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Amazing Side-Chained Pad (pg. 2)
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| Enigmatic XTC |
| quote: | Originally posted by thoughtlessjex
But that's not a gate. It's sidechained. The gain reduction is tied to the kick's amplitude, not a midi automation. And the method of gain reduction will have nothing to do with the richness of the sound. If you want a richer sound, use choruses, use unison, use detuning. Then sidechain the pad. There's not much else I can say. |
It probably is sidechained in the example, but the same effect could be attained using a gate. Something like mgTriggerGate (which is free by the way) could easily make this sound. Just raise the threshold to the desired level, then adjust the attack and release times. You should get essentially the exact same sound. |
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| thoughtlessjex |
| quote: | Originally posted by Enigmatic XTC
It probably is sidechained in the example, but the same effect could be attained using a gate. Something like mgTriggerGate (which is free by the way) could easily make this sound. Just raise the threshold to the desired level, then adjust the attack and release times. You should get essentially the exact same sound. |
No, it's not the same effect. It doesn't have the same transients as a kick, and it probably releases linearly, while kicks tend to release logarithmically. Furthermore, sidechaining only triggers above certain control signal amplitudes, while gating triggers immediately. Gating's trigger response is linear while sidechain compression's is generally logarithmic or hyperbolic. To the casual listener, maybe it sounds the same, but it's not.
It also looks like mgTriggerGate can't toggle through patterns, so if your kick does any fills, you're screwed. |
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| T-Soma |
| quote: | Originally posted by thoughtlessjex
It also looks like mgTriggerGate can't toggle through patterns, so if your kick does any fills, you're screwed. |
Does anyone have a list of all mgTriggerGate's CCs?
I had to spend ages just to find what midi message changes the threshold. |
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| Fledz |
| quote: | Originally posted by thoughtlessjex
No, it's not the same effect. It doesn't have the same transients as a kick, and it probably releases linearly, while kicks tend to release logarithmically. Furthermore, sidechaining only triggers above certain control signal amplitudes, while gating triggers immediately. Gating's trigger response is linear while sidechain compression's is generally logarithmic or hyperbolic. To the casual listener, maybe it sounds the same, but it's not.
It also looks like mgTriggerGate can't toggle through patterns, so if your kick does any fills, you're screwed. |
Hence why I said "similar effect" and not "the same effect" ;)
Sidechaining is a much tougher process, but if he wants to do that, then good luck to him :) |
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| Enigmatic XTC |
| quote: | Originally posted by thoughtlessjex
No, it's not the same effect. It doesn't have the same transients as a kick, and it probably releases linearly, while kicks tend to release logarithmically. Furthermore, sidechaining only triggers above certain control signal amplitudes, while gating triggers immediately. Gating's trigger response is linear while sidechain compression's is generally logarithmic or hyperbolic. To the casual listener, maybe it sounds the same, but it's not.
It also looks like mgTriggerGate can't toggle through patterns, so if your kick does any fills, you're screwed. |
True it wont be the EXACT same, but in the mix, with all the other elements going on at the same time, i doubt very many people would notice that over a 16th note it releases linearly rather than logrithmically. Also, if you have a fill, all you have to do is create another instance of the gate and then toggle between the 2. I'm not saying either way is better, just that they would sound enough alike that it wouldnt make a real difference which one you used. |
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| mysticalninja |
| sidechaining sounds way better for this thats why everyone uses sidechaining for it, not gates. people would notice in a club. it sounds completely different. MGTriggerGate as good as a nice stereo sidechain like Voxengo Crunchessor? come on. |
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| Storyteller |
If done decent I think actually less than 1% of the producers on this forum would notice the difference between the gate idea and the real side-chain. Especially if you're able to find a transparent side-chain compressor.
If you find one that bluntly colours the sound the difference should be easy to spot, but then again, that wouldn't be a fair comparison now would it. I've used both a gate function and a side-chain compressor in several tracks, never had I had anyone telling my to do something about the gate effect. |
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| thoughtlessjex |
| quote: | Originally posted by Enigmatic XTC
Also, if you have a fill, all you have to do is create another instance of the gate and then toggle between the 2. |
Why not sidechain once, and have the pads follow the kick no matter what it does? Contrary to popular belief, sidechaining, at least as applied to pads as extremely as in the sample, is not hard at all. Most compressor plugins these days accept a sidechain signal from another track through a point and click process. I feel like the gating idea is only a simplification of the idea, not of the process. |
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| TrickDaddE |
| Sorry Noob Question. What is SideChaining? lol |
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| Storyteller |
Channel one: Pads
Channel two: other sound (in this case a Kick)
The compressor is placed over the pads...
Usually if the pads would sound the loud to compressor will start to duck. With sidechaining it works a bit different.
The compressor is still placed over the pads, but doesn't compress by itself. The compressor listen's to the input from channel two (the Kick) and compresses the pads if the kick passes the threshold :). |
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| TrickDaddE |
Thanks for the response storyteller! I think I got it!
But the purpose of that is what? |
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| mysticalninja |
| listen to the sample, or any prog house. |
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