quote:

Originally posted by pmoisse The western world is supposed to have a seperation of church & state, but that gap has certainly narrowed in recent years, from where I sit.

by acknowledging that there is a gap, you are proving yourself wrong. the president of the USA has the support of like 25% of the people. he gained office through fear campaigning.

at least there is a gap!

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quote:

Originally posted by Cyrus King i listen to trance becuase it is beautifully composed like a classical piece of music.... but with beats in it...

quote:

Originally posted by Magnetonium I hardly if ever acknowledge sarcasm from a person I dont know because I ran into serious problems on an undisclosed buying website before.

quote:

Originally posted by shaolin_Z ...[N]ow that Ahmedinejad's ..."holocaust deial" allegations propagated by the mainstream media have been debunked...

Uh...

quote:

In a December 2005 speech, Ahmadinejad said that the Holocaust was a "fairy tale" that had been promoted to protect Israel, ramping up his rhetoric and triggering a fresh wave of international denunciation. He said, "They have fabricated a legend under the name 'Massacre of the Jews', and they hold it higher than God himself, religion itself and the prophets themselves...(The West) deals very severely with those who deny this myth but does not do anything to those who deny God, religion, and the prophets." He also called for Israel to be relocated to Germany, or Austria, arguing it was these nations that persecuted the Jews, so they ought to bear the responsibility, not Palestinians forsaking their land to form a nation of Israel. He also suggested relocating Israeli Jews to the United States.[43] The remarks immediately provoked a blaze of international controversy as well as swift condemnation from government officials in Israel, Europe, and the United States. All six political parties in the German parliament signed a joint resolution condemning this Holocaust denial.[44] Hamas political leader Khaled Mashaal described Ahmadinejad's comments as "courageous" and stated that "...Muslim people will defend Iran because it voices what they have in their hearts, in particular the Palestinian people."[45] In the United States, the Muslim Public Affairs Council condemned Ahmadinejad's remarks.[46] On April 24 2006, Ahmadinejad demanded a free evaluation of the real extent of the Holocaust "in order to find the ultimate truth." In a May 30, 2006 interview with Der Spiegel Ahmadinejad again questioned the Holocaust several times, insisting there were "two opinions" on it. When asked if the Holocaust was a myth, he responded "I will only accept something as truth if I am actually convinced of it".[47] On December 11, 2006 the "International Conference to Review the Global Vision of the Holocaust" opened, to widespread condemnation.[48] The conference, called for by and held at the behest of Ahmadinejad,[49] was widely described as a "Holocaust denial conference" or a "meeting of Holocaust deniers",[50] though Iran insisted it is not a Holocaust denial conference.[51] A few months before it opened, the Iranian Foreign Ministry spokesman Hamid Reza Asefi stated: "The Holocaust is not a sacred issue that one can't touch. I have visited the Nazi camps in Eastern Europe. I think it is exaggerated."[52]

>>Source<<

Just how was this, 'debunked' again?
I must have missed something

[EDIT]
>Here's another link< on Ahmedinejad's 'misunderstanding'...

___________________
"...End? No, the journey doesn't end here. Death is just another path...one that we all must take.
The grey rain-curtain of this world rolls back, and all change to silver glass...and then you see it...
...white shores...and beyond...the far green country under a swift sunrise."

Last edited by Fir3start3r on Feb-18-2007 at 08:15

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Originally posted by Fir3start3r Uh... >>Source<< Just how was this, 'debunked' again? I must have missed something [EDIT] >Here's another link< on Ahmedinejad's 'misunderstanding'...

Calm down boy,nobody is gonna to destroy your precious. Israel.

stop posting this nonsense everytime someone brings the name Ahmadinejad,your orgument on this subject is REALLY becoming boring and pointles.

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Originally posted by Dopehead prancer man, you are joking right? Iranians would desert faster than the French. If some alien planet attacked the US with superior arms, the US military would desert as well. It is all about air power, the US can park three carriers at the front door and throw eggs at their windows till the cows come home.

