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Chris Ogden - In Unison - Full on Trancer
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| creamrocker |
Hi there all. This is my first post on here so please be gentle.
Please check out my latest track: 'In Unison'. This is my first production using proper studio monitor speakers (as you'll see if you listen to any of my older productions, the quality of this one if far better than my older stuff), my older stuff was produced via studio headphones.
Still, I'm far from the finished article so would appreciate some constructive feedback if you guys don't mind. Please check out the link below:
Chris Ogden - In Unison (Original Mix) |
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| Avatar One |
Hi mate,
This is very confusing, the quality of In Unison is much worse than your other tracks, which sound pretty good really. It's like listening to a track through a tiny tinny speaker. Have you got a sub-woofer hooked up to your setup now? That could be fooling you into thinking you've got alot more bass than you actually have. In Unison sounds really anaemic, to say the least :/
Mike |
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| creamrocker |
Really?!!
I have recently purchased some Alesis M1 520 monitor speakers and this sounds much fuller through them as it does on most other systems I've referenced it on. Now I am confused.
Thanks for letting me know though, I'll investigate later when I'm home. |
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| Richard Butler |
Had this on in background while I'm at work - yes the first thing that jumps out at me is that rolling bass really sticks out. I think it could use a lot more side chain pump and also it's a bit static - perhaps add a subbtle slow phaser or even put some of the notes on a different synth - so like halve play out of one synth and halve out of another and then apply automation to phaze / filter / eq and so on to get the bass moving.
I like the subdued peaceful breaks where it all falls away. The arp melo comming through is nice. I like the melodies here - they meld the atmosphere well.
I used to feedback to you over on Anjuna I think (I was Bubbletoe there.
Now into the drop and yep it really is not pumping and does sound a bit tinny mate - arggggggggg don't you just love this mixing lark! |
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| creamrocker |
Hi Rich, yeah I do remember you from over at Anjuna. I really do appreciate the feedback but I'm just wondering where I'm going wrong.
I read a review on these Alesis speakers and it did mention that they could lean a little towards the bassy side to make up for their lack of size. I noticed when I rendered the first draft of this track that it was definitely not powerful enough on the bass end when played via any other system so I altered the bass settings on the speakers. This seemed to give a more accurate reflection of what I had heard back on the other systems and therefore I felt that any changes I made after that would also reflect in the render.
I must admit that I am getting a bit disheartened now and am really unsure as to what to do next. Unless my ears are just garbage it certainly doesn't seem to sound tinny to me. On the other hand I know that there clearly is a problem otherwise you guys wouldn't have said so.
What can I do to fix this? It was a problem on some of my older productions too. The bass settings I have adjusted on my speakers means there is a HP rolloff at about 100Hz. Is this something I shouldn't have done?
Any tips on how to remedy this would be most gratefully received!!
Thanks again for taking the time to listen. |
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| Avatar One |
| quote: | Originally posted by creamrocker
Hi Rich, yeah I do remember you from over at Anjuna. I really do appreciate the feedback but I'm just wondering where I'm going wrong.
I read a review on these Alesis speakers and it did mention that they could lean a little towards the bassy side to make up for their lack of size. I noticed when I rendered the first draft of this track that it was definitely not powerful enough on the bass end when played via any other system so I altered the bass settings on the speakers. This seemed to give a more accurate reflection of what I had heard back on the other systems and therefore I felt that any changes I made after that would also reflect in the render.
I must admit that I am getting a bit disheartened now and am really unsure as to what to do next. Unless my ears are just garbage it certainly doesn't seem to sound tinny to me. On the other hand I know that there clearly is a problem otherwise you guys wouldn't have said so.
What can I do to fix this? It was a problem on some of my older productions too. The bass settings I have adjusted on my speakers means there is a HP rolloff at about 100Hz. Is this something I shouldn't have done?
Any tips on how to remedy this would be most gratefully received!!
Thanks again for taking the time to listen. |
It's an odd one for sure, don't get disheartened, it can take a while to get this sort of thing right. I was referencing your SoundCloud link:
http://soundcloud.com/creamrocker/chris-ogden-in-unison
against a clip of my latest track on SoundCloud:
http://soundcloud.com/avatarone/ava...ceti-early-work
There's quite a big difference in terms of power. I definitely WOULD NOT roll off at 100hz, that's way too high. I roll off my bass below 20hz, which is inaudible. 100hz will make a big difference, and is almost certainly the main problem here - you've lost your entire low end by doing that. |
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| creamrocker |
Thanks for that. The reason I rolled off my bass settings (on my speakers) was to ensure that any bass power that did come through would have more power when rendered. I will try and fiddle with the speaker settings again tonight when I'm home.
I will also reference against your track and see if I can make some noticeable changes to mine.
Difficult for me not to get a bit gutted though. I was convinced I had the mix nailed on for this (at least in comparison to my older stuff).
Thanks again. I'll add you on Soundcloud too if that's ok. |
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| Avatar One |
| quote: | Originally posted by creamrocker
Thanks for that. The reason I rolled off my bass settings (on my speakers) was to ensure that any bass power that did come through would have more power when rendered. I will try and fiddle with the speaker settings again tonight when I'm home.
I will also reference against your track and see if I can make some noticeable changes to mine.
Difficult for me not to get a bit gutted though. I was convinced I had the mix nailed on for this (at least in comparison to my older stuff).
Thanks again. I'll add you on Soundcloud too if that's ok. |
No worries mate. Getting disheartened is par for the course I'm afraid, I've been there many times!
You want to make sure that your monitors are as flat as possible, that is the only way to mix, I wouldn't try to roll off the bass on your speakers with a view to guessing how it will render, it's impossible IMO.
Below is a frequency analysis of your track and mine (the line above the bars is what you want to concentrate on). In your track, anything below 100hz is peaking at -36db, in mine, you can see the kick drum peaking at around 0db at 50hz, your kick drum doesn't even appear to be present below 100hz! In your track, anything below 50hz peaks at around -63db, you have no sub-bass at all.
Hope that helps a bit :)
Mike
post image |
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| creamrocker |
| Thanks a lot for that mate, it should be really helpful. |
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| Richard Butler |
Yeah Chris don't get down - mind you I do all the time so I guess it's part n parcel.
Avatars bass suggestions will be a big help but you still need to listen to your mids and highs as there is a clashing / hi metal boxy tendancy going on. The hatz are comming through kinda harsh - I don't think EQ will be the whole answer hear - I think perhaps you want to consider different sounds by listening to all the mids and highs togther and finding ways to get them to stop fighting one another - in the main drop is where they are really fighting.
It's missing some mid warmth. I think some of your other tracks sound a lot better.
I know just nhow you feel as I find myself in this position often, but I know of only one remedy;
Take a break from this track and do not listen to it even once for a couple of weeks, then import a pro track you think has the sort of mix you are after and sit down fresh and you will be able to see things clearly.
Funnily enough I have a mix porblem with a track Ive 'finnished' but am now in that stage of letting it rest in the oven for a couple of weeks, so honestly dont get down, it's a real labour of love and like any worthwhile art it will be as much about passionate quick inspiration as it will be about some hard annoying graft. Well thats what I tell meself! |
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| creamrocker |
thanks again chaps. you're right about just leaving it for a bit. I think a couple of weeks off it like you say and then perhaps have another mess around with it.
Any recommendations for a decent spectral analyser by the way? The spectroman one in FL is cack for a relative noob such as myself.
Cheers again. |
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