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digital djs.. a question about organization (pg. 3)
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| Dirk W. |
| quote: | Originally posted by trancinchink
that won't do crap to the sound quality if it was already an mp3
i've spun in clubs using mp3 format, and it sounded fine to me... i asked my friends who were on the dancefloor, sounded fine to them... i think as long as you get a legitimite copy of the file, then it'll sound fine in a club.
i'd also like to add that it wasn't a small club either... i dunno where u guys are getting this information that mp3's sound like crap |
first of all, for the record, i never said it did anything for the sound quality. slow down.
I convert it to wav for other reasons. first of all, my technics like wavs over mp3s. they read better, show me time remaining, all sorts of stuff that they dont do with mp3. thats why i convert. It's for their sake.
And yes, i agree with you on the sound quality part. A lightly compressed mp3 doesnt lack all this sound quality all you "audiophiles" whack your little puds to. Complain all you want. 99% of the people (ie: not the "audiophiles") can't tell the difference and that is who I am catering to. |
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| tvmann |
Anyone concerned about what bitrate of mp3 is sufficient should make some test mp3s from their own CDs and run comparisons. Download the demo version of Traktor maybe, I think it's still available, and you can put the wav version of a track in one virtual deck and put an mp3 in the other deck. Get both decks synced up and then use the crossfader to switch back and forth between the 2 file formats and try to hear the difference.
Most people will not be able to tell the difference between a 192 mp3 and the wav file. But the comparison will be different for various people depending on their hearing ability.
I use mp3s that are encoded by Exact Audio Copy using VBR - the Lame "alt preset standard" setting which goes up to 320 kbps when necessary. I have over a thousand mp3s personally encoded and there's not one where I can tell the difference from the wav file. I'm fussy and have checked many times, looking for an excuse to go to a higher bitrate but I haven't found any problem with these mp3s.
My sound goes through an Echo Audio 24 bit capable sound card and I monitor with Sennheiser HD280 headphones, and now have a Bryston 4B amplifier on loan (current model is about $3000). I have mid-quality speakers.
Once you reach a certain level of mp3 quality, you have what is called "transparency" - meaning the mp3 and the original CD sound identical to a listener and further increases in bitrate cannot improve on that. |
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| DJ 00 Tommy |
| I havnt been djing for a long time and iv never djed in a club but in most clubs around where i live the soundsystem is so loud that you wouldnt be able to notice qualty or anything most of what you can hear is just the bass anyway. At home i can only very very slighty hear a difference between 192 and 320. |
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| DjJade |
great discussion and thanks for all the good info
at the moment i cannot think of much else to say or ask. its true that cds have been in clubs for a long time, but downloaded/compressed material has not.
yes, mp3s have been around for a while but they were not widely available until recently (meaning, broadband and bandwith and storage are getting cheaper) even then, there isnt as much of a selection, cdr or download and by cdr i mean WIDELY AVAILABLE SELECTION
not everyone knows a famous producer.
brings me to another issue: the business. i think the normal/bedroom djs are the ones buying the records or am i mistaken? i am looking at a boom of djing in the mainstream media, the emergence of cheaper equipment (cdj200 is a perfect example) that makes it much easier for more people to get involved in it.
i think the business is on the road to being more standardized and with the attitude of preserving the status quo, or using whatever works, or whatver the dancefloor cares about.... is not high enough for me. furthermore, if people on the dancefloor are used to hearing ordinary quality, they come to expect nothing better, thus it becomes a bad cycle..... i think if we (the primary market) are content with less, thats exactly what we get: less.
i would pesonally like to hear more about what others think about this. this is not a question of what medium is better... its already here so its really a question of how we make the best out of every medium. |
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| DjJade |
so i purchased the following:
Digital Witchcraft - Fingerpaint - Original Mix.mp3
Digital Witchcraft - Fingerpaint - Original Mix.m4a
the difference is pretty aparent. i prefer the mp4, smoother and more open sounding... i dont know the technicalities nor do i have time to research right now but it sounds like the mp4 has a higher response before the treble starts to roll off. all over smoother, seems more transparent and uniform. especially in the bass area, the mp3 has a harsher and less refined sound.
listening through m-audio revolution and etymotic er-4s headphones. |
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| DJ-Igloo |
I will decied what I want on my cds
this is how I organize my cdrs
All 320 kbps format
I do 5 tracks per cd
I organize the tracks by bpm and burn them and right the bpm on the cds Then make back up copies of each cd. |
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| adx |
My brother mixes on M5Gs and is always in search for music. When I decided to pick up a set of CDJs, we started a vinyl fund between the both of us. Most of my material is ripped from vinyl, and have purchased from online MP3 stores before (Beatport is my fav).
