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Classical music, let's try again shall we
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| DJ Cinos |
I had another topic about this. Now, in that topic, everybody thought I was trashing classical music. That was not the case. Either I'm very bad at writing, or then you just see what you want to see. Namely, I happen to like certain classical.
Now, the whole point of my thread was that modern-day producers can reach up to the complexity level of classical music. I wasn't speaking about talent. Let us leave the whole issue of Shpongle behind.
Now this, here, is my point, and question: Do you not think that ANY modern producers have reached the same level in talent and/or genius as Mozart and his collagues did back then?
(BTW: congratulations to half of TA for not being able to answer to anything without flames) |
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| Dan1584 |
| quote: | | Do you not think that ANY modern producers have reached the same level in talent and/or genius as Mozart and his collagues did back then? |
This is root of your problem. You can't compare the geniusness of classical composers to todays modern artists. It's like comparing a nuclear explosion to a fire cracker.
I think that you should ask the question this way:
Which modern producers do you think are musical geniuses in terms of the way they use modern technology to create music.
If that's what your trying to get at then I can answer that question for you.
Shpongle
Kraftwerk |
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| DJ Cinos |
| quote: | Originally posted by Dan1584
This is root of your problem. You can't compare the geniusness of classical composers to todays modern artists. It's like comparing a nuclear explosion to a fire cracker.
I think that you should ask the question this way:
Which modern producers do you think are musical geniuses in terms of the way they use modern technology to create music.
If that's what your trying to get at then I can answer that question for you.
Shpongle
Kraftwerk |
Let me ask you this, then: Do you think Mozart would surpass for example Shpongle in terms of complexity if he had computers? (and lived to use them?) |
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| eulerfx |
I must say that I do not know of any.
The issue about complexity is difficult to discuss however. What exactly do you mean by complexity? The amount of different sounds, or the complexity of the melody, i.e. non-regularity of note sequences?
Personally I do not think this has a direct correlation with musical genius, in that musical genius is not simple musical intelligence and capacity, but creativity. Moreover, today the use of computers allows complexity to be more easily 'achieved'.
What do you refer to as modern producer? Like electrnoic producer, or just composer? I know of jazz pieces that are akin with the complexity and genius of Mozart, etc. Even pure classical pieces. No edm pieces though; not that I know of. This is not to say that overall musical genius is declining, it simply means it is more difficult to become branded a musical genius with the same respect as Mozart, etc... |
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| Psiweaver |
| Yes because he was able to create amazing complexity in his own head and on paper i couldn't imagine how complex something would be if he had acess to computers. Also lets not forget that most of the music programs are only around because guys like Mozart helped devolop music theory. |
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| Dan1584 |
| quote: | | Let me ask you this, then: Do you think Mozart would surpass for example Shpongle in terms of complexity if he had computers? (and lived to use them?) |
That's like asking...if Babe Ruth were frozen in his prime and then thawed out today, would be still be one of the best baseball players of the game?
Simply put, we will never know. But my guess would be that if Motzart or others studied the technology that they could definetly do great things ahead of their time. |
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| DJ Cinos |
| quote: | Originally posted by eulerfx
I must say that I do not know of any.
The issue about complexity is difficult to discuss however. What exactly do you mean by complexity? The amount of different sounds, or the complexity of the melody, i.e. non-regularity of note sequences?
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What I call complexity is having a lot of sounds/instruments and making them all match and or support each other.
Also, obviously, the non-repetiveness of what one creates with those instruments. |
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| DJ Cinos |
| quote: | Originally posted by Dan1584
That's like asking...if Babe Ruth were frozen in his prime and then thawed out today, would be still be one of the best baseball players of the game?
Simply put, we will never know. But my guess would be that if Motzart or others studied the technology that they could definetly do great things ahead of their time. |
Or we could turn back the question and say it this way: If Simon Posford had lived back then, would he have created music at all, and if he did, would it have been anywhere near Mozart's pieces?
You are right in saying that modern and classic producers cannot be compared, but that is not because the old ones were better, but simply because we do not have any way to compare them, seeing how the world has changed. |
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| flavdave |
| quote: | Originally posted by DJ Cinos
What I call complexity is having a lot of sounds/instruments and making them all match and or support each other. |
For example, an orchestra.
And Mozart did have a computer. It was between his ears. |
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| DJ Cinos |
| quote: | Originally posted by flavdave
For example, an orchestra. |
Yes, but not exclusivelty an orchestra.
| quote: | Originally posted by flavdave
And Mozart did have a computer. It was between his ears. |
Do you think he couldn't do any better with modern technology then? |
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| flavdave |
| quote: | Originally posted by DJ Cinos
Do you think he couldn't do any better with modern technology then? |
No one knows what would happen! |
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| Derivative |
| quote: | | What I call complexity is having a lot of sounds/instruments and making them all match and or support each other. |
this isnt that difficult in itself. its very easy to have lots of instruments match each other. as long as everyone else is aware of what key they are playing in and when someone else changes key then there isnt really any problem. same with scales and modes. i had a little guitar jam yesterday with 2 other guitarists, 1 of which i live with. basically we played some blues in key of F with me on acoustic, the other 2 on electric. i led with some chords and the others just improvised around the key i was playing in. completely made the whole thing up on the spot. as long as i stayed in key of F nothing i could play can sound wrong. i even rattled out a fill based on a lydian scale. no problems. its not difficult. but then ive read music theory (i didnt innovate any of it, im playing off of borrowed concepts)
whats difficult about music is doing something that nobody else has heard before, and blowing everyone away as a consequence. mozart did that centuries ago. in my time people like liam howlett did it. its already easy for me to figure out and transcribe other people's songs. the point is i never thought of writing them in the first place. |
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