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Europe Through American Eyes (End of Europe?) (pg. 6)
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| BadBadNeil |
We're all gonna be a bunch of mutts eventually anyways. I think as time goes on people will less and less identify themselves as a single race as they become mixed.
For example take me. My mom is pure puerto rican and dad is german/swedish/other random white stuff. That makes me half white and half hispanic. My girlfriend's parents, one is full mexican and the other is a german/something else mix. That makes her half white and hispanic.
Our kids are gonna be puertorican, mexican, german, sweedish, other random white stuff kids and I see this a lot as more and more people have kids outside their races. In time we won't know what to call ourselves. |
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| Shakka |
This is an area I find interesting. I look at America, and sure it's had it's problems with integration, civil rights, etc. But when you look at the bigger picture, it seems to me that America is one of the most diverse countries on the planet, yet Americans are constantly assailed as elitist, intolerant, racist, white, etc. Yet year after year, more people immigrate to the U.S. than probably most other countries in the world. Strikes me as ironic.
Visit a nation like Japan or China, where a white person sticks out like a sore thumb. You don't see the kind of ethnic mixing in many other countries to that level, yet Americans are still viewed by much of the world as a coherent, uniform breed. When was the last time you saw an Israeli Jew marry a Palestinian? Why are Americans murdered when they visit the Middle East yet muslims come to America and can fairly readily integrate into American culture without excessive fear of persecution? Is there not a double standard here?
I've often been of the thought that "Americans" are essentially the bastards of civilization in that it's got that whole "Mixing bowl/melting pot" thing going on. Not that it's a good thing or a bad thing per se, just an observation. Sure, historically, your typical American was probably a "caucasion" of western European descent, but there has been massive immigration from Poland, Africa, Asia, Mexico, Cuba, South America--you name it--in the last century. I wonder how many actually understand what being "American" actually means.
Just some brain droppings on a Wednesday morning.;) |
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| Shakka |
| quote: | Originally posted by mixinmusic
Did you know that "integration" of communities kills 30 languages every day around the world. |
30 languages per day??? Where is this data point from? That would mean over 10,000 'languages' would be lost every year, and would imply that over 300,000 languages have disappeared during my life alone. That seems highly improbable to me, but if you have a source to back up this claim, I'd love to read it!:)
Also, does that include 'new' languages like Ebonics? |
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| occrider |
| quote: | Originally posted by Shakka
This is an area I find interesting. I look at America, and sure it's had it's problems with integration, civil rights, etc. But when you look at the bigger picture, it seems to me that America is one of the most diverse countries on the planet, yet Americans are constantly assailed as elitist, intolerant, racist, white, etc. Yet year after year, more people immigrate to the U.S. than probably most other countries in the world. Strikes me as ironic.
Visit a nation like Japan or China, where a white person sticks out like a sore thumb. You don't see the kind of ethnic mixing in many other countries to that level, yet Americans are still viewed by much of the world as a coherent, uniform breed. When was the last time you saw an Israeli Jew marry a Palestinian? Why are Americans murdered when they visit the Middle East yet muslims come to America and can fairly readily integrate into American culture without excessive fear of persecution? Is there not a double standard here?
I've often been of the thought that "Americans" are essentially the bastards of civilization in that it's got that whole "Mixing bowl/melting pot" thing going on. Not that it's a good thing or a bad thing per se, just an observation. Sure, historically, your typical American was probably a "caucasion" of western European descent, but there has been massive immigration from Poland, Africa, Asia, Mexico, Cuba, South America--you name it--in the last century. I wonder how many actually understand what being "American" actually means.
Just some brain droppings on a Wednesday morning.;) |
It is rather interesting to see how Europe is so adverse and (shock!) conservative when it comes to immigration. Not only have most 'liberal' European nations, such as the Netherlands or Sweden, been strengthening anti-immigration laws, but they've been resisting immigration from within the EU itself! Despite the recent admission of 10 new member states into the EU, most countries have erected barriers that prevent migrant workers from entering the country from anywhere between 2-7 years. Only two EU countries, Britain and Ireland, will allow citizens from new EU states to migrate freely to live and work.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/mai...15%2Fwasy15.xml |
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| St_Andrew |
| quote: | Originally posted by occrider
It is rather interesting to see how Europe is so adverse and (shock!) conservative when it comes to immigration. Not only have most 'liberal' European nations, such as the Netherlands or Sweden, been strengthening anti-immigration laws, but they've been resisting immigration from within the EU itself! Despite the recent admission of 10 new member states into the EU, most countries have erected barriers that prevent migrant workers from entering the country from anywhere between 2-7 years. Only two EU countries, Britain and Ireland, will allow citizens from new EU states to migrate freely to live and work.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/mai...15%2Fwasy15.xml |
hey don't confuse sweden with denmark! sweden = no stupid imigration laws. ;) (although they *may* be comming in a not to far future :()
and yeah i agree, this sucks with europe... donno why this is the case tho... people seem really conservative at this point and immigrators have a hard time to com into the labour market which makes many of them poor/criminals which makes some people "hate" them... |
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| occrider |
| quote: | Originally posted by Shakka
30 languages per day??? Where is this data point from? That would mean over 10,000 'languages' would be lost every year, and would imply that over 300,000 languages have disappeared during my life alone. That seems highly improbable to me, but if you have a source to back up this claim, I'd love to read it!:)
Also, does that include 'new' languages like Ebonics? |
I dunno about that 30 languages a day figure, but approximately half of the world's 6000 languages are endangered:
http://abcnews.go.com/sections/worl..._languages.html |
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| occrider |
| quote: | Originally posted by St_Andrew
hey don't confuse sweden with denmark! sweden = no stupid imigration laws. ;) (although they *may* be comming in a not to far future :()
and yeah i agree, this sucks with europe... donno why this is the case tho... people seem really conservative at this point and immigrators have a hard time to com into the labour market which makes many of them poor/criminals which makes some people "hate" them... |
Denmark, Sweden, what's the difference :p.
