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Firefox aims for 10 percent of Web surfers (pg. 9)
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| malek |
| don't kid yourselves, there's only maybe one good programmer out of ten. The other nine will write poor code if they're not well guided by software engineers and project managers. That IS if there's true software engineers in the shop. |
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| rabbitjoker |
Just one day after the Mozilla Foundation released Firefox 1.0, the group has revealed that prior versions of the open-source browser pose a security threat to users. According to information released by Mozilla, multiple security holes have been plugged in all beta versions of Firefox to correct flaws that could lead to security bypass, exposure of sensitive data, privilege escalation and DoS (denial of service) attacks.
Research firm Secunia rates the vulnerabilities as "moderately critical". Mozilla warned that successful exploits could also detect the presence of local files, spoof the file download dialog, or gain escalated privileges on vulnerable machines
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People bitch and moan about MS security this, MS security that...
Face it folks - an computer that is connected to another via any means is vulnerable.
IMO - There is no reason to change browsers simply for security purposes (if you have XP-SP2 installed). |
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| j_spot |
| quote: | Originally posted by rabbitjoker
Face it folks - an computer that is connected to another via any means is vulnerable.
IMO - There is no reason to change browsers simply for security purposes
(if you have XP-SP2 installed). |
I cant install SP2. Style XP changed my boot.ini file, which SP2 needs to run.
Im not so worried about this, I didnt change over security, I changed over stability.
IE crashed, locked and did all other kinds of stupid to my computer all the time. Ive been using Firefox since MidJune/July, and in all that time, Ive had my browser crash twice.
TWICE. Thats unheard of using IE. I cant remember how many times you would have to reboot because of IE just freezing the computer. Not so w/ firefox.
That is why Im impressed. |
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| LoCa |
| quote: | Originally posted by rabbitjoker
Just one day after the Mozilla Foundation released Firefox 1.0, the group has revealed that prior versions of the open-source browser pose a security threat to users. According to information released by Mozilla, multiple security holes have been plugged in all beta versions of Firefox to correct flaws that could lead to security bypass, exposure of sensitive data, privilege escalation and DoS (denial of service) attacks.
Research firm Secunia rates the vulnerabilities as "moderately critical". Mozilla warned that successful exploits could also detect the presence of local files, spoof the file download dialog, or gain escalated privileges on vulnerable machines
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People bitch and moan about MS security this, MS security that...
Face it folks - an computer that is connected to another via any means is vulnerable.
IMO - There is no reason to change browsers simply for security purposes (if you have XP-SP2 installed). |
Few things, the reason they're finding tons of security exploit is because mozilla is actually rewarding people who find them, so people are going in there and finding them.
Also, those are moderately critical vulnarablities, as opposed to extremely critical, which surface in IE fairly often. In addition, i might add that these vulnerablities surfaced in previous versions of mozilla, in other words, the beta versions. IE gets critical vulnerabilties in versions that are out of beta and on the market. |
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| DigiNut |
In Firefox, "multiple security holes" means about 3. Compare that to about 300 in Internet Explorer.
There have been buffer overflow exploits in Linux kernels too, but the point is, they are found quickly, fixed quickly, and patches (or in the case of Firefox, new versions) are released immediately. And as stated earlier, the particular "holes" in Firefox are not gaping holes that "might allow an attacker to take control of your computer" (surely everybody is intimately familiar with those words by now from using Windows/IE).
"Vulnerable" isn't one of these black and white terms that you can say a computer either is or is not. Security comes in 256 full-colour hues of tightness. Firefox is an off-white, while IE is jet black. |
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| Your Mother |
| quote: | Originally posted by DigiNut
Oh no doubt about that, and that's why I peg the blame at 50/50. You have to be fair though, it's really hard for management to make good hiring decisions when colleges and universities are churning out 50,000 graduates a year who write code like
Form5->ListBox3->Items->Objects[atoi(substr(Form1->Edit2->Text, 4, strlen(Form1->Edit2->Text)))]->QR = App_QR1 + lfunc(x - 5, y+z) + 3,
where App_QR1 is declared as a global variable in a unit called "misc.h", which consists of about 100 different totally unrelated variables and functions with equally cryptic names like "pkStFrmShMLA" and "int getMRblkT(PChar *P)" and is in the include section of EVERY SINGLE source file in the ENTIRE PROJECT. Gee, you're having trouble finding the reason you're getting 13 consecutive access violations when you click the "File" menu? I WONDER WHY!!!
