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Sound Design
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| Zlaught |
Hi guys,
I am very new to producing trance music however I would like to try and create my own sounds instead of using (I'm not sure the correct technical word so sorry if I'm wrong here) presets/patches created by other people.
I currently have a access virus and logic pro9. With the "initial a-127" basic sounding patch that comes in it, is this enough to create any sound I want as long as I know the correct ways to alter it? Or do I need a basic drum, a basic guitar, a basic bass etc and then alter those into the drum, guitar, or bass sound I'm looking for?
Also I've been watching all the youtube programming synthesizer videos I can find, but there doesn't seem to be very many that start from scratch; most seem to use a preset and work from there which is not what I'm looking for. Do you guy's know of any good sites that can help to teach me to create sounds from scratch?
Thanks for your input and help,
Zlaught |
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| Zombie0729 |
do you have something against presets? Loads of people use presets, there's nothing wrong with it.
http://www.axwell.co.uk/forum/axwel...s-t151s150.html
That said, sound design does create identity so do spend time learning your synth, grab a book and learn everything you can but don't be turned off by presets, they are there, just like samples to be used in any context you want. |
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| Zlaught |
A preset would be one of the sounds that come already pre-programmed on my virus correct? Before involving presets in my music, I think it would be very important to know how to design my own sounds so I can have the freedom to create whatever sound I am looking for.
Would you happen to know the answer to the following questions?
1. With the Init patch or preset(which is the correct term for the most basic sound?), is it possible to create any sound(kicks/guitars/strings etc...) as long as I know how to use my synthesizer to its full abilities?
2. What book's would you recommend me to pick up to further my understanding of synthesizer sound design. I would much rather prefer recommended sites but perhaps quality sites for this do not exist?
Thanks for your help, it's very much appreciated
Zlaught |
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| EddieZilker |
| quote: | Originally posted by Zlaught
A preset would be one of the sounds that come already pre-programmed on my virus correct? Before involving presets in my music, I think it would be very important to know how to design my own sounds so I can have the freedom to create whatever sound I am looking for.
Would you happen to know the answer to the following questions?
1. With the Init patch or preset(which is the correct term for the most basic sound?), is it possible to create any sound(kicks/guitars/strings etc...) as long as I know how to use my synthesizer to its full abilities?
2. What book's would you recommend me to pick up to further my understanding of synthesizer sound design. I would much rather prefer recommended sites but perhaps quality sites for this do not exist?
Thanks for your help, it's very much appreciated
Zlaught |
To the unnumbered question: It's rumored that Alan Wilder of Depeche Mode used to purposefully erase the user presets on any new synth that came in so he could start from scratch. While the ethos is admirable, I've found it useful to find presets that match the sound I'm looking for, in terms of learning how to design sounds, myself. Seeing the configuration of how a functional sound is designed can lead to a lot of insight about how they're made from scratch. Learning how sounds are designed is also revealed more fully when you tweak a preset from a less desirable sound into one that's more suited to your tune.
1) That depends on the synth and a guitar sound played on a synthesizer will nearly always sound like a guitar sound played on a synthesizer. Kicks fit a little more neatly within the purview of synthesis, particularly if you're going for a synthetic kick sound.
2) Computer Music Tutorial. I misplaced my 10 year-old copy but it had a ton of useful information in it. |
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| 112268 |
read the manual to the virus and to logic.
youtube some tutorials.
try and error.
after 10 years of this youre a pro. |
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| Zlaught |
Thanks for you insight, you make a very good point with finding a preset I like and dissecting it to see how it was made.
As for your answers to my questions
"That depends on the synth and a guitar sound played on a synthesizer will nearly always sound like a guitar sound played on a synthesizer."
I'm using a access virus ti2
I'm looking to create a synth type guitar sound
1)Perhaps I phrased the question wrong, I was wondering if it was possible to create a guitar like sound IE: Orjan Nilsen - La Guitarra from starting with the Init patch or if it's possible to create a bassline or strings with this init patch.
2)Computer Music Tutorial by Curtis Roads, is this the book your recommending? Just want to double check since computer music tutorial sounds very generic and I don't want to pick up the wrong thing.
3)Are there any other books you would recommend or sites with useful tutorials? I have a ton of free time and plan on plowing through this book very fast.
