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Vegie or Non Vegie (pg. 8)
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| Moral Hazard |
| quote: | Originally posted by Skipper
Did you know that the resources needed to raise animals for human consumption could solve world hunger if they were used differently? |
We could also solve world hunger without changing a damned thing by way of the allocation of resources if producers were willing to give away their surpluses and states or NGOs were willing to pay for the transportation thereof. Additionally, we could solve world hunger if people stopped breading in areas where the environment cannot support the existing population. We could also solve world hunger by cutting off all aid to those who are ill and/or starving in the third world and just letting them die off all-together. It seems none of those things will happen though because people are too greedy, too self-interested, and have too much pity for others (respectively to the solutions) to take the necessary actions. |
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| EvilTree |
| quote: | Originally posted by English Rachel
Cruelty is unneccessary whether it is to your fellow man or other living creature. Period. |
Mother Nature is so cruel sometimes.
Just ask a gazelle being hunted by lion.
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Now follow me and hug a tree, the world will be a better place for it :D |
<---an evil tree ;) |
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| Skipper |
| quote: | Originally posted by Moral Hazard
We could also solve world hunger without changing a damned thing by way of the allocation of resources if producers were willing to give away their surpluses and states or NGOs were willing to pay for the transportation thereof. Additionally, we could solve world hunger if people stopped breading in areas where the environment cannot support the existing population. We could also solve world hunger by cutting off all aid to those who are ill and/or starving in the third world and just letting them die off all-together. It seems none of those things will happen though because people are too greedy, too self-interested, and have too much pity for others (respectively to the solutions) to take the necessary actions. |
but as an individual, you need to consider what you have control over and how you contribute to either the problem or the solution. Furthermore, global solutions must be balanced with what is humanitarian and what is realistic.
It is not reasonable to expect people to stop breeding and it is not humanitarian to let starving populations around the world eliminate themselves.
The difference between the way the human population hunts its food and the way other animals in the wild hunt their food is that the human race dramatically exploits the animal population to do so. Animals in the wild make do with what is already there. To claim there are any similarities between animals hunting each other in the wild and humans eating meat is simply ignorant. |
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| English Rachel |
| quote: | Originally posted by Skipper
The difference between the way the human population hunts its food and the way other animals in the wild hunt their food is that the human race dramatically exploits the animal population to do so. Animals in the wild make do with what is already there. To claim there are any similarities between animals hunting each other in the wild and humans eating meat is simply ignorant. |
+ a bajillion |
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| Moral Hazard |
| quote: | Originally posted by Skipper
but as an individual, you need to consider what you have control over and how you contribute to either the problem or the solution. Furthermore, global solutions must be balanced with what is humanitarian and what is realistic.
It is not reasonable to expect people to stop breeding and it is not humanitarian to let starving populations around the world eliminate themselves. |
I would argue that it is also not reasonable for persons starving due to lack of resources to remain complacent in their strife nor is it reasonable to expect others to come to your aid.
I would also argue that allowing the starving populations to "eliminate themselves" is more compassionate then applying band-aid solutions as we are doing today. If the populations of those areas inhospitable to human habitation were allowed to perish then the suffering would stop with the present generation rather then continuing generation after generation in perpituity.
| quote: | | The difference between the way the human population hunts its food and the way other animals in the wild hunt their food is that the human race dramatically exploits the animal population to do so. Animals in the wild make do with what is already there. To claim there are any similarities between animals hunting each other in the wild and humans eating meat is simply ignorant. |
I agree with you here. That said, it is exactly our farming practices (including the domestication and harvesting of animals) that has allowed us to reach the level of progress and diversification that we presently enjoy. Without this we would simply be a somewhat unique animal in that we can fashion and use tools, however, all of our other advances would be non-existant as no scavenger (which is what we were prior to farming) has the free time necessary to either advance or store knowledge thus they do not have the free time to progress their species. |
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| *~LiSa-LoO~* |
| quote: | Originally posted by Stingray
You love it. |
He loves it so much he even puts it on his spaghetti |
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| Cosmic Fur |
| quote: | Originally posted by English Rachel
Now do NOT get me started on fur. |
Bugger off. :p
Here is my reasoning why all out vegetarianism because of poor conditions for animals is a very inconsistent ideal: Rach, you say it's because these animals suffer while in the pens. Fine. But so does a huge chunk of African (and other thirld-world countries) population. Now from my point of view, if I don't care about Africans dying in Africa because of poor living conditions enough to send them all my disposable income, then it certainly seems silly and even hypocritical to care about some cow and its poor living conditions. Is a cow more important than an African? And why doesn't anyone criticise me for going to Guv and blowing close to $100 in one night when that money could have just as easily been better allocated by sending it to some poor shmuck in Africa?