Are you blind?or too much crack again?do you not see whats happening in Iraq?let me guess you think Americans are wining this war in Iraq dont you? as a superpower they are def losing this war big time,and you think they can defeat Iran with a bunch of high tech bombs?ffs they cant even kill a bunch of insurgents in Iraq. lol

quote:

Bush has no support for a war with Iran. If anything happens there, it will be IDF taking out every suspected nuke site.

If they do then you can kiss your motherland Israel goodbye.

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quote:

Originally posted by Dopey It is all about air power, the US can park three carriers at the front door and throw eggs at their windows till the cows come home. .

This Nation (US) is now the ultimate power in the universe. I suggest we use it. [insert Darth Vader Theme Music]

It will be a sad day for the world if both countries don't stop this Cock of The Walk B.S.

Iran needs to take its own country back from the Islamic cleric and the US just needs to stay out of the region.


Let them people work it out themselves. They obviously know how to work things there. (No women rights, anti-gay, no high speed internet, honor killings and a police force that enforce a book of rules that was written in the Dark Ages)
The US should just bow out and stand back and watch. Once this Nation gets off of that Region's Oil Filled Tits, then I am sure there will be no excuse for you people to hate on the US and its Terroristic Diplomacy.

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Originally posted by hardcore trancer If they do then you can kiss your motherland Israel goodbye.

wishfull thinking there,

Isreal may be invaded, but the invading muslim soldiers will not have a home or family to return to. is that what you want??

Do you really honestly believe that if even all of the Arab Countries Banded together and the US stayed out of it, that it would be a cake walk??

Also if the US was so focking evil why DO WE use rules to fight the insurgents?? Why not cut off a few heads on video tape while screaming GOD IS GREAT like your precious little isurgents are doing?

If the US was as evil as you beleive, then there would be no disscusion about this, cause it would of already been over.

I am not trying to start a mud slinging war with you Hardcore. You know damn well though, that if the US would use all of its weapons, technology with out a moral ground, unlike your precious little isurgents; who hide in mosques, use human shields, have the kidnapped the religion of Islam, kill people just because they believe a different sect all in the name of God!
you can not be that Naive can you? Do you think you would be in a better place, if you were goverened by the likes of the insurgents or Iran itself??

Answer that for me, if not then every single one of you aurguments here on this forum are baseless and you need to seek help.

Last edited by LazFX on Feb-18-2007 at 09:42

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Originally posted by Fir3start3r Uh... >>Source<< Just how was this, 'debunked' again? I must have missed something [EDIT] >Here's another link< on Ahmedinejad's 'misunderstanding'...

What have you been smoking? Your selective memory fails you once again. All of that's been addressed already, on a number of occasions. But you can hold on to that delusional propaganda, whatever floats your boat man.

___________________
"The Greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge." -Stephen Hawking
"First they came for the communists, and I did not speak out— because I was not a communist;
Then they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out— because I was not a socialist;
Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out— because I was not a trade unionist;
Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out— because I was not a Jew;
Then they came for me— and there was no one left to speak out for me." -Martin Niemöller

The Chamberlain gag-reflex is unpalatable; how do you guys do it?

___________________
"...End? No, the journey doesn't end here. Death is just another path...one that we all must take.
The grey rain-curtain of this world rolls back, and all change to silver glass...and then you see it...
...white shores...and beyond...the far green country under a swift sunrise."

quote:

Originally posted by hardcore trancer Are you blind?or too much crack again?do you not see whats happening in Iraq?let me guess you think Americans are wining this war in Iraq dont you? as a superpower they are def losing this war big time,and you think they can defeat Iran with a bunch of high tech bombs?ffs they cant even kill a bunch of insurgents in Iraq. lol If they do then you can kiss your motherland Israel goodbye.

I'm not talking about the US invading Iran, just destroying every suspected nuke site. The objective in Iraq was to overthrow Saddam, the objective in Iran will be to prevent the crazies from acquiring the bomb. There's no winning or losing, just lots of bombing.

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Originally posted by Cyrus King i listen to trance becuase it is beautifully composed like a classical piece of music.... but with beats in it...

quote:

Originally posted by Magnetonium I hardly if ever acknowledge sarcasm from a person I dont know because I ran into serious problems on an undisclosed buying website before.

quote:

Originally posted by hardcore trancer If they do then you can kiss your motherland Israel goodbye.

