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Weekend reading: Bob Sillerman's new EDM empire
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| cl0wnz0r |
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A lot has been said on ticket prices going up over the last couple of years for festivals, but surely if the man behind Live Nation has a say in it, you ain't seen nothin' yet.
From a pure business perspective, Sillerman is coming in at the right time and will make a killing on merging all the major promoting companies in the next couple of years. However, I think there is a diminishing returns aspect to his investment that he hasn't fully discounted. |
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| SebG |
| Oh great, another Monopoly. |
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| AY STAR |
| quote: | Originally posted by SebG
Oh great, another Monopoly. |
pretty much
let's just hope they dont buy out blk market and other underground promoters |
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| cl0wnz0r |
| quote: | Originally posted by AY STAR
pretty much
let's just hope they dont buy out blk market and other underground promoters |
I think he's more after the Insomniac and Made types as the bottom tier. Considering he is most comfortable with high margin generating events (to follow the way he started the original Live Nation), he will probably be going after the large, rock music setup events. Sort of like he did with Global Gathering and booking unrelated acts. Sensation US is a cash cow for him. Rinse and repeat. |
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| AY STAR |
| quote: | Originally posted by cl0wnz0r
I think he's more after the Insomniac and Made types as the bottom tier. Considering he is most comfortable with high margin generating events (to follow the way he started the original Live Nation), he will probably be going after the large, rock music setup events. Sort of like he did with Global Gathering and booking unrelated acts. Sensation US is a cash cow for him. Rinse and repeat. |
yea i see what you mean, if thats the case then GOOD lol
made has defffffff downgraded bigggg time they are booking nothing but cheesey acts for the most part, and i saw an thread about the owner of insomniac saying next year he wants to book more musicial driven dj's not so much of the avicii,shm,dash berlin type stuff
which to me is all talk cause he just did 350,000 people over the weekend so i dunno if the neon ravers could handle a festival without singing who's gonna save the world tonight while frolicing
trance wise in america, the only place that get's pretty good trance acts on a normal basis is out in LA
wishful thinking would be that let live nation deal exclusivly with armada,above and beyond,dash berlin and all the "pop" trance guys
only to leave alot more people like us who still wanna hear the underground side of trance and hopefully something will come out of it
the menno party imo was a pretty good start, solid night of music & solid crowd |
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| Swamper |
| The thing with cash cows is that they eventually run out of milk... mooooooo |
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| Ali Mahmud |
| quote: | Originally posted by Swamper
The thing with cash cows is that they eventually run out of milk... mooooooo |
That is true, but they can always start selling that cow as steaks, and then move on to the next cow and start the process over again, lol. |
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| a.l.d.i. |
i am tired of this no diversity bull booking around here. same people gets booked. farty , tiredy , bash boring, and the rest of same sounding asswhipes. and i will keep bashing these booking until i can
dear promoters:i know they fill in the clubs and you make money, i get that part. but if you want to keep having a business start bringing real talent too. here is why:
At this moment, venue owners like you because you are filling their space with costumers. That is all nice and dandy for now but what is happening you are raising the standard of club goers to these places. So, what the problem? well you are filling these with mainstream djs who are popular because they recently have a hit or two and the rest of the show is full of generic top hits playlist. Most of the clients that come out are new kids into the scene. These kids have recently been introduced to this scene. That means that any sound they hear its new to their ears and it exciting.
Just like life, with time everything ages. These so called neon crowd will grow out of these sounds as they have had their fill. They will stop coming to your shows because there is no more diversity, nor talent to keep them entertained. So, who will fill the place once these crowd move on? Before EDM went mainstream, the old crowd would've been replaced by younger kids, who finally have reached of age. That's not the case anymore because the EDM HAS gone mainstream. Meaning that these younger crowed have also been introduced to these generetic EDM top hits for some time now. Therefore when they reach of age, they are also bored of this sound. This is how every genre that has blown up has also died. Because venues will stop filling up. Nobody will want to drop $200 for sounds that they have heard over and over again. Slowly, these venues will drop in numbers. the owners, having seen the full blown up effect will greed out and stop dealing with you, due to the fact you can't fill up this place anymore. This is how EDM will die in the club scene once again.
Now to my point about booking real talent. lets go back again one more time. These venues, before EDM blew up, were struggling to have repeated costumers. They knew the only way to make money is through alcohol. They wouldn't risk a high cover charge to make profit out of it. These venues knew the older crowed was the big spender and wanted them. However, they also knew that older crowd were more experienced and they had to book real talent to attract these party animals. And boy did we party. i used to drop $100-200 a night in alcohol, and i was the least spender. These older crowd do not come out anymore due to lack of talent booking in current day. It's not that we gotten older, we gotten bored. we smell a boring night 2 weeks in advance.
If you want to keep being a successful promoter start investing in some real talents while you can. Start building up a real following because i don't see these cheap sounds that are currently owning the EDM scene in near feature. Then who would you have to fill your guest list?
talent has always thrived. and it is thriving in the techno and what i believe the future will be deep/tech house.