As for organizing, much how everyone else does it. I cram as many tracks as I can and burn 2 copies. I number them and also write the genre on the disc. Then write the tracklist on an indexcard and put it all in a cd wallet that have sleeves on the opposite side of the disc.
When Im spinning sometimes, and dont know what I want to spin, I just pick a disc randomly and use the cd text function on the 1000s. |
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| Pinokio |
| quote: | Originally posted by CosmoKid
mp3s are a compressed file format. in order to compress a file, some aspects of the track must be removed. usually it starts with the high highs, and the low lows. but even what you hear is still compressed.
mp3s lose their brightness, for lack of a technical term. :conf:
if you listen to satellite radio, you hear it in that as well. XM or sirius send out the music in a compressed format in order to take up less bandwidth.
mp3s lose the warmness you hear on less compressed formats. |
I think this is a Myth.
it's true that is a compressed format, but i can bet that,If I show you to same cds , one in wav and the other in a good mp3 rip (192 kbps and above), you wont be able to recognize the difference. |
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| Pinokio |
| quote: | Originally posted by DjJade
mp3s defintily sound like crap
even cdr in wav sounds like crap
something about cds make them sound so harsh. there have been many times where i am at a club...even a small one and the music is hurting my ears. i look over and see the dj spinning a track from the cdj. then when he puts a record back on, it sounds ok again. and the meters on the mixer were running the same between the two tracks
but anyway again...... does someone with experience want to tell me if there is a big difference between downloaded 320kbps mp3s, wmas, and mail order wave?
anyone know of other stores besides edmdigital where you can get .flac files? |
Mate I think you are wrong here, you got this idea that cds sounds like crap, and you feel it like that. you got to free your mind
I mean, its true that vinyl sound slightly better than cd's, but each time you plays it it get drecrease the osudn quality of the vinyl, its gets affected by the ambience drastically, so in short time it will sound the same or worse than a cd.
if what you think were true profeesional dj's would trash Cdr. |
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| DjJade |
not necessarily becuase there is more to what djs look for than just quality. i speak from personal experience and preference. i am not saying that vinyl is better then cds for djing, i just prefer the vinyl sound. that has no implication about quality. you cant say that i am wrong about what i prefer. i simply prefer it. you also cannot say it is psychological becuase it sounded like crap first, which made me want to know why.... so i looked to see what was going on in the booth and saw that he was playing a cd. regardless of what was on the cd, i did not like how it sounded.
plus, if i didnt like it that much, i would not be considering to get cds. i already made that choice, now i want to know what is better within the digital medium. what is a better format with ragards to quality, size compatibility and ease of use, and also what is the best way to handle and organize them. |
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| jam.iii |
i buy my digital tracks from beatport, every one of them has been 320k. Burn as many of them onto a CD as I can fit, regardless of genre. Then I label the CD's by number and I print out a listing of the tracks on each CD. I don't seperate by genre because this way if I am in the middle of a trance set for instance, there is more likely a chance that 2 songs I want to play back to back would be on the same CD... burning all tracks together eliminates this. Of course I could just burn 2 copies, but with the size of my collection as is, this would end up costing me a lot of money for CDR's.
Also to make referencing easier, I label the CD's / Tracklistings according to quarters in the year by the date I bought and downloaded the track. Qtr 1 - Winter, Qtr 2 - Spring, Qtr 3 - Summer, Qtr 4 - Fall. Each quarter has its own CD case. This just makes it easier to remember where each track would be.
And my 2c to add to the mp3 thing.. I would challenge any of you guys who are saying mp3's aren't as good @ 320k's to be able to identify whats being left out with the naked ear. Sure, in THEORY the signal is being compressed, even minutely @ 320ks, but for the most part those frequencies are beyond what the human ear can hear. So you can bring back this arguement when its valid... when your mixing a club full of dogs :p But seriously, for the people who want to make an issue out of this just spend more money and have the WAV CD mailed to you. Unless I noticeably hear something different in the track that makes me go "ugh..." I will save my money, get the 320k and buy more tracks with it:toocool: |
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| Nemesis44 |
I spin a lot of bought MP3 files these days along side demos from producers etc. and have found that yes there is some difference in sound quality but to be honest, you don't always play on a good sound system anyways so sound quality is out of the window a lot of times.
I play a lot of 600 to 700 capacity clubs and have found that I don't really have issues with the quality of MP3s as they do the job just fine.
Don't forget there is a lot of people noise and other acoustics that play a part.
They do the job and if it helps get you that track that you just haven't been able to find on vinyl, why not.
I don't believe in pirated MP3s on the other hand.
Go for it and enjoy. Technology should be the DJs friend. Not the other way around.
Cheers
Nem |
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