Lol have you ever been in a fight? People (NOT gang members) do NOT head stomp on the street because you might kill the guy. It goes beyond ass-kicking to potentially maiming for life. You stomp a guys lower jaw and hes relaxing for that second and you just did permanent damage.
Pride also needs to get a cage so they dont have to reposition people in the middle of the mat when they get close to the ropes. Totally breaks up the momentum of the fight. If they dont want you near the ropes, get rid of the ropes.
Im not saying they dont have good fighters, I dont like their format. The octagon is great, no corners, no ropes. just gotta fight.
Eddie Sanchez was horrible fight haha. The reason a lot of guys in UFC dont kick is because so many times that puts you on the ground in these fights. You get a guy like randy wholl fold into the kick and take you down. Sylvia was a kicker and woudlnt do it against Randy because he was terrified of getting that turned around on him.
Im not saying that they are bad fighters and wont kick in UFC...
Im saying I think its a lot more equal than youd guess.
SuspicionVandit
I want soccer kicks and knees on ground transferred to UFC. I don't see what the difference is between a soccer kick on the ground and a high kick on the feet, other than it looking pretty barbaric to politicians and tiddly winx.
but yeah, stomps have got to leave
Orbax
socker kicks are fine. But I would be against soccer kicks if the kickees head was resting against a wall.
The body can absorb a lot of shock if given the room to move in, but when a head is against a solid object and then punched, the spine and musculature take none of the shock and it all goes into your skull, which is rather solid state.
Inertia
quote:
Originally posted by Orbax
Lol have you ever been in a fight? People (NOT gang members) do NOT head stomp on the street because you might kill the guy. It goes beyond ass-kicking to potentially maiming for life. You stomp a guys lower jaw and hes relaxing for that second and you just did permanent damage.
Pride also needs to get a cage so they dont have to reposition people in the middle of the mat when they get close to the ropes. Totally breaks up the momentum of the fight. If they dont want you near the ropes, get rid of the ropes.
Im not saying they dont have good fighters, I dont like their format. The octagon is great, no corners, no ropes. just gotta fight.
Eddie Sanchez was horrible fight haha. The reason a lot of guys in UFC dont kick is because so many times that puts you on the ground in these fights. You get a guy like randy wholl fold into the kick and take you down. Sylvia was a kicker and woudlnt do it against Randy because he was terrified of getting that turned around on him.
Im not saying that they are bad fighters and wont kick in UFC...
Im saying I think its a lot more equal than youd guess.
stomps are one thing my friend, but ill soccer kick someone's head in a fight. if you won't, that's your thing, but i think most people would. also i understand hammerfist techniques aren't allowed, and i believe they are in pride.
Orbax
The only thing im against is the use of the foot or knee against a body that is pressed up against a solid object ( i.e., ground not a bendy fence )
Id say elbows too , but its darn near impossible to get an elbow drop on someone unless its WWF.
Soccer kicks are great and I wish they used them more.
On the other hand, if a dude slips and as hes standing up gets a shin to the chin, I dont know if Id say he lost because hes a worse fighter.
I dunno, it's debatable. I dont particularly have an opinion on the soccer kick.
Inertia
hrmph.
MMA competitions are about emulating in the most legal way possible a no holds barred match i guess, between fighters of different styles. so if you are taken to a position where a move like that beats you... well, i do agree you have lost due to not being a competent enough fighter to prevent it.
look at it this way, if Fedor sits down, and someone comes from the back, carefully positions their legs onto his, and grasps his neck for an RNC, well, Fedor will have to tap. Fedor is a good fighter not because he can or cannot stand an RNC, rather because you will have to be able to defeat 300 Spartans before you can successfully get into position to pull a choke on Fedor.
so if i lose due to getting a soccer kick to the head, well, its that my fighting ability was not good enough to prevent the situation on that given day.
Inertia
also, on kicking. well, it's about knowing WHEN to kick too.
i do TKD, which is very kick-oriented. but i try to think about when to use it. when i fight my kickboxer friend, i do it to keep the distance and do damage from afar, since i have a bigger reach.
now, when i fight my friend that does some kickboxing, but also has 2 years of JJJ on him, then i'm more careful.
still, you don't see guys that can kick like Mirko in the UFC very often. 'tis a shame. kick knockouts pwn.
Masonious
quote:
Originally posted by Inertia
hrmph.
MMA competitions are about emulating in the most legal way possible a no holds barred match i guess, between fighters of different styles. so if you are taken to a position where a move like that beats you... well, i do agree you have lost due to not being a competent enough fighter to prevent it.
look at it this way, if Fedor sits down, and someone comes from the back, carefully positions their legs onto his, and grasps his neck for an RNC, well, Fedor will have to tap. Fedor is a good fighter not because he can or cannot stand an RNC, rather because you will have to be able to defeat 300 Spartans before you can successfully get into position to pull a choke on Fedor.
so if i lose due to getting a soccer kick to the head, well, its that my fighting ability was not good enough to prevent the situation on that given day.
i think the head stomp / soccer kick issue deals with the reasonable safety of the fighters. You could make your argument above for eye-gouging, crotch kicking, ear tearing, biting and small joint manipulation but these, too, are not allowed.
each of these organizations has to find that happy balance between the long term health of their fighters and the entertainment and sport of the event.
Personally I'm all for soccer kicks, head stomping is something I'm definitely against. At the point you're able to successfully land a heel stomp on someone's face they're probably close to defeat anyway. Force the victor to win using more artful means than smashing their opponent's head in with their feet which any idiot can do.
Inertia
i guess. still, small joint manipulation and eye gouging are a bit in a different league if you ask me.
Masonious
quote:
Originally posted by Inertia
i guess. still, small joint manipulation and eye gouging are a bit in a different league if you ask me.
no i totally agree with you, there are certainly degrees of severity for all martial actions. The question is where do you draw the line in that gray area - UFC obviously thought head stomps were bad, Pride didn't. Obviously it doesn't have a huge effect on the draw of the sport or the quality of the fighters so as long as the fighters are willing to take on those risks it's not too big a deal.
My problem is that EVERY fighter has their off days, I would hate to see an amazing guy like Fedor taken out for years or life because he screwed up and some beast like Sap who is 1/10th the figher crushes his nose into his brain with his heel.
SuspicionVandit
yeah........they should really put a framework for an athletic commission in japan for weird matches like this. the punch after the ko, haha. just like he did with igor.
"his kick is hard, but it's not that hard" -hunt
i can't believe he just took the kick and shook it off
Boomer187
quote:
Originally posted by Masonious
UFC obviously thought head stomps were bad, Pride didn't.
ufc has nothignt o do with it, its the local athletic commission. NSAC drew up rules, and some others and now they are working on a unified rule system for mma. I think some people are trying to get knees to the head legalized here cause it is a strategic move by a fighter. It keeps em moving. and remember, they are trying to make this a sport, not like a real fight, so this will never mimic a real fight.
and real fights to me are bar fights. real bar fights you will get your head stomped in and kicked by a group of people. thats real fighting.
oh and Fedor gives his back up to everyone, its had to find a fight where he doesn't. its just moments later he reverses it to his advantage and kills the other person. so you can get into position to RNC him, just no one can :P