Don't allow trance and progtrance to die like this. Book some real talent at least once a month. Create proper costumers that will be there when the times will get hard.
i could go on and on forever to give you facts on how you will die if you keep these booking up but who am i kidding. you know this. you were a nobody before too. you had same thoughts. talent! talent! talent! but you are too greedy to book some one like airwave. You don't think airwave will fill the numbers that avicii does and that is sad.
well here is an anthem song in your honnor.. na na na, nanana, na na na, na naa naaaaa naaaaaaa naaaaaaaeeeeeeeeeeeeeee *drop* |
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| Ali Mahmud |
I don't think you can say edm will die, but I do agree that one day it won't be mainstream music anymore. That's just the nature of trends. People grow old of something and move on. As for the music it will evolve into something new, and that new thing might be the new mainstream, or not. There will always be something else, and it's really no point about arguing the state of edm. It is what it is, and this is what it has evolved too. If it's good or bad, well everyone is entitled to their own opinion.
There is still trance it hasn't died, it's just not the popular edm genre. Artist like Tiesto have evolved to a new sound, and have lost some fans, and gained new fans. Same with Armin his sound is not the same as when he first started. If you listen to any artist from any genre they will change. The Beatles are the biggest example of change. They changed and managed to become even bigger than what they where. Some people change and are not as popular afterwards. It's the artist choice to make the music they want. All music changes, and one will always be more popular than others.
I never like when someone bashes an artist for not liking there music. I personally am not a fan of some artist's music but they are doing their own thing and they have their own fans. No need to bash the artist. If you don't like the music fine listen to what you like.
I don't see what these big promotion companies are doing wrong. It's what's popular and it's what makes money for them. They don't do it to lose money, they have to sustain themselves. When this trend fads the promoters will move on to the next trend. There will always be new fans following a new trend. Like I said it is what it is. Music, as in anything else is always changing, peoples taste will always change.
I know it sucks not being able to see artist that are lesser known, but I am sure in the 90's there was underground rock groups in the US, that somebody in the UK was hoping came to town one day, but never did because they just weren't a big enough name.
I am just merely making the point about not beating yourself about the current state of edm. It is what it is. |
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| diabloargentino |
| all i'm going to say is that livenation has never had a profitable year in its existence. |
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| a.l.d.i. |
| quote: | Originally posted by Ali Mahmud
I don't see what these big promotion companies are doing wrong. It's what's popular and it's what makes money for them. They don't do it to lose money, they have to sustain themselves. When this trend fads the promoters will move on to the next trend. There will always be new fans following a new trend. Like I said it is what it is. Music, as in anything else is always changing, peoples taste will always change.
I am just merely making the point about not beating yourself about the current state of edm. It is what it is. |
i am not beating my self over it just tired of the lack of talent.
But what i quoted is my problem. These promoters are influencing me. I can't go out and enjoy some good talent because no ones wants to book them. venues won't be too happy that you propose 100 people to come see a good dj when just last week dash berlin filled up. and when these promoters and fans move on, the venue still will not be too happy handing over a night to a promoter who is bringing a real talent with low following.
like i said before do you understand what would happen if they alloy rihana , shakira and justin beiber play/perform at pacha(just an example of a venue) all of the sudden? pacha will get such a huge boner from the cash flow that will never even look at Made or any other promotion team who is big right now, unless they provide numbers in the 10,000s. Governor's island? you think they allow arty night over shakira if they could? Get my drift?
Then we both will sit here and complain how we can never have good talent. all i am asking is as this promoter are setting a trend, allow a night or two a month with some good talent with a chance of barely meeting profit. at least then the venues will not be spoiled %100 |
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| Ali Mahmud |
I do understand where you are coming from. Pacha obviously would not book Rihanna or justin bieber, because it's not the market they are after, but lets just say they do and try to change there cliental. That is fine, because the other artist they used to book will go to another venue and other promoters, and if that venue doesn't exist. One will open because now there is untapped market that a new venue can benefit from.
Lest say Justin Beiber is booked at pacha, and lets say sankeys opens in ny and has cosmic gate playing. Cosmic gate have there fans and are decent draw, and sankeys will make there money by attracting that crowd. If an artist has a large enough demand be sure they will booked by somebody. I just believe in major cities you will always have a venue to cater to certain market. I think it's the smaller cities that will almost never see the smaller acts, and that is the way it has always been. It all really matters how in demand is the artist for them to be playing in a certain city.
As for edm going mainstream I am all for it. The reason is, that i can only see this helping lesser known artist. I believe that the more people who listen to edm, will have a higher percentage of people who want to branch out and explore other artist in other edm genres. I am going to take myself as an example. I have always been a fan of the 80's really loved the electronic sound used in that decade. For me the 90's wasn't my kind of music, maybe few songs and band here and there. When Moby, Fatboy slim, and prodigy became mainstream i got into that music, Which at the time was mainstream edm. There tracks were huge, maybe not as huge as edm is today, but really big. So I wanted find other artist, and so my search started, and I found Tiesto, PVD, Armin, Oakenfold, which lead me to talla 2xlc, Arctic Quest, Kyau & Albert, A&B, etc. Now I am listening to so many other genres and artist. I am sure I am not the only person who has done this, everyone has there gateway songs into different genres. When more people start finding out about the lesser known artist than those artist will be booked more.
I believe todays edm is reaching more people than the edm of moby and fatboy slim, so the percentage of people exploring the edm roots would be higher. Like people who like skrillix, some of them will start find other dubstep artist, who are not considered mainstream. Also maybe more people would dive into tech house, and therefore help tech house grow bigger. Then more tech house artist will be playing more shows.
This is why I have always been for the growing of edm, and I really hope it continues and grows even bigger, I truly believe it will benefit the scene as a whole. |
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