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Election time again (pg. 10)
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| matt_a |
Equality, e ing quality. If I hear it once more. If we should all be equal, WHY THE SHOULD I BOTHER WORKING HARD! WHY SHOULD I TRY AT SCHOOL? WHAT INCENTIVE IS THERE TO TRY AND DO WELL IN LIFE! Because those that don't try and don't work hard will be on the same level. Yeh this is real EQUALITY isn't it!
Equality is the ability of all people to have the same rights. Not to be on the same economical level. People say that EQUALITY is not being shown in the Education system. Well guess what. IT IS. Everybody in thie country can gain FREE education, it's just that some choose to go beyond the right of education to have broadened oppotunities and increased care.
And all this bull about Private Schools getting mroe money to build "Cricket Ovals" and . You people have no ing idea! I go to a private school in west sydney, and we DON"T get money to buy those things! The government gives money for our EDUCATION, to pay teachers etc, not to make our schools look good. All that is done by Fundraisers, donations, appeals, and the hard work of people in the school to try and make it better.
Our classrooms are just like any other school. We still have many demountable buildings, old classrooms, graffitied tables, and where we learn is in fact the same as all other schools. THe school fees paid each term, go to paying teachers, and keeping the academic stuff going. (Seeing as we only get 1/4 of the funding as public schools get anway).
The peripheral is not paid for by the government!
Even when I went to a public primary school, we needed a new school hall . . so what did we do? We fundraised money and it took our school about 8 years to finally get it. This is why I don;t understand why other public schools can't help in the improvement of their schools either if they are complaining.
And yes the bullcrap about the government not effecting interest rates. What a load of BS.
A Weak economy leads to no-confidence in it, and higher interest rates, which in turn leads to recession. The RBA has to put up interest rates because of the piss weak economy.
SOmeone mentioned the Wall Street crash in the 20's. This is exactly it! When people started to sell shares and lose confidence, share prices went down, and it set of a chain reaction of share selling, and the market crashed. Of course interest rates must be raised, as the first casualty is the banks, and yes in the US the banks shut down.
"They took steps to keep interest rates high and discourage borrowing. So people didn’t borrow—and companies didn’t either."
Nuff Said |
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| arctic |
| quote: | Originally posted by matt_a
Equality, e ing quality. If I hear it once more. If we should all be equal, WHY THE SHOULD I BOTHER WORKING HARD! WHY SHOULD I TRY AT SCHOOL? WHAT INCENTIVE IS THERE TO TRY AND DO WELL IN LIFE! Because those that don't try and don't work hard will be on the same level. Yeh this is real EQUALITY isn't it! |
Nobody here is suggesting that everyone should have equality in the sense that we should all join the CPA and receive equal incomes irrespective of their incomes -- and neither is the Labor party. Suggesting otherwise is disingenuous and misleading.
| quote: | | Equality is the ability of all people to have the same rights. |
Which is exactly what the Howard government has trampled on with their stance on the war in Iraq, Guantanamo bay and refugee issues.
| quote: | | Not to be on the same economical level. People say that EQUALITY is not being shown in the Education system. Well guess what. IT IS. Everybody in thie country can gain FREE education, it's just that some choose to go beyond the right of education to have broadened oppotunities and increased care. |
You've lost me here. The Labor party isn't going to stop funding private schools. Personally i'd like them to, but they're not. What they are doing is taking funding from the top 100 or so private schools and redistributing it to other struggling government and non-government (private) schools. The Labor party isn't threatening the right of others to go off and obtain an education at private school, so I don't know what your problem is.
| quote: | | And all this bull about Private Schools getting mroe money to build "Cricket Ovals" and . You people have no ing idea! |
Many do. They already have astoundingly high levels of revenue from fees and bequests -- and it does end up doing to facilities.
| quote: | | I go to a private school in west sydney, and we DON"T get money to buy those things! |
Then chances are that your school is actually going to get more money under Labor polcy. I don't disagree with the rest of what you said, so i'll skip that part.
| quote: | | Even when I went to a public primary school, we needed a new school hall . . so what did we do? We fundraised money and it took our school about 8 years to finally get it. This is why I don;t understand why other public schools can't help in the improvement of their schools either if they are complaining. |
Because many simply don't have parents with the cash or the ability to get it done. There are a hell of a lot of public schools that struggle due to inadequate funding and assistance, which is why it's so infuriating to see the Coalition throw money at ultra-rich private schools that can get by fine without it. If someone wants to send their children to a private school, then fine -- that's their decision. But they shouldn't expect the government to pay for it. Private schools can generally discriminate on the basis or religion, socio-economic status, ability and so forth. If they want to do that, then fine -- they can pay for it themselves and stop running public schools into the ground by siphoning off their best students and funding that they so desperately need. |
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| rez |
my vote goes to arctic :)
matt_a, the world sucks dude... howard and latham both suck.. although latham is the lesser of the two evils.. |
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| lethal |
Do you people HONESTLY believe that the economy is going to be greatly affected based on who is in power???
