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Pay up! Tolls may be coming to downtown streets (pg. 2)
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| Jayx1 |
| quote: | Originally posted by k la
Somewhat ironic coming from a person that obviously supports increased car usage... |
I do?
No i support increased fluidity for commuting whether your choice is by car or by transit. If transit was an option in Toronto (a real option) id use it.
But its just not conevenient and the schedules dont run properly. |
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| Jayx1 |
| quote: | Originally posted by infinity HiGH
I think the question is: How many have YOU been on?
Our transit system is "good" at best. |
id say more like average |
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| tw1tch |
| This is a crock, there are no good alternatives. Comparing our situation to London is so far out in left field. As the article says, they actually have an amazing public transit system, puts our to absolute shame. But the worst part about this idea, the system in London loses money, they don't make anything from collecting these tolls. |
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| Jayx1 |
| what really ed this city is when they killed the allen expressway and the scarborough expressway in the 70s |
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| k la |
| quote: | Originally posted by infinity HiGH
I think the question is: How many have YOU been on?
Our transit system is "good" at best. |
Washington, New Orleans, Salt Lake City, Lexington, Vancouver, Calgary, Edmonton, Kelowna, Peterborough, Seoul, Jakarta, Yogjakarta...
We have a great priced system, that allows you to get where you want to go. Taking into consideration the dramatic growth of the city and funding, the TTC has gone a long way. |
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| abort416 |
| quote: | Originally posted by k la
This is a GREAT idea. We have an incredible transit system and we should be using it. Why not have some kind of tolls, and use that money to further fund our transit system???
How many other transit systems have you been on? Go to Washington, you will swear the TTC is a personal limo afterwards. |
the ttc is a terrible transit system. the subway lines dont even go all the way north up to what is supposed to be toronto -- steeles avenue instead the furthest north is finch which is just ridiculous. the subway doesnt even run past 130am and the last time to serve alcohol is at 2am. hell most clubs dont even begin to close until 4.
i have been on the washington d.c. transit system which is really a beautiful system with carpets on the floors. and they have lines that cover the entire city unlike toronto. i dont know how you think the dirty ttc trains can be considered a personal limo but maybe you are the type of person who prefers a ride in a rickshaw to a ride in a bentely. |
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| Jayx1 |
| quote: | Originally posted by k la
Washington, New Orleans, Salt Lake City, Lexington, Vancouver, Calgary, Edmonton, Kelowna, Peterborough, Seoul, Jakarta, Yogjakarta...
We have a great priced system, that allows you to get where you want to go. Taking into consideration the dramatic growth of the city and funding, the TTC has gone a long way. |
Show me a real city out of all those small towns
Paris, Buenos Aires, New York, London, Athens, Rome, Amsterdam.
All good examples
I suspect seoul has a decent system |
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| infinity HiGH |
| quote: | Originally posted by k la
Washington, New Orleans, Salt Lake City, Lexington, Vancouver, Calgary, Edmonton, Kelowna, Peterborough, Seoul, Jakarta, Yogjakarta...
We have a great priced system, that allows you to get where you want to go. Taking into consideration the dramatic growth of the city and funding, the TTC has gone a long way. |
No disrespect to any of those cities but you can't even begin to compare them to Toronto.
Look at NY, London, Budapest, or any MAJOR city in their respective countries. Their subway system is there to get you around quickly, and efficiently. The TTC just gets you around. This city needs at least 2 more lines. And extend the Bloor line closer to Sauga. |
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| Jayx1 |
What we were supposed to have built in the 70s (note the subway extensions that never happened also)
What we ended up with:
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| Jayx1 |
A histroy of unchecked nimbyism which is why i cant stand people who complain about living in a city. Nimbyism has destroyed the transportation grid of toronto forever.
And it looks like at the rate we are going we are only going to make things WORSE!
| quote: | 1966 METROPOLITAN TORONTO TRANSPORTATION PLAN
The first draft transportation plan for the Toronto area, showing new highways and rapid transit, was drawn up in 1943. However, serious planning for the Toronto area took place after the creation of Metropolitan Toronto in 1953, resulting in a Draft Official Plan in 1958, which showed new expressways and subways. This was refined into a second Draft Official Plan in 1964, and finally adopted as the Official Plan in 1966.
The 1966 Official Plan called for a balanced transportation system of roads and transit. It included making the arterial road system continuous by filling in missing links and the construction of a grid system of expressways to take through traffic off local streets. It also included new subways in the higher density areas, mostly in the central city, and lakeshore commuter rail. The expressway system included the Provincial Highways, run by the Ontario Ministry of Transportation, which included Highways 400, 401, 27 (later 427) and the Queen Elizabeth Way. It was later expanded to include Highways 409, 404, 407, 410 and 403. Municipal Expressways included the Frederick G. Gardiner Expressway, the Don Valley Parkway and the Spadina Expressway. Plans called for the Spadina Expressway (renamed William R. Allen Expressway in 1969) to be extended south into downtown Toronto, the Frederick G. Gardiner Expressway to be extended through the east end of the City and across Scarborough to join Highway 401 (the extension was referred to as the Scarborough Expressway). These would be followed by the Highway 400 Extension south to the Gardiner Expressway, and the Crosstown Expressway and the Richview Expressway across the middle of the city. Extensions of the Yonge and Bloor subways were planned and Queen and Spadina subways were planned also. A lakeshore commuter rail line, known as GO transit, was also introduced.
