|
Progress in Iraq
|
View this Thread in Original format
| MisterOpus1 |
Damn, so THIS is what progress in Iraq looks like. This whole time the majority American public, the Dems., the Joint Chiefs of Staff, the rest of the world, the Iraq Study Group, and anyone who's have conscious thought things were going in the wrong direction in Iraq.
But thanks to both our fearless leader and the Iraqi government, they are making assurances to the contrary. How, you ask?
By simply covering up the icky stuff:
| quote: | Iraq to bar press from blast scenes
Iraq's interior ministry has decided to bar news photographers and camera operators from the scenes of bomb attacks, operations director Brigadier General Abdel Karim Khalaf said on Sunday (local time).
His announcement was the latest in a series of attempts to curtail press coverage of the ongoing conflict, which has already attracted criticism from international human rights bodies.
"There are many reasons for this prohibition," he said.
"We do not want evidence to be disturbed before the arrival of detectives, the ministry must respect human rights and does not want to expose victims and does not want to give terrorists information that they achieved their goals.
"This decision does not imply a curtailment of press freedom, it is a measure followed all over the world."
International and local media coverage of Iraq's deadly sectarian conflict generates dozens of images and reports of carnage every day, as insurgent bomb attacks continue.
http://www.abc.net.au/news/newsitem...05/s1921675.htm |
Now you see, we can't claim death, destruction, and chaos anymore because, well,
HOW WOULD YOU KNOW?
Ain't that great? Because if ya can't see it you antiAmerican traitors, it ain't happenin'! Ya think it's going on? Prove it! You can't? Well then it ain't happenin' then, is it? Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha!!!!!
(*snort*, *snort*, *snort*)
Oh goodness. My side hurts!
But wait, it doesn't stop there! Because our new purple-fingered, fully democracized death-squad Iraqi government has made sure to cover all the bases, folks! Don't even THINK for a second that they've stopped there. Because even if we can't photograph and report on the spot for empirical evidence the death and destruction that occurred, well there's still a way to count the dead, because the Iraqi government has released the figures of the deceased this whole time........
....until now:
| quote: | Iraq refuses to provide civilian casualty figures to U.N.
Numbers from government employees indicate that 5,509 died in Baghdad in the first three months of 2007.
BAGHDAD — The Iraqi government has refused to provide the United Nations with civilian casualty figures for its latest report on the hardships facing Iraqis, the U.N. said Wednesday, but numbers from various ministries indicate that more than 5,500 people died in the Baghdad area alone in the first three months of this year.
The numbers, provided to The Times by employees in government ministries, could not be independently verified but were higher than those in an independent nationwide civilian death count based on news accounts. Numbers provided by employees of ministries also appear to indicate an increase in Baghdad civilian deaths in recent weeks after an ebb when a new security plan was launched in February.
At a news conference to unveil the United Nations' report, spokesman Said Arikat said no "official" reason had been given by the government for not issuing casualty figures. But Ivana Vuco, a U.N. human rights officer, said government officials had made it clear during discussions that they believed releasing high casualty numbers would make it harder for the government to quell unrest.
"We were told they were concerned that people would misconstrue the figures to portray the situation very negatively, and that would further undermine their efforts to establish some kind of stability and security in the country," Vuco said, adding, "These are, in a way … legitimate reasons.
"However, we are trying to stress our point of view, which is that transparency is the key to establishing security."
http://www.latimes.com/news/nationw...-home-headlines |
Now WAIT, stop right there. I know what you're thinkin'. I do. You're thinkin' Bush ain't gonna sit there and let the Iraqi government have all the fun on its own, right?
Well you're damn darn tootin' right he ain't! Go grab yurself another Texas Shiner Bock coldie for yurself for guessin' that right, bub!:
| quote: | U.S. officials exclude car bombs in touting drop in Iraq violence
By Nancy A. Youssef
McClatchy Newspapers
WASHINGTON - U.S. officials who say there has been a dramatic drop in sectarian violence in Iraq since President Bush began sending more American troops into Baghdad aren't counting one of the main killers of Iraqi civilians.
Car bombs and other explosive devices have killed thousands of Iraqis in the past three years, but the administration doesn't include them in the casualty counts it has been citing as evidence that the surge of additional U.S. forces is beginning to defuse tensions between Shiite and Sunni Muslims.
President Bush explained why in a television interview on Tuesday. "If the standard of success is no car bombings or suicide bombings, we have just handed those who commit suicide bombings a huge victory," he told TV interviewer Charlie Rose.
Others, however, say that not counting bombing victims skews the evidence of how well the Baghdad security plan is protecting the civilian population - one of the surge's main goals.