I honestly would like to know who believes that - cause ill know to ignore the rest of your posts cause you've obviously got less brains then the cockroach i just squashed! |
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| batemanscott |
Let's just be grateful we all have a choice and a right to vote. Liberal or labour at least we can piss them off after a few years if we aren't happy :D
And Lethal even a rumour can greatly affect the economy so don't be so foolish to think that a ruling government can not... feel free to ignore my posts.;) |
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| Romp |
| quote: | | Equality, e ing quality. If I hear it once more. If we should all be equal, WHY THE SHOULD I BOTHER WORKING HARD! WHY SHOULD I TRY AT SCHOOL? WHAT INCENTIVE IS THERE TO TRY AND DO WELL IN LIFE! |
it's about equality of opportunity, not absolute equality. So that everyone, if they work hard or have some talents, have the opportunity to make something of their life. To do this they need first and foremost a good, free or affordable education.
I went to an exclusive private school and trust me, the top schools like the GPS schools do not need ANY funding for the government, every student is paying 17 grand a year in fees ffs! When there are people struggling in absolutely schools just because their parents cant afford to send them to a private school its ridiculous to be giving top private schools taxpayers money.
Regarding labor giving control back to the Unions, I dont think they have released their industrial relations policy yet so lets wait and see. I seriously doubt Labor will do anything to jeapordise economic growth. |
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| batemanscott |
| quote: | Originally posted by Romp
I went to an exclusive private school and trust me, the top schools like the GPS schools do not need ANY funding for the government, every student is paying 17 grand a year in fees ffs! When there are people struggling in absolutely schools just because their parents cant afford to send them to a private school its ridiculous to be giving top private schools taxpayers money. |
Whilst i completely agree with you and labour on this one try to remember that those parents^^ are still taxpayers to, in fact probably contribute more to taxation ( through spending admittably ) ALL schools should be given the same then let them do the rest.
Not really fair to penalise people for being successful. They already pay a higher percentage of what they earn, the school their kids go to should not get more or less funding than others.
I'm a liberal voter but i'll admit they have a totally ed education system. |
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| pkcRAISTLIN |
| quote: | Originally posted by batemanscott
Whilst i completely agree with you and labour on this one try to remember that those parents^^ are still taxpayers to, in fact probably contribute more to taxation ( through spending admittably ) ALL schools should be given the same then let them do the rest.
Not really fair to penalise people for being successful. They already pay a higher percentage of what they earn, the school their kids go to should not get more or less funding than others. |
Private schools shouldnt receive any govt funding at all- they're a business after all. Whilst youre right when you say "They already pay a higher percentage of what they earn...Not really fair to penalise people for being successful" the flip side is that you penalise poorer children, who's parents pay taxes that subsidise elite schools that they can't afford to send their children to. I dont think thats particularly equitable.
any system that engenders a profit from education is disgusting imo. |
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| Trance Nutter |
| quote: | Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN
Private schools shouldnt receive any govt funding at all- they're a business after all. Whilst youre right when you say "They already pay a higher percentage of what they earn...Not really fair to penalise people for being successful" the flip side is that you penalise poorer children, who's parents pay taxes that subsidise elite schools that they can't afford to send their children to. I dont think thats particularly equitable. |
Hold on, what about the flip side of your example?
Parents who send their kids to private schools are also tax payers, why should they subsidise public education? Don't their kids have a RIGHT to be entitled to funding that their parents pay for?
When I first heard labour had a new policy to take money away from private schools (thats all I heard on a newsbreak), I thought ", this is gonna be a massive up". Although I haven't really had the time to study it, the redistibution idea they have come up with seems like a good idea. Not every private school is a Kings or Scotch, so to divert some (I wouldn't agree with all or even a major part) funding from these schools to the poorer schools seems to be a good idea.
I went to a private school, we fundraised our arses off to get a new sports centre with pool (which had originally been planned 45 years ago, yes, it took that long to raise the funds), we fundraised our arses off to get a new library, etc. Not everything is handed to these schools on a platter by the government. My parents are not rich, many are not, they made sacrifices to send me to a good school. |
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| pkcRAISTLIN |
| quote: | Originally posted by Trance Nutter
Hold on, what about the flip side of your example?
Parents who send their kids to private schools are also tax payers, why should they subsidise public education? Don't their kids have a RIGHT to be entitled to funding that their parents pay for?
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I went to a private school, we fundraised our arses off to get a new sports centre with pool (which had originally been planned 45 years ago, yes, it took that long to raise the funds), we fundraised our arses off to get a new library, etc. Not everything is handed to these schools on a platter by the government. My parents are not rich, many are not, they made sacrifices to send me to a good school. |
true, you make a good point, *except* that what i am highlighting is that some people dont have the luxury/choice to send their kids to private schools. those that do choose to send their children to private schools have a choice- thus they should still subsidise public education. esp since public education is a right, and private is a privilege. and no, i dont think their children have a right to those tax dollars.
if parents want access to their tax dollars, go public. if a private school exists on its own, well good for it. but we shouldnt be pouring public funding into a system that engenders a two tier (or class) education system.
and yes, you may have "fundraised" your arses off, but thats irrelevent. |
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| Trance Nutter |
Every child has a right to receive government funding for education. I strongly believe that.
My point (and someone elses who I have forgotten) about the fundraising is that the government funding does not go to facilities, if it did we would have had our pool years ago. The funding goes to education (repeat - EDUCATION).
However, remember what I said, not every private school is a Kings or a Scotch. You realise that every denominational school you see is private? Do you know what the fees at many of these schools are? In many cases they are less than $1000/year, some are very low. So you think these schools should not receive any funding? How would they survive in providing low cost education without government funding? There are many (and not just denominational) schools that are very low fee schools, and it is these (from what I can gather) that will be the big beneficiaries from the Labour policy. |
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| rez |
| i was in ESL for seven years. point taken |
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