After construction was scheduled and begun, a huge protest against the further extension of the Spadina (William R. Allen) Expressway, led by urban sociologist Jane Jacobs, resulted in the Province intervening and cancelling further construction of the expressway in 1971. This led to the downfall of the 1966 transportation plan. A Transportation Plan Review was set up in 1972 and presented its recommendations for a revised plan in 1975. Metropolitan Toronto then tried to proceed with construction of the Scarborough Expressway (F.G. Gardiner Expressway extension), but met with similar opposition.
A new Official Plan was adopted in 1980, which contained a clause stating that construction of new expressways was no longer supported by Metropolitan Toronto. The proposed expressways from the 1966 Plan were deleted. This new 1980 Plan shifted the emphasis from a balanced form of transportation to one based solely on public transit. The Queen Street Subway was deleted in favour of the development of suburban transit development, and the Crosstown Expressway was deleted. The Spadina Expressway would stop permanently at Eglinton Avenue West; the Highway 400 Extension was shrunk down to an arterial road, known as Black Creek Drive, and the Scarborough and Richview Expressways became undefined transportation corridors. Many new GO commuter rail lines were added and light rail transit was built in Scarborough from the east end of the Bloor-Danforth subway line.
Many people did not trust the undefined transportation corridors and believed that they were just proposed expressways disguised to make them more acceptable. Whenever Metropolitan Toronto tried to acquire more lands for these corridors, particularly the Scarborough route, it met with public opposition. In 1994, another plan revision was carried out and another new Official Plan was adopted. The undefined transportation corridors were deleted. Sheppard and Eglinton Subways were added to the plan and a Leslie Street Extension, originally proposed in the 1966 Plan, was retained to help to relieve the congested Don Valley Parkway.
Public opposition bogged the Leslie Street Extension down in extensive environmental assessments, eventually leading to it being shelved. Construction of the Eglinton Subway was begun in 1995 and then stopped due to cutbacks in Provincial funding, and the Sheppard Subway was built by 2002. The eastern end of the elevated Gardiner Expressway, originally meant to continue as the Scarborough Expressway, was demolished in 2001, as no longer needed, since the Scarborough route had been deleted.
After the amalgamation of Metropolitan Toronto into a single City of Toronto in 1998, a new Official Plan was needed. In 2002, the City of Toronto adopted a new Official Plan, which contains a transportation policy. This plan calls for one million more people to live in the city with higher density development, but with no new road improvements and only an expansion of on-street streetcars everywhere across the city, in their own rights-of-way, mostly taken from existing road space, hoping to achieve a 20% switch from cars to transit. A Front Street extension was included, but only as a way of taking traffic off the Gardiner Expressway, so that the elevated central section could be demolished and replaced by a smaller tunnelled road. The Front Street extension was built, but high costs prevented the demolition of the central Gardiner Expressway from happening.
A new comprehensive balanced transportation plan for Toronto, the first since 1966, called 'The Mobility Express' has been drawn up in 2004 by the Canadian Automobile Association (CAA) which includes new expressways in existing corridors, filling in missing links in the arterial road network, new subway extensions and new bicycle trails. Click on the 'CAA Plan' link below to view it.
This page presents the proposed routes in the original 1966 transportation plan, which was meant to guide the City’s development until the year 2000. The ‘Get Toronto Moving’ plan is an update of the 1966 Plan, meant to put Toronto on a more successful course by solving transportation problems and eliminating the resulting traffic gridlock from the proposed elements of the 1966 Plan not being implemented.
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| k la |
| quote: | Originally posted by abort416
the ttc is a terrible transit system. the subway lines dont even go all the way north up to what is supposed to be toronto -- steeles avenue instead the furthest north is finch which is just ridiculous. the subway doesnt even run past 130am and the last time to serve alcohol is at 2am. hell most clubs dont even begin to close until 4.
i have been on the washington d.c. transit system which is really a beautiful system with carpets on the floors. and they have lines that cover the entire city unlike toronto. i dont know how you think the dirty ttc trains can be considered a personal limo but maybe you are the type of person who prefers a ride in a rickshaw to a ride in a bentely. |
It’s really tragic that the TTC can’t accommodate every drunken tool past last call... last I checked the world doesn’t revolve around a fraction of the population. It would be incredibly stupid to run a line at a major cost just so some club goers can get home... they had enough money to waste on the luxury of booze then they can afford a cab, or wait for the vomit commit like everyone else.
The Washington dc line is great??? Smoke crack much? I think it’s really wonderful that the touristy areas have these plush buses you talk of, but for the working person in that city they have a non-existent line. The system is not safe and doesn’t provide near the service in the areas of wealth. But I’m sure you’ve lived in the luxury of having money and not being a minority faced with environmental racism...
While we may not have the greatest system, we still have a great system. It could be MILES worse, we really have nothing to complain about… but of course it’s so typical for those that live in excess to be unsatisfied and continue to take at the expense of the poor. |
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