And who is going to get rid of Israel? Believe me, if whoever you are talking about could have, they already would have.

And why did nobody give a shit in 1981? Israel was around in '82 wasn't it?

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quote:

Originally posted by Cyrus King i listen to trance becuase it is beautifully composed like a classical piece of music.... but with beats in it...

quote:

Originally posted by Magnetonium I hardly if ever acknowledge sarcasm from a person I dont know because I ran into serious problems on an undisclosed buying website before.

quote:

Originally posted by Fir3start3r Uh... >>Source<< Just how was this, 'debunked' again? I must have missed something [EDIT] >Here's another link< on Ahmedinejad's 'misunderstanding'...

People's rights to free speech are restricted (yes, that makes people very happy!!!) I feel very secure will all these laws against freedom of speech, what speech restricting laws will they pass next? Prison sentence / fine making fun of religion? I'd be pissed off living in a country which tells me what I can and what I cannot say.

"Holocaust denial is illegal in a number of European countries: Austria (article 3h Verbotsgesetz 1947), Belgium (Belgian Negationism Law), the Czech Republic under section 261, France (Loi Gayssot), Germany (§ 130 (3) of the penal code) also the Auschwitzlüge law section 185, Lithuania, The Netherlands under articles 137c and 137e, Poland, Romania, Slovakia, Spain and Switzerland (article 261bis of the Penal Code). In addition, under Law 5710-1950 it is also illegal in Israel. Italy enacted a law against racial and sexual discrimination on January 25, 2007. [2] Even if it is commonly referred as the "Holocaust law" in the public debate, it does not actually contain direct references to the Holocaust and does not explicitly address its denial.

Penalties for violation of Holocaust Denial Laws[58]
Country - Minimum - Maximum :
Austria 6 months 10-20 years
Belgium Fine 1 year
Czech Republic 6 months 2 years
France Fine or 1 month 2 years
Germany Fine or 6 months 5 years
Israel 1 year 5 years
Italy (law against racial discrimination) 3 years 4 years
Lithuania Fine or 2 years 10 years
Poland Fine or 3 months 3 years
Romania 6 months 3-5 years
Slovakia Fine or 1 month 3 years
Switzerland Fine or 1 year 15 months. "

As for Ahmadinejad article, well, lemme see:

quote:

President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad of Iran said that Germans should no longer allow themselves to be held prisoner by a sense of guilt over the Holocaust and reiterated doubts that the Holocaust ever happened.

I agree. Why should ordinary Germans be held hostage to the day for the crimes they themselves didnt do? Most of the criminals are dead by now. They shouldn't feel guilty, they lost families, land (East Prussia), pride, war. They paid out the damages, apologized and are living civilized today.

quote:

"I believe the German people are prisoners of the Holocaust. More than 60 million were killed in World War II. . . . The question is: Why is it that only Jews are at the center of attention?" he said in the interview published Sunday.

Yeah, why are Jews at the center of attention in WW2? How come even though Soviet Union lost 28+ million people, when I do a poll on people's knowledge of that, most people would only know how many Jews died. Couple of my friends actually told me that according to the knowledge accumulated they thought that Jews made up HALF of all WW2 deaths. WHOA, whoa ...

quote:

"We say if the Holocaust happened, then the Europeans must accept the consequences and the price should not be paid by Palestine.

Man oh man, this Iranian leader is pretty good. I mean, I feel it for the Jewish people and their suffering, and I am NOT anti-semitic, but I cannot disagree with above quote, eespecially looking at the grim situation of Palestinians right now, hostages and victims of Israel.


And as for his denial or "doubt" about Holocaust, that's Ahmadinejad's opinion, and quite frankly, I dont think he should go to prison just for that - though I do think that his education and IQ levels are slightly low for a leader of a country (comparable to Bush's IQ I suppose). But then again - I am very sure he knows that Holocaust happened, he's probably saying his "doubts" to piss Jews off and play along to his Arabic supporters and semitics around the world.

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