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2014 NAMM Thread (pg. 4)
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| Looney4Clooney |
| quote: | Originally posted by echosystm
Weighted keys are not appropriate for all things. I already have a Yamaha keyboard with their graded hammer technology (best in the biz) for strings, piano and such. I need a good synth action keyboard for drums, leads and so on.
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there is a right way and wrong way hitting the keyboard . The wrong way makes non weighted keys that have no resistance somewhat ok. If you are ok with that, you don't know how to play. There are just so many ing piano players on the planet that if anything has a demand, well i would say a decent weighted controller would be one.
and kawai is generally considered a lot better in terms of action. |
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| DJ RANN |
| quote: | Originally posted by echosystm
New keyboard from Behringer.
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That's actually quite interesting, and $249 is pretty amazing value but it's a shame the faders are so short throw.
I wish someone would just bring out a 24 or 32 motorized fader controller that was quiet (although they are noisy, I've never understood why behringer didn't just join 3 or 4 of the BCF2000 units).
Like this guy:
The good news from this keyboard is the guy states they are touch sensitive, which was always a downfall of the BCF range - it means Behringer has the capacity to do this. I would love to see a Mk2 or a larger flying fader controller.
I might just buy one for Richie. |
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| Watts |
Not sure if anyone is into guitars, but Ibanez had a lot of interesting stuff this year.
Jackson and Caparison had some high-end 7 strings I may check out in the near future. |
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| Looney4Clooney |
| The bootsy Warwick is apparently under a grand. So getting that |
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| Looney4Clooney |
| quote: | Originally posted by DJ RANN
That's actually quite interesting, and $249 is pretty amazing value but it's a shame the faders are so short throw.
I wish someone would just bring out a 24 or 32 motorized fader controller that was quiet (although they are noisy, I've never understood why behringer didn't just join 3 or 4 of the BCF2000 units).
Like this guy:
The good news from this keyboard is the guy states they are touch sensitive, which was always a downfall of the BCF range - it means Behringer has the capacity to do this. I would love to see a Mk2 or a larger flying fader controller.
I might just buy one for Richie. |
Those things are so ing loud.
I just use a nice keyboard with a flat top were I can set my iPads if I need sliders.
the euphonix mix and artist are attached to a panel that flips with the piano. It is rather clever. I also use 2 apogee duets to use 2 iPads as synth with external fx chain. They sound fantastic. 4 in all. The new ones for audio, the ipad 4s for controllers. |
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| echosystm |
| quote: | Originally posted by tehlord
I actually know more than 3 that would buy it. The score/game market is big. |
I know more than 3 that would buy it too; I was exaggerating. Anyway, you miss my point. The typical producer has no appreciation of this whatsoever. If I was in the business and I just wanted to make money, I wouldn't make the perfect keyboard either; I'd make a "dope ass" keyboard with lots of lights and knobs that barely work, to pander to the biggest share of retards possible.
| quote: | Originally posted by Looney4Clooney
there is a right way and wrong way hitting the keyboard . The wrong way makes non weighted keys that have no resistance somewhat ok. If you are ok with that, you don't know how to play. |
I don't understand what your point is. Are you arguing that weighted keys are good for all purposes? A weighted key cannot bounce back fast enough for fast drums or leads with a lot of trill/sputter. This isn't opinion; it's fact.
| quote: | Originally posted by Looney4Clooney
and kawai is generally considered a lot better in terms of action. |
I don't know where you got that idea from. The Kawai vs. Yamaha debate has been going on since forever. I happen to prefer Yamaha. |
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| Looney4Clooney |
With kawai won with their new action on digital keyboards which is right now twist realistic unless we include actual pianos that can double as a digital controller.
And yes, weighted keys , given you know how to play properly , is always preferable because the tension gives you a rebound allowing better control. You can't play fast on piano that ha no counter weight. That is physics. Same with say drum pedals, the faster thou play, the tighter he spring. You have it backwards, it is the weighted systems that give you that bounce ...
