful "American" sounding house music (like Chicago influenced stuff).
Have you guys heard American dance-rap's combo of auto-tune and the "euro" preset lead? That's just awful. I'm pretty sure the whole continent of Europe ditched that preset long ago in 1999--2001 at the latest.
Look, I respect what those scenes do as craftsmen, but I just don't feel the music most of my countrymen make.
Basically, Americans never have liked dance music. We hated disco. We like superstars. Disco had none, and EDM is sort of a faceless and lyricless genre built around ELECTRONICS and SAMPLING and the DJs are the faces. According to us, using technology is cheating and we should make music the old fashioned way with pots and pans, and there is nothing spectacular about a jukebox. We never had a chance to innovate, society was against this music. Cops still raid legitimate clubs FFS and "raves" (who the hell uses that term these days? Only dinosaurs and media people do. and they use it to refer to festivials) are like scape goats here!
I feel that post-disco dance music has never been as big as it has been in the states. Americans like hip hop, and rock music. We like dubstep because it reminds us of hip hop and mosh pits or something. We like hipster-house because the indie scene was rock based. In America those sounds are edgy and underground, but I follow what the continent of Europe does because that's what's current. What's Wunderground, fresh, and edgy in America today is what's played out and old in Europe.
I really don't see the British sound (kode9, burial etc) being a hit with Americans as a whole even though I think that stuff is way better than the wobble bro-step we like. I'm not going to complain though, that wobble stuff is gateway stuff.
I personally think Americans should make new genres, and then have Bristol make it better.
TLDR VERSION: America makes it, Europe pushes it to it's limit. Americans think it's cool after decades of hatred to like the European sounds, only to be left 5 years behind.
What's edgy in the USA isn't edgy and innovative in Europe. This wobble stuff is totally new, fresh, and innovative to us. That stuff seems to be obnoxoius, old, and "doofy/clowny" to folks in the continent. Electro house and dubstep are edgy to us Americans, but that was so 5-7 years ago. That said, we are catching up with what's happening in the continent. |
Post of the month goes to FSP, very entertaining mate.
America makes the best synths at the mo, with with Moog, SE and Dave Smith. The Japanese for me have really lost the plot the last few years.
In terms of music, I put some Deep Chicago house on recently and people were saying that it was nice to hear 'real' dance music for a change.
The rythmic deep vibe in that style of American house is absolutely peerless.
Deadmau5 and plenty of other 'Amercians' (from my side of the pond your'e all Americans - oooops) are fine innovators. |
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| Richard Butler |
| quote: | Originally posted by MrJiveBoJingles
Americans don't invent much of anything anymore, as far as dance music. Well, I guess a few trends on the poppy side of things.
Autotune everywhere? Yeah, that was us. :stongue: |
You lead the world in bio science which will bring about immense societal changes.
Apple, Iphones, aircraft, all the leading web companies like facebook and google.
I do not buy into this whole argument that the Chinese will usurp you - it will not happen as they are no where near as inventive. Sure they can bolt st1t together but where are the myspaces and apples out of China? |
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| MrJiveBoJingles |
| quote: | Originally posted by Richard Butler
You lead the world in bio science which will bring about immense societal changes.
Apple, Iphones, aircraft, all the leading web companies like facebook and google. |
| quote: | Originally posted by MrJiveBoJingles
Americans don't invent much of anything anymore, as far as dance music. |
Now that your misreading has been cleared up, we can get back on topic. |
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| Richard Butler |
| quote: | Originally posted by MrJiveBoJingles
Now that your misreading has been cleared up, we can get back on topic. |
I'm a cyclops, the single eye is an issue. |
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| cryophonik |
Well, I listen to less trance than anybody on this forum, so take my input with a grain of salt, but I agree with MrJBJ that you have to break it down a little further to get at the core. When I think of hard-hitting, clubby dance I music, I think of Europe. You guys seem to have the driving, grinding, pulsing thing mastered and we Americans are just followers. But, when I think of music with soul/groove, it's all America, baby - and I mean North, Central, and South America. I'm racking my brain this morning to think of a European house producer that I admire and I'm coming up empty - I'm sure there are some, but it's primarily our domain - maybe another pot of coffee will help.
| quote: | Originally posted by Richard Butler
America makes the best synths at the mo, with with Moog, SE and Dave Smith.
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IDK - the Germans still make the Virus and the Waldorf Q+. ;)
EDIT: sorry for the OT tangent, but Chris from DSI has been hinting at a new DSI synth for a few months now and in a response to a thread on GS regarding NAMM 2011 yesterday he said "Hmm... 8 voice Mopho would be boring... we got something much more fun than that for ya'll". |
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| Raphie |
EDM europeans make it, americans RUIN it
hip hop / R&B > Americans OWN it, europeans FAKE it. |
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