Not to mention that we're made to eat meat. If we didn't, we would have never made it out of caveman-ages. Yes, I can not eat meat for a while. I can hop on one foot for a while too. That doesn't mean it's a good idea for everybody to replace walking with hopping on one foot.
I'm not anti-vegetarian. You guys can eat whatever you want for whatever reasons you dream up. I'm anti-vegetarians-telling-me-to-be-vegetarian. The shoe that fits you doesn't fit everybody. |
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| Skipper |
| quote: | Originally posted by Moral Hazard
I would argue that it is also not reasonable for persons starving due to lack of resources to remain complacent in their strife nor is it reasonable to expect others to come to your aid.
I would also argue that allowing the starving populations to "eliminate themselves" is more compassionate then applying band-aid solutions as we are doing today. |
Remind me never to vote for you if you're running for office one day.
Your moniker is remarkably suitable. |
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| VERTiG0 |
| quote: | Originally posted by *~LiSa-LoO~*
He loves it so much he even puts it on his spaghetti |
THAT WAS A MISTAKE OKAY |
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| Moral Hazard |
| quote: | Originally posted by Skipper
Remind me never to vote for you if you're running for office one day.
Your moniker is remarkably suitable. |
Yes I suppose it is much better that we allow hundreds of thousands of people to suffer not just today but forever rather then us feeling guilty for their demise. The problem here is that people pity these persons. Because we pity them we want to make alieviate their suffering. Unfortunately we are not willing to make the sacrafices necessary to actually solve their problems so instead we make token gestures that while serving to lessen the severity of their suffering also serves to prolong their suffering. We do this under the misguided believe that all life is good and is worth living, well, I for one would rather be dead then live with the agonizing pain of constant hunger and the torment of endless cycles of disease. |
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| darouge11 |
| just take it from the video from simpsons....if a cow got the chance to eat you.....Ralph wanted to graduate from bouvine university |
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| English Rachel |
| quote: | Originally posted by Cosmic Fur
Bugger off. :p
Here is my reasoning why all out vegetarianism because of poor conditions for animals is a very inconsistent ideal: Rach, you say it's because these animals suffer while in the pens. Fine. But so does a huge chunk of African (and other thirld-world countries) population. Now from my point of view, if I don't care about Africans dying in Africa because of poor living conditions enough to send them all my disposable income, then it certainly seems silly and even hypocritical to care about some cow and its poor living conditions. Is a cow more important than an African? And why doesn't anyone criticise me for going to Guv and blowing close to $100 in one night when that money could have just as easily been better allocated by sending it to some poor shmuck in Africa?
Not to mention that we're made to eat meat. If we didn't, we would have never made it out of caveman-ages. Yes, I can not eat meat for a while. I can hop on one foot for a while too. That doesn't mean it's a good idea for everybody to replace walking with hopping on one foot.
I'm not anti-vegetarian. You guys can eat whatever you want for whatever reasons you dream up. I'm anti-vegetarians-telling-me-to-be-vegetarian. The shoe that fits you doesn't fit everybody. |
And if you notice, my darling, I have never nor would never tell anyone to be veggie. It is my personal religion that I believe in. If you read my posts earlier, you would see that I MADE my parents buy free range meat which means that I didn't try and turn them veggie. Nor did I turn any of my boyfs veggie! I have even been know to cook a bacon butty on a Sat morning! Just because it is my belief doesn't mean I expect others to follow it BUT NEITHER DO I EXPECT PEOPLE TO GIVE ME FOR SOMETHING THAT IS DEAR TO ME!!!!
I do send money to Africa too. Let me remind you also that the world gets changed one step at a time and if we all thought that we couldn't make a difference, nothing good would be done.... ever!!! Stop being defeatest or making excuses :P
As for being 'made to eat meat', I can guarantee you that we are 'made' to eat a small portion of meat a couple of times a week (which is how often we would have caught it back in the day). I am very healthy, lacking in iron slightly but I try and rectify that without consuming blood but other than that, a good veggie diet is exceptionally good for you - rub my skin and hair next time you see me ;)
And fur farming is more than terrible, more shocking and disgusting than your wildest imagination can allow. I promise you. |
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