"Since the administration keeps saying that failure is not an option, they are redefining success in a way that suits them," said James Denselow, an Iraq specialist at London-based Chatham House, a foreign policy think tank.
Bush administration officials have pointed to a dramatic decline in one category of deaths - the bodies dumped daily in Baghdad streets, which officials call sectarian murders - as evidence that the security plan is working. Bush said this week that that number had declined by 50 percent, a number confirmed by statistics compiled by McClatchy Newspapers.
But the number of people killed in explosive attacks is rising, the same statistics show - up from 323 in March, the first full month of the security plan, to 365 through April 24.
Overall, statistics indicate that the number of violent deaths has declined significantly since December, when 1,391 people died in Baghdad, either executed and found dead on the street or killed by bomb blasts. That number was 796 in March and 691 through April 24.
Nearly all of that decline, however, can be attributed to a drop in executions, most of which were blamed on Shiite Muslim militias aligned with the government of Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki. Much of the decline occurred before the security plan began on Feb. 15, and since then radical Shiite cleric Muqtada al-Sadr has ordered his Mahdi Army militia to stand down.
According to the statistics, which McClatchy reporters in Baghdad compile daily from Iraqi police reports, 1,030 bodies were found in December. In January, that number declined 32 percent, to 699. It declined to 596 February and again to 473 in March.
Deaths from car bombings and improvised explosive devices, however, increased from 361 in December to a peak of 520 in February before dropping to 323 in March.
In that same period, the number of bombings has increased, as well. In December, there were 65 explosive attacks. That number was unchanged in January, but it rose to 72 in February, 74 in March and 81 through April 24.
http://www.realcities.com/mld/krwas.../printstory.jsp |
Now I don't know about you, but all these traitorous bastards mentioned above who opposed this war need to think REAL HARD about their own personal sins, and they need to repent of their disbelief in our fearless neocon leaders as well as the lovely progress that's TRULY occurring in Iraq right now. You should NEVER doubt our fearless leader again. They know what they're doin', dammit.
And if they don't know what they're doin', well hell, they'll just fake it! But you won't know the difference 'cause they won't be reportin' the icky stuff anymore. So grab your flag, wrap yourself up real tight, and give high praise to Gawd and His Right Hand Man, our dear Dubya. |
|
|
| LatinLover |
:haha: :rolleyes:
Is that all you do all day... Promote propaganda to discredit the effort of our troops and your commander and chief.
To all my TA members "IF" a Dem is elected with the same mentality of this MisterOpus, I got to tell you... WE ARE ED! |
|
|
| HardTranceProd |
LOL... And my Dad thinks that I'm too passionate about politics...
He hasn't seen MisterOpus ;) :D
But I have to say I agree with everything he posts, it's very good to have him with us :) |
|
|
| _Ocean_Drive_ |
| quote: | Originally posted by LatinLover
Is that all you do all day... Promote propaganda to discredit the effort of our troops |
Not at all. Just wishing they weren't there in the first place.
| quote: | Originally posted by LatinLover
and your commander and chief. |
You make him sound like the bastion of world peace.
Dubya is an idiot.
/thread |
|
|
| MisterOpus1 |
| quote: | Originally posted by LatinLover
:haha: :rolleyes:
Is that all you do all day... Promote propaganda to discredit the effort of our troops and your commander and chief.
To all my TA members "IF" a Dem is elected with the same mentality of this MisterOpus, I got to tell you... WE ARE ED! |
Because you're relatively new here, I'll let your continual ad hominems slide for now.
But I will say that if you continue attacking with asinine ad hominem fallacies while failing to make any arguments to debate, rest assured a mod will more than likely be notified.
IOW, if you're interested in a flame war, kindly take your elsewhere. This is a political debate forum. Either engage with intellectual honesty in debate or kindly go about your way.
Added in Edit: You might want to review our Mod's 7 simple rules thread:
http://www.tranceaddict.com/forums/...7&forumid=66&s=
Take notice of rule #2, if you will. |
|
|
| DJ Shibby |
| quote: | Originally posted by _Ocean_Drive_
Not at all. Just wishing they weren't there in the first place.
You make him sound like the bastion of world peace.
Dubya is an idiot.
/thread |
lol...
I don't know why people even reply to this latinwhatever fellow... he can barely formulate comprehensive ideas. |
|
|
| LatinLover |
| quote: | Originally posted by DJ Shibby
lol...
