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Friday 288: US Election All week/end edition (pg. 6)
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| JEO |
| quote: | Originally posted by Zoso
There's that term again. Boys, I really do hate to sound ignorant, but I'm just not sure what these "woke progressives" believe or represent... :conf: |
I may be using the term wrong myself :D but I've taken it to mean mostly politically left-leaning people who are big on the idea of social justice. I don't necessarily use it as a pejorative term.
| quote: | Originally posted by Zoso
I have never travelled outside the US; are other nations as divided internally as the US? |
I can only speak a bit for Finland and Denmark, and sure there's that faint divide between the populous, well-doing capital areas and other areas, but nothing too substantial.
In a few places in Finland though, if you know where to look, you can spot remnants from a divide after our civil war around 100 years ago. The war was fought between the whites and the reds, and for example in my hometown there are some old public buildings on the opposite sides of town that are either white or red. Nothing too substantial there either. The only time I remember ever even thinking about it was when my cousin started working out, and his father told him to use the gym that's in one of the white buildings, not the red one. |
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| Lews |
| quote: | Originally posted by JEO
I see how it could be read like that. I acknowledge that they're very different, and that some change is going to come, but I'm afraid that ultimately the country will still be very divided, if not more than it has been now. I don't think the people are just magically going to change their mind with Biden behind the wheel, especially that ~50% of Americans who seemingly were ready to accept Trump as their president again. Sure, half of the country is ecstatic right now for Biden's win, and sure, America will seem a bit smarter to us outsiders now than it did for the past four years, but I don't think that alone will mend much of the cracks that were there even before Trump. If there's gonna be substantially more pandering to the super-woke progressives, I just don't know, since seemingly half of the country is ready to continue on the path it is on now. |
Oh, yes, of course the US will continue being very divided. But that doesn't mean that either the US or the world will not be better off.
I'm not sure I agree that ~50% of Americans were fine to continue down the path. The US had a huge turnout this election and Biden decisively won the popular vote.
| quote: | Originally posted by JEO
No, I don't think so. If one president can affect that capability so much, it would just seem to me that how they're doing internally would too, but I must be wrong there. I guess overall I just find it absurd that one man's behavior can affect so many things. |
When that one man is the president of the US, unfortunately, it does affect so many things. The most powerful person in the most powerful country in the world has a lot of influence. Let's say it's 3-5% of events. 3-5% of events in the world is a LOT. |
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| Zoso |
| quote: | Originally posted by Lews
Also, how ing removed are you from society that you haven't heard of this until now? :wtf: |
I'm a mixed bag of silliness, mang. I have moderate social anxiety, so I avoid crowds, etc. I don't enjoy social media at all, so you won't find me there, nor will I find any information there. I seek out most of the news I wish to ingest (usually all science and tech related stuff, with a focus on information security) via sites like Ars Technica, Slashdot, and Krebs On Security. I dislike politics, so I don't generally follow any political news, other than what makes it to the front pages of CNN or one of the aforementioned sites. So, unless I REALLY dig in to something, it usually just flies right over my head. I don't know if that's good or bad, in the long run. But it "feels" better, if that makes sense.
This year was an exception to the rule, for me personally, but I just can't stand Trump and what our Republican party represent, currently. It's a ing abomination, and something had to be done. |
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| JEO |
| quote: | Originally posted by Lews
I'm not sure I agree that ~50% of Americans were fine to continue down the path. |
How so? Trump got 48.3%, "roughly 50%", of the votes. Seems to me that the half that voted for Trump was willing to let him lead once more, or what am I missing here?
| quote: | Originally posted by Lews
When that one man is the president of the US, unfortunately, it does affect so many things. The most powerful person in the most powerful country in the world has a lot of influence. Let's say it's 3-5% of events. 3-5% of events in the world is a LOT. |
Sure, of course, but let's rather make my point more about why is that one position still granted that much authority. To me that seems more like a flaw in the system that should be corrected rather than something that should be accepted as something obvious. Clearly, looking back at Trump's term, it can be a destructive position when misused, and there seemed to be little anyone could do about it. |
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| Zoso |
| quote: | Originally posted by JEO
How so? Trump got 48.3%, "roughly 50%", of the votes. Seems to me that the half that voted for Trump was willing to let him lead once more, or what am I missing here?
Sure, of course, but let's rather make my point more about why is that one position still granted that much authority. To me that seems more like a flaw in the system that should be corrected rather than something that should be accepted as something obvious. Clearly, looking back at Trump's term, it can be a destructive position when misused, and there seemed to be little anyone could do about it. |
In theory...on paper, at least, the system is supposed to be able to do just that. But when the Republicans as a group decide to tow the party line and throw all rational judgement out the ing window to service "their guy," and when you have that kind of majority in one of the checks and balances branches, and then on top of that stack your-political-persuasion-leaning judges on the other checks and balances branch...yeah, it can be a cluster and difficult to reign in. 'em and feed 'em fish heads. I'm ready to vote every damn one of them out. It's the only "language" they'll understand, anymore. |
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| Lews |
| quote: | Originally posted by JEO
How so? Trump got 48.3%, "roughly 50%", of the votes. Seems to me that the half that voted for Trump was willing to let him lead once more, or what am I missing here? |
We can state the numbers in many ways.