We can have a trill off if you want to make his gay.
I use a Yamaha because the intro kawai is 2000. And I go thru pianos yearly and I ain't spending money on something that will have to be replaced in a year.
ing ipad. I only use net. at tea time at cafe.
And for drums , why are you not using Vdrums. |
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| DJ RANN |
| quote: | Originally posted by Looney4Clooney
Those things are so ing loud.
I just use a nice keyboard with a flat top were I can set my iPads if I need sliders.
the euphonix mix and artist are attached to a panel that flips with the piano. It is rather clever. I also use 2 apogee duets to use 2 iPads as synth with external fx chain. They sound fantastic. 4 in all. The new ones for audio, the ipad 4s for controllers. |
They are so ing loud but they do actually work pretty well and are only $200. The euphonix are in a different league but then again they are like $1200 for 8 faders.
Ipads for controllers, yuck. I cannot stand screen based faders; you get more tactile response from moving them with your mouse.
EDIT: Boner! Behringer just ripped off the Euphonix Artist sereis! SCHWEEET!
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| echosystm |
| quote: | Originally posted by Looney4Clooney
You can't play fast on piano that ha no counter weight. That is physics. |
A counterweight improves speed when depressing a key, since you don't need to press it all the way to the bottom. However, it slows down the rebound, because there is greater resistance. Conversely, an unweighted key is slow to depress, because you have to push it all the way down. However, the rebound will always be faster as there is less resistance.
I'll agree weighted keys have a speed benefit when you aren't hitting the same keys in rapid succession. However, I'm talking about trill and sputter, where the whole point is to hit the same keys very quickly. Thus, rebound speed is essential; you won't get a proper stroke unless the keys have mostly rebounded between hits.
You can compensate for slow depression speed by moving your hands quicker, but you cannot compensate for slow rebound speed. Thus, synth action is superior for this kind of playing.
| quote: | Originally posted by Looney4Clooney
And for drums , why are you not using Vdrums. |
I don't have the space. It would also be a waste of money. I make EDM; it's not like I need to do mad rim shots 24x7 or have super realistic playing.
| quote: | Originally posted by DJ RANN
EDIT: Boner! Behringer just ripped off the Euphonix Artist sereis! SCHWEEET! |
Saw this last night. This is the best thing I have seen from NAMM so far! I had a BCF-2000 and discovered pretty quickly that a HUI controller is useless without LCD scribble strips. |
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| cryophonik |
| quote: | Originally posted by Looney4Clooney
The bootsy Warwick is apparently under a grand. So getting that |
You and every other poseur/hack on the planet. ;) |
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| Looney4Clooney |
| bass is also something i am very good at. |
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| Looney4Clooney |
| quote: | Originally posted by echosystm
A counterweight improves speed when depressing a key, since you don't need to press it all the way to the bottom. However, it slows down the rebound, because there is greater resistance. Conversely, an unweighted key is slow to depress, because you have to push it all the way down. However, the rebound will always be faster as there is less resistance.
I'll agree weighted keys have a speed benefit when you aren't hitting the same keys in rapid succession. However, I'm talking about trill and sputter, where the whole point is to hit the same keys very quickly. Thus, rebound speed is essential; you won't get a proper stroke unless the keys have mostly rebounded between hits.
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The weight doesn't affect the speed of the pressing of the key. That comes from your arms and it is negligle. It is the counterweight in the action that makes the repound snappier with weighted keys, You have it backwards. Non weighted keys use a simple spring. They are usually much slower unless you are a player then you probably play a weighted keyboard with just your fingers and well ya, if you don't know how to play you would find it harder. You could not do a say a 3 finger trill on 1 key like you could on a weighted keyboard.
And it is exactly the resistance that makes the weighted keys want to be up, rather than down. It takes more energy to push them down but that energy tends to be bounced back. Again not all weighted actions are equal but regular spring action keyboards seem faster to people that can't play. |
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