I don't know why people even reply to this latinwhatever fellow... he can barely formulate comprehensive ideas. |
no i just dont put enough effort when im dealing with stupid . come on do you think that I have time to read an essay about how americans are sick and tired about this war, another essay on what the polls show, another essay on how ex military officials feel :rolleyes: |
|
|
| MisterOpus1 |
| quote: | Originally posted by LatinLover
no i just dont put enough effort when im dealing with stupid . come on do you think that I have time to read an essay about how americans are sick and tired about this war, another essay on what the polls show, another essay on how ex military officials feel :rolleyes: |
If you are not going to put forth the effort to read supported assertions that counter your unsupported points, why are you even bothering to be in the political debate forum? |
|
|
| LatinLover |
| quote: | Originally posted by MisterOpus1
If you are not going to put forth the effort to read supported assertions that counter your unsupported points, why are you even bothering to be in the political debate forum? |
To read the opinions and analysis of other members :rolleyes: and hoping to engage in a worth while debate with intelligent people but that hasnt happened because some people all they do is go to CNN.com or w.e have you and quote some up from someone and just use that as evidence. I was more hoping to meet an intellectual that can have common sense but more importantly ENTERTAIN his own analysis of world events etc..
Its like I say... Why would I bother to debate with people that cant do that, it makes me feel dumber. I am still awaiting to meet that member here but it seems is not going to happen....
If it does happen then youll see a 100% guaranteed a hell of a debate :) |
|
|
| Q5echo |
Bush is right. the advertized standard can't be no suicide bombs. doesn't mean you don't do everything humanly possible to minimize or marginalize them as savage, cowardly and easy for jihadists to do. it's all they have really now and god is it effective...to a point.
thats what is going on here. thats what the Iraqi government is doing as well. you have to do evrything possible to marginalize this crap evn if it means cencoring yourself. unfortunately the rabidness of the anti-war left will have a field day using it against you. sux ass but you keep fighting.
Latinlover is right. that Yousseff article is straight-up propaganda. |
|
|
| MisterOpus1 |
| quote: | Originally posted by Q5echo
Bush is right. the advertized standard can't be no suicide bombs. doesn't mean you don't do everything humanly possible to minimize or marginalize them as savage, cowardly and easy for jihadists to do. it's all they have really now and god is it effective...to a point.
thats what is going on here. thats what the Iraqi government is doing as well. you have to do evrything possible to marginalize this crap evn if it means cencoring yourself. unfortunately the rabidness of the anti-war left will have a field day using it against you. sux ass but you keep fighting.
Latinlover is right. that Yousseff article is straight-up propaganda. |
It's funny how everything that seemingly disagrees with Bush is somehow lumped into the "rabid-left", as you call it.
Strange how so much of the majority of the world and our own country has such a "rabid-left" bend to it.
And I just knew you'd come to the rescue of this censorship. Thank goodness for Bush supporters like you who know and love that darn librul media - ya know, the one who likes to report the icky reality that seemingly doesn't quite work in this Administration's favor.......
And I'm sorry, you were comparing in another thread one of our country's political party to extremists who enjoy a great deal of censorship. Interesting. |
|
|
| MisterOpus1 |
| quote: | Originally posted by LatinLover
To read the opinions and analysis of other members :rolleyes: and hoping to engage in a worth while debate with intelligent people but that hasnt happened because some people all they do is go to CNN.com or w.e have you and quote some up from someone and just use that as evidence. |
Hmmm, so what politicians, analysts, and anyone else being quoted in the media is somehow detrimental to my argument how again?
| quote: | | I was more hoping to meet an intellectual that can have common sense but more importantly ENTERTAIN his own analysis of world events etc.. |
I like how you try to put on the grown-up jeans, and then double-loop that big belt around so they fit better. It is pretty cute.
| quote: | | Its like I say... Why would I bother to debate with people that cant do that, it makes me feel dumber. |
I don't think you need my help or anyone else's help here for that one champ. You do just fine appearing quite dumb all on your own.
| quote: | | I am still awaiting to meet that member here but it seems is not going to happen.... |
I just can't tell you how incredibly disappointed I am at your continual dodging and refusal to engage or counter any of the points I've made directly towards you so far.
I'll shalln't sleep tonight.......
| quote: | | If it does happen then youll see a 100% guaranteed a hell of a debate :) |
Quick question for ya, champ:
| quote: | Given the fact that hardly any predictions made by this Administration and its supporters have come to fruition about this war in Iraq, why the do you think you have an ounce of credibility to make any predictions about the situation in the future? Given your support to the group that's been wrong on almost all accounts with this war, what on earth should compel anyone to start believing your predictions now?
And lastly, again I wonder, do you think it's okay for Bush to call for a timetable of withdrawal against Clinton back in 1999? |
Can you try to act like a grown-up and answer that one little question for us all? |
|
|
|
|
