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School Shooting in... Finland. 7 killed (pg. 5)
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| George Smiley |
| quote: | Originally posted by Zild
Well you could shoot someone in the foot instead of kill them. Thats another purpose. Or the arm. That's another purpose. Or you could help to protect your state's ecosystem by hunting nuisance animals such as feral pigs in Texas etc... |
So basically, the most enshrined law of the greatest cultural civilisation on Earth, is the right to shoot people in the foot or the arm and shoot pigs?
Best argument I've heard for gun ownership in my life |
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| George Smiley |
| quote: | Originally posted by Zild
Entertainment arguments seem to be doing just fine right now. But if you don't think guns do anything for self defense I'd like to ask you to please do research stating that. I'll come back here and post a bunch of eyewitness accounts of people stating that if it were not for their firearm that they or someone else would be dead right now. |
Please do, then I'll subtract those figures from the amount of people killed by guns in America and then we can see whether the final figures support gun control or not (hint - they won't back your argument one little bit) |
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| Zild |
| quote: | Originally posted by George Smiley
Please do, then I'll subtract those figures from the amount of people killed by guns in America and then we can see whether the final figures support gun control or not (hint - they won't back your argument one little bit) |
Fact is most of those people would have been killed by a gun anyway. I don't think someone who is about to commit a crime like murder thinks 'hmmmm no guns are illegal so I won't shoot anybody.'
The truth is that it is cheaper to obtain an illegal gun than it is to go to the store and purchase one legally. |
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| Zild |
| quote: | Originally posted by George Smiley
So basically, the most enshrined law of the greatest cultural civilisation on Earth, is the right to shoot people in the foot or the arm and shoot pigs?
Best argument I've heard for gun ownership in my life |
Actually I was making fun of you with that statement and to see you think it is an argument for gun ownership is laughable. If you can't figure out what you can use a gun for other than murder then I can't help you. |
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| George Smiley |
Here's some figures:
In 2004 there were 11,624 homicides and 649 accidental (!) deaths caused by firearms in America. If you can find me 12,273 eyewhitness statements saying that owning a gun saved their lives from 2004, I'll take back everything I said (ah what the hell, if you can find me 12,273 statements from the entire 21st century in America I'll take back what I said!)
(Jesus Christ tho, 649 accidental shootings! Sounds like you don't need to be a criminal to kill somebody with a gun in America! That's argument enough for gun controls right there!) |
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| George Smiley |
| quote: | Originally posted by Zild
Fact is most of those people would have been killed by a gun anyway. I don't think someone who is about to commit a crime like murder thinks 'hmmmm no guns are illegal so I won't shoot anybody.' |
I don't think most murderers think much before they commit the crime do they? If they did they probably wouldn't do it
| quote: | | The truth is that it is cheaper to obtain an illegal gun than it is to go to the store and purchase one legally. |
Oh so because guns are available on the black market that's an argument to let everybody else have them as well? Gun crime happens in the UK because of the availability of guns on the black market, but its not like that will ever be used to justify legalising gun ownership because it is as dumb as all the other arguments for gun ownership |
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| Zild |
Are you serious? So because there were 694 less idiots that year responsible law abiding citizens should surrender their rights?
Hey if you are playing with fire and you burn yourself that is your fault. It doesn't mean there should be a law passed that none of us are allowed access to fire anymore. |
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| George Smiley |
| quote: | Originally posted by Zild
Actually I was making fun of you with that statement and to see you think it is an argument for gun ownership is laughable. If you can't figure out what you can use a gun for other than murder then I can't help you. |
I can see plenty of uses for guns, but not for the general public. If you can't think of any, and instead just respond with more jokes in the place of a valid argument, then I will assume that we both agree there is no valid reason why members of the public should be allowed, nay, encouraged by some archaic "patriotic" law, to own a gun... |
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| Zild |
| quote: | Originally posted by George Smiley
I don't think most murderers think much before they commit the crime do they? If they did they probably wouldn't do it
Oh so because guns are available on the black market that's an argument to let everybody else have them as well? Gun crime happens in the UK because of the availability of guns on the black market, but its not like that will ever be used to justify legalising gun ownership because it is as dumb as all the other arguments for gun ownership |
I don't understand the point you are trying to make. My point is that if someone wants to kill someone with a gun they are going to do it legal or otherwise. So you shouldn't penalize law abiding citizens for something they didn't do when your real problem lies with black market firearms. Which like I said earlier are easier and cheaper to obtain. |
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| Zild |
| quote: | Originally posted by George Smiley
I can see plenty of uses for guns, but not for the general public. If you can't think of any, and instead just respond with more jokes in the place of a valid argument, then I will assume that we both agree there is no valid reason why members of the public should be allowed, nay, encouraged by some archaic "patriotic" law, to own a gun... |
You don't think people are responsible enough to make their own choices, but I do. That is where we disagree.
And you can assume anything you want it doesn't bother me nor does it change anything. |
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| George Smiley |
| quote: | Originally posted by Zild
Are you serious? So because there were 694 less idiots that year responsible law abiding citizens should surrender their rights? |
"Right"? You talk about that law like the founding fathers believed everybody should have the right to go hunting in the mountains so they can shoot ferrel pigs. That law was passed at a time of necessity so that the public could easily mobilise into militias to defend themselves against the (genuine, as opposed to the "threat" from Islamic extremists which I notice some inbreds are using to justify gun ownership) threat of British invasion. If you can't see that then you display a severe lack of understanding about your own country's history
| quote: | | Hey if you are playing with fire and you burn yourself that is your fault. It doesn't mean there should be a law passed that none of us are allowed access to fire anymore. |
Actually they "burned" (killed) other people, not themselves |
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| Zild |
| No I definitely realize that about history and I think that is one of the main reasons you are for gun control. And yes we are still pissed that you limeys burned down the White House. We didn't forget. |
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