Anyway my guess as to why there is such a sense of hostility is because they're an easy scapegoat to blame for things that are going wrong. |
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| Dervish |
| quote: | Originally posted by mixinmusic
Dervish you Identify yourself as Scottish. That to me is a typical way to sideline yourself from the wider English speaking population. How can you sit and identify yourself with a ethnic minority population when you preach about others integrating into the wider society. Although I totally agree you have a right to identify yourself and follow any cultural traits, Its the other bit of your debate about integrating people into the wider community I dont agree with.
Did you know that "integration" of communities kills 30 languages every day around the world. Indeed Scottish as a language is one of those endangered languages. Do you wish to see your country loose its herritage?
I do not agree with your philosophy that everyone on the planet should integrate and loose their ethinticity. Those who migrate should have to assimilate into their new society for their migration and the practise of multiculturalism will only further erode minority cultures such as Scottish that already being eroded by the globalisation of the world. |
Hmm well as for me identifying myself as Scottish, well I do live in Scotland no such thing as a Britsh football team. I mean I'm British too. If I played football at international level it would be for Scotland. Don't know what the issue is. I kinda get your point. But I'd say it's more a geograghy(born in scotland hence scottish) thing than a cultural thing.
If I moved to America and became a Citizen I'd be American.
As for everyone speaking the same language whats the problem with that?
I mean you do realise that much of English is Celtic and so on yeah? It works both ways. English is based upon a huge number of infulences. >>>LINK<<<
The globalisation thing I actually do agree with in the sence that for example American culture should not uniformly cover over say Polish culture.
But it's a two way thing. Take in Britain average saturday night.
Lads round drink.
Pub drink.
Club.
Indian Takeway.
It works both ways.
As for losing heratige I doubt intire areas will suddenly forget their past. And I think future equality through out the world is more important.
I mean America and the Uk and Europe is going to have to change in the future because of infulences and lack of sustainablity.
The current western life is not sustainable (if we were all americans we'd need 8 more earths to support us) so as more and more take on this life the more it will have to change. |
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| St_Andrew |
| quote: | Originally posted by occrider
Denmark, Sweden, what's the difference :p. |
FU :p
actually sweden is one of few (the only) country in EU who hasn't any special laws for the new EU members... and we don't have any anti-imigrant parties in parliament.. but yeah our integration policies sucks anyway...
| quote: | | Anyway my guess as to why there is such a sense of hostility is because they're an easy scapegoat to blame for things that are going wrong. |
Hmm, you may be partly right, but yeah not totally. Denmark has one of Europe's best economies, so that doesn't make sense. also i think england is going rather well (?) and they have such problems too. but yeah since they usually are in the lower parts of society they are easy to be used as the scapegoat for everything bad in society.
one of the biggest problems in sweden is that we can't get those people into the labour market. that is because: people focus way to much on the language, if they don't know perfect swedish, they assume they can't do a proper job. Also we don't take in working imigrations such as you do, we only take in political refugees. one more thing is that we tend to not take their former education into account.. like there's a lot of somalian doctors that is currenlty driving taxis in our country, cause they practically need to do the education all over to get a swedish doctors license.. and everything of this keeps them down in society, which also keeps their reputation lows, which also makes the anti immigrant people more...
one more thing is that people tend to be afraid of new cultures, they are not used to it in the same way as you are, seriously, we have only had immigration for not-too-long... so many people are affraid that they will "take over sweden" :rolleyes:
i'm not sure, but i guess rest of europe is having similair problems... |
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| FuzzyGreen |
| quote: | Originally posted by TuanAnh213
just curious...what is the general population of asians in madison wisconsin? |
Just FYI, in my highschool in San Jose CA whites were the minority:
breakdown:
40% asian
30% white
20% Latino
5% black
5% other
I fit in the other category because I'm extremely mixed. |
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| TuanAnh213 |
| quote: | Originally posted by FuzzyGreen
Just FYI, in my highschool in San Jose CA whites were the minority:
breakdown:
40% asian
30% white
20% Latino
5% black
5% other
I fit in the other category because I'm extremely mixed. |
dude...i'm from san jose too...and my high school was 70 percent asian and the rest were white, indian, and whatever other race that isn't asian |
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| Yoepus |
| quote: | Originally posted by occrider
Anyway my guess as to why there is such a sense of hostility is because they're an easy scapegoat to blame for things that are going wrong. |
Nah, Europeans gave up scapegoating after WWII:rolleyes:
:p |
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