So sure, managers have to hire good programmers, but I think when they're confronted with 50 interviews in a row with guys who can barely remember how to write a "hello world" program let alone write a worker thread, they just assume that all the candidates are like that and give up.
I got a kick out of this essay, by a Microsoft MVP:
http://www.flounder.com/bricks.htm
Goes to show you the quality of labour these days. It's really sad, and yes, part of the problem lies with lazy short-sighted managers, but a MUCH bigger part of the problem lies with the crummy world of academia.
And code is NOT either "decent" or "not decent", there are certainly gray areas. Sometimes you have to cut corners to meet deadlines, but knowing which corners to cut is an art too! Some pieces you can afford to hack together, others you can't. Cut every corner and you'll eventually wind up going in circles. ;) |
You talk like there's a wealth of real programming talent out there which is total bull. It sometimes takes companies up to 6 months to find a really good programmer that can contribute to their team as a whole.
And to blame it on the way the schools teach is a load of crap too... The best schools in the world still pump out ty programmers. Are you trying to tell me MIT, Berkeley, Stanford, Carnegie Mellon... have ty educations? Or aren't doing things right? They still produce alot of junk along with the good programmers that make it through.
Being a good programmer is 50% passion, 25% patience, and 25% knowledge. Alot of the people who graduate with a CS education just lack the passion.
-Your Mother |
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| rabbitjoker |
| quote: | Originally posted by Your Mother
Alot of the people ... just lack the passion. |
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| Your Mother |
| quote: | Originally posted by DigiNut
Form5->ListBox3->Items->Objects[atoi(substr(Form1->Edit2->Text, 4, strlen(Form1->Edit2->Text)))]->QR = App_QR1 + lfunc(x - 5, y+z) + 3,
where App_QR1 is declared as a global variable in a unit called "misc.h", which consists of about 100 different totally unrelated variables and functions with equally cryptic names like "pkStFrmShMLA" and "int getMRblkT(PChar *P)" and is in the include section of EVERY SINGLE source file in the ENTIRE PROJECT. Gee, you're having trouble finding the reason you're getting 13 consecutive access violations when you click the "File" menu? I WONDER WHY!!! |
When like this happens, you are just as much to blame. Where is your testing infrastructure and test code to make sure problems like this don't occur. Why wasn't the developer educated about the importance of writing test classes to exercise this code. Why isn't the developer reprimanded for things like this. Why wasn't it code reviewed? Even if this is a fabricated example, you've obviously seem similar real examples. If so, then why didn't you explain to the person who wrote it what is wrong with it?
-Your Mother |
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| LoCa |
| quote: |
Microsoft probing reported flaws in Windows XP SP2
Microsoft Corp. yesterday said it is investigating claims that several new vulnerabilities have been found in Windows XP Service Pack 2 by security firm Finjan Software Inc. in San Jose. Finjan on Tuesday announced that it had found as many as 10 "serious" flaws in SP2.
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"By exploiting all vulnerabilities discovered in SP2 by Finjan, attackers can silently and remotely take over an SP2 machine when the user simply browses a Web page," the company said in a statement.
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Full article here
Once again proving that IE's marriage into the OS leaves windows like (to quote someone else) "a piece of swiss cheese". |
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| rabbitjoker |
| quote: | Originally posted by LoCa
Once again proving that IE's marriage into the OS leaves windows like (to quote someone else) "a piece of swiss cheese". |
Selective quoting, huh?
You left out this part:
"Our early analysis indicates that Finjan's claims are potentially misleading and possibly erroneous regarding the breadth and severity of the alleged vulnerabilities in Windows XP SP2," the Microsoft statement said.
If any valid vulnerability is found in Windows XP SP2, Microsoft said it will take "immediate and appropriate action to help protect customers." |
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| LoCa |
| quote: | Originally posted by rabbitjoker
Selective quoting, huh?
You left out this part:
"Our early analysis indicates that Finjan's claims are potentially misleading and possibly erroneous regarding the breadth and severity of the alleged vulnerabilities in Windows XP SP2," the Microsoft statement said.
If any valid vulnerability is found in Windows XP SP2, Microsoft said it will take "immediate and appropriate action to help protect customers." |
I posted the link to the article didn't i?
And of course MS is going to deny it right now. Are you kidding me? With FireFox having come out not more than a week ago, they're not going to go out and say that their browser is the cause for XP SP2 users having to fear their pc being taken over. God knows i'd deny it too if i were them. |
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