Thanks a lot for your help EddiZilker,
Zlaught
112268 It sounds a lot to me like you haven't read the virus manual or youtubed synth programming from scratch, theres not exactly that much info out there... |
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| 112268 |
| i know the virus manual suck (atleast on virus C) but still its worth going through. youtube videos should be plenty of general synth programming, not virus spesific. its mostly the same on all VA-synths. but to tell you the truth you learn most by just turning knobs and press buttons and listen to whats happening. |
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| EddieZilker |
I'm not familiar with Virus but the short answer to your question is, yes. Essentially, there's usually two or more guys who do only sound-design for the synth manufacturer, plus whatever third-party developers want to get their hands on it, and while they might develop precursor sounds to form into something down the line, every sound on there is fabricated, through one route or another, from the initialization patch.
Although it's kind of a fanciful notion, there's not really any esoteric hard-wiring to some hidden proprietary cache of wave-forms, oscillators, or routing configurations. The sounds are put there, predominantly for one purpose - to sell the synth.
To the beginner, it sounds like gold and to the amateur/semi-pro/professional good sound design, while often musically irrelevant, show-case what the synth is capable of. While, more often in the olden days before USB, some designers may have been provided with sound-design software that made navigating the incessant trees of 2X50 character screens easier, now that stuff can be part of the package you get for any hardware synth at the store.
DJ RANN, Cryophonik and Eric J also know a lot about this stuff, too, so if I'm wrong or not providing enough detail, they should feel free to fill in the gaps.
EDIT:
2) That's the book. Kind of complex and detailed on an aspergian level, but I found it quite useful. |
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| Fledz |
| quote: | Originally posted by EddieZilker
To the unnumbered question: It's rumored that Alan Wilder of Depeche Mode used to purposefully erase the user presets on any new synth that came in so he could start from scratch. While the ethos is admirable, I've found it useful to find presets that match the sound I'm looking for, in terms of learning how to design sounds, myself. Seeing the configuration of how a functional sound is designed can lead to a lot of insight about how they're made from scratch. Learning how sounds are designed is also revealed more fully when you tweak a preset from a less desirable sound into one that's more suited to your tune.
1) That depends on the synth and a guitar sound played on a synthesizer will nearly always sound like a guitar sound played on a synthesizer. Kicks fit a little more neatly within the purview of synthesis, particularly if you're going for a synthetic kick sound.
2) Computer Music Tutorial. I misplaced my 10 year-old copy but it had a ton of useful information in it. |
Yea absolutely. Pick a random knob and see what it does. Rinse and repeat.
CM Tuts are great. |
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| Zlaught |
| quote: | Originally posted by 112268
i know the virus manual suck (atleast on virus C) but still its worth going through. youtube videos should be plenty of general synth programming, not virus spesific. its mostly the same on all VA-synths. but to tell you the truth you learn most by just turning knobs and press buttons and listen to whats happening. |
The virus manual sucks for the TI2 also. I went through it, there's not much to it. There are plenty of general synth programming tutorials on youtube, however 95%+ of these videos are using a preset and working from there, not starting with a Init sound. Which is A) Not what I'm looking for and B)Not very useful in creating something from scratch. I was able to find maybe 5-8 tutorials that started from scratch, they were extremely helpful but I need more than just these few to achieve what I want. Although I am and have been watching the tutorial videos that start with some sort of preset anyways, since there is still obviously stuff to learn from them.
EDIT: Thanks for your help everyone it's very useful to me, Does anyone have another book to recommend to me or a site with tutorials
on creating sounds from scratch?
EDIT2: "DJ RANN, Cryophonik and Eric J also know a lot about this stuff, too, so if I'm wrong or not providing enough detail, they should feel free to fill in the gaps."
It'd be awesome if some other knowledgeable people could give me some of their thoughts and insights on anything related to sound design. I would very much appreciate it.
EDIT3: After looking at The Music Computer Tutorial on amazon, I found some other books that I may also want to purchase
I am already going to get The Music Computer Tutorial, but what are your guy's thoughts on these
1)Computer Music: Synthesis, Composition, and Performance BY:
Charles Dodge
2)Musimathics, Volume 1: The Mathematical Foundations of Music BY: Gareth Loy
3)Musimathics, Volume 2: The Mathematical Foundations of Music BY: Gareth Loy
4)Designing Sound BY:
Andy Farnell |
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| Beatflux |
| Doesn't the TI have 1000's of sounds? |
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| Zlaught |
| quote: | Originally posted by Beatflux
Doesn't the TI have 1000's of sounds? |
yep |
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