So far, tallied votes equal 62% of eligible voters: 47.7% voted for Trump, 50.6% voted Biden, and 1.7% voted other.
So we could say that 38% of eligible voters didn't care, 29.6% wanted Trump, 31.4% wanted Biden, and 1% wanted someone else.
But of course we don't know why 38% of eligible voters didn't vote, so we don't know if they were fine with how things were or were disenfranchised or felt hopeless because they live in a solid red state or what their reason was. The data really don't allow us to know how many people were or were not willing to let him have a second term. But, in the end, Biden will have a pretty crushing popular vote advantage.
| quote: | Originally posted by JEO
Sure, of course, but let's rather make my point more about why is that one position still granted that much authority. To me that seems more like a flaw in the system that should be corrected rather than something that should be accepted as something obvious. Clearly, looking back at Trump's term, it can be a destructive position when misused, and there seemed to be little anyone could do about it. |
Well the funny thing is how Republicans were complaining about how powerful the presidency was during Obama's years in office and then turned around and went even more berserk once they had the keys to the nukes again.
The US under its current constitution cannot last for too much longer, in my opinion. In the future, I'd like to see it look more like the EU than for the EU to look more like the US. |
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| Zoso |
| quote: | Originally posted by Lews
We can state the numbers in many ways.
So far, tallied votes equal 62% of eligible voters: 47.7% voted for Trump, 50.6% voted Biden, and 1.7% voted KANYE.
So we could say that 38% of eligible voters didn't care, 29.6% wanted Trump, 31.4% wanted Biden, and 1% wanted KANYE.
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Fixed that for you. ;) |
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| Lews |
| quote: | Originally posted by Zoso
I'm a mixed bag of silliness, mang. I have moderate social anxiety, so I avoid crowds, etc. I don't enjoy social media at all, so you won't find me there, nor will I find any information there. I seek out most of the news I wish to ingest (usually all science and tech related stuff, with a focus on information security) via sites like Ars Technica, Slashdot, and Krebs On Security. I dislike politics, so I don't generally follow any political news, other than what makes it to the front pages of CNN or one of the aforementioned sites. So, unless I REALLY dig in to something, it usually just flies right over my head. I don't know if that's good or bad, in the long run. But it "feels" better, if that makes sense. |
That makes sense. I try to avoid social media for the most part for reasons of mental health. I only use Facebook because I'm a permanent expat and have friends all over the globe with whom it is the best way to stay vaguely in touch.
| quote: | Originally posted by Zoso
This year was an exception to the rule, for me personally, but I just can't stand Trump and what our Republican party represent, currently. It's a ing abomination, and something had to be done. |
Christ, if I had told 2012 Lews that in 2020 he'd wish Mitt Romney was running for president, I would have ... not believed you. I pray for the day the US changes the FPTP system and we can have a third, actual centrist party. |
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| JEO |
| Alright, I see my mistake there. For now, around half of those who cared enough to vote were willing to let Trump have another term. And still there are 12 million votes to be counted? Jesus it's taking long. |
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| Zoso |
| quote: | Originally posted by Lews
That makes sense. I try to avoid social media for the most part for reasons of mental health. I only use Facebook because I'm a permanent expat and have friends all over the globe with whom it is the best way to stay vaguely in touch.
Christ, if I had told 2012 Lews that in 2020 he'd wish Mitt Romney was running for president, I would have ... not believed you. I pray for the day the US changes the FPTP system and we can have a third, actual centrist party. |
There was a time when I wouldn't have invested a single hour towards any given political candidate or situation. But goddamn, I can't stand a pathological liar. When I catch you in a lie, and you know that I know that you're lying, but you just double down on the lie and throw in a dose of immature asshatery on top...?! Makes my head asplode! Also, the older I get (44 in December), the lower my tolerance for The Stupid (TM). :whip: |
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| Zoso |
| quote: | Originally posted by JEO
Alright, I see my mistake there. For now, around half of those who cared enough to vote were willing to let Trump have another term. And still there are 12 million votes to be counted? Jesus it's taking long. |
You have to keep in mind, also, that every election here, even if it's a "federal" election is really ran as a local/state election. I will preface all of that by stating that I am NOT an expert on state election laws. I am not even aware of the nuances of my own state's (TN) laws. But in a case like this, it can add to the wait, depending on how each state is allowed to process. For example, some (or most?) states said that mail in ballots could only be tallied AFTER in-person ballots. And a ton of people, due to COVID, did mail-in...and they skewed heavily (as much as 75%, I believe) Democrat, hence some of the "fraud" claims.
The good thing about "every election being local/state" is that it helps to prevent actual large-scale, organized fraud. The kind that Trump is being an immature, orange gibbon about. :D |
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| planetaryplayer |
| quote: | Originally posted by SYSTEM-J
Speaking of the virus, I tested positive this morning. What a ing year, eh? |
not sure if you mentioned buttttt, how/where do you think you got the virus? |
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