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truth.
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Junior Chavez
Lomeli
War = Money

I wonder how long until other countries decide that they've had enough of us interfering with the affairs of other nations.
Junior Chavez
"We must disenthrall ourselves, and then we shall save our country." - Abraham Lincoln, 1862

"We must disenthrall ourselves..." - Bill Clinton, 2006

"Wake Up." - Rage Against The Machine, 1992
donnybrasco
The "truth" is; This thread belongs over in the "political debate" forum, where it can be roundly criticized for the propaganda that it is.
gerard6975
c'mon man! where's the more important news... britney spears?!

it's just sad to know that a lot of people are still ignorant of what truly happens outside our "safe" country
Lomeli
I think the west coast should have a meaningful discussion every once in a while. We demand change!:)
Junior Chavez
amen gerard!
donnybrasco
"Meaningful?" Right. I'd be willing to bet that JC got tired of having his propaganda refuted over in the Political Forum, so he came here to try it out.

Can he even debate? Or is he one of those posters that surfs the web for shoddy conspiracy-theory videos and sub-par clever photo-shop pix of his arch nemesis (George Bush), who then posts them as if by doing so alone is in and of itself, some sort of relevant debate?

;)
Junior Chavez
quote:
Originally posted by donnybrasco
"Meaningful?" Right. I'd be willing to bet that JC got tired of having his propaganda refuted over in the Political Forum, so he came here to try it out.

Can he even debate? Or is he one of those posters that surfs the web for shoddy conspiracy-theory videos and sub-par clever photo-shop pix of his arch nemesis (George Bush), who then posts them as if by doing so alone is in and of itself, some sort of relevant debate?

;)


your "bet" is incorrect.

you obviously failed to listen.
sounds like death for oil is okay with you...

you should really look up the definition to "fascism"...
better yet... do you understand the logistics of "war corporatism"?

do you know who runs THE UNITED DEFENSE?... our political leaders... your president... they are head of this weapon manufacturing COMPANY that makes billions... you should really know what you are defending before you start running your mouth...
R!CH
two documentaries...

why we fight: http://www.sonyclassics.com/whywefight/
zeitgeist: http://www.zeitgeistmovie.com/

some relevant quotes...

" Of all the enemies to public liberty war is, perhaps, the most to be dreaded, because it comprises and develops the germ of every other.

War is the parent of armies; from these proceed debts and taxes; and armies, and debts, and taxes are the known instruments for bringing the many under the domination of the few.

In war, too, the discretionary power of the Executive is extended; its influence in dealing out offices, honors, and emoluments is multiplied; and all the means of seducing the minds, are added to those of subduing the force, of the people. . . . [There is also an] inequality of fortunes, and the opportunities of fraud, growing out of a state of war, and . . . degeneracy of manners and of morals. . . . No nation could preserve its freedom in the midst of continual warfare. . . .

[It should be well understood] that the powers proposed to be surrendered [by the Third Congress] to the Executive were those which the Constitution has most jealously appropriated to the Legislature. . . .

The Constitution expressly and exclusively vests in the Legislature the power of declaring a state of war . . . the power of raising armies . . . the power of creating offices. . . .

A delegation of such powers [to the President] would have struck, not only at the fabric of our Constitution, but at the foundation of all well organized and well checked governments.

The separation of the power of declaring war from that of conducting it, is wisely contrived to exclude the danger of its being declared for the sake of its being conducted.

The separation of the power of raising armies from the power of commanding them, is intended to prevent the raising of armies for the sake of commanding them.

The separation of the power of creating offices from that of filling them, is an essential guard against the temptation to create offices for the sake of gratifying favourites or multiplying dependents. "

- James Madison, Father of the U.S. Constitution, April 20, 1795

" I see in the near future a crisis approaching that unnerves me and causes me to tremble for the safety of my country. As a result of the war, corporations have been enthroned and an era of corruption in high places will follow, and the money power of the country will endeavor to prolong its reign by working upon the prejudices of the people until all wealth is aggregated in a few hands and the Republic is destroyed. "

- Abraham Lincoln, November 21, 1864 (in a letter to Col. Elkins)

" In the counsels of Government, we must guard against the acquisition of unwarranted influence, whether sought or unsought, by the Military Industrial Complex. The potential for the disastrous rise of misplaced power exists, and will persist. We must never let the weight of this combination endanger our liberties or democratic processes. "

- Dwight Eisenhower, January 1961

" Fascism should more properly be called corporatism, since it is the merger of state and corporate power. "

- Premier Benito Mussolini, the Father of Fascism

" Naturally the common people don't want war: Neither in Russia, nor in England, nor for that matter in Germany. That is understood. But, after all, it is the leaders of the country who determine the policy and it is always a simple matter to drag the people along, whether it is a democracy, or a fascist dictatorship, or a parliament, or a communist dictatorship. ... Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the peacemakers for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country. "

- General Herman Goering, President of German Reichstag & Nazi Party, Commander of Luftwaffe, April 18, 1946

" The first panacea for a mismanaged nation is inflation of the currency; the second is war. Both bring a temporary prosperity; both bring a permanent ruin. But both are the refuge of political and economic opportunists. "

- Ernest Hemingway

Junior Chavez
quote:
Originally posted by R!CH
why we fight: http://www.sonyclassics.com/whywefight/


i love how the business man in suit and tie blatently said to the camera "COLLUSION WITH THE MILITARY IS OUR BUSINESS."

haha. if that's not obvious i don't know what is...


quote:
Originally posted by Junior Chavez
do you know who runs THE UNITED DEFENSE?... our political leaders... your president... they are head of this weapon manufacturing COMPANY that makes billions... you should really know what you are defending before you start running your mouth...


donny?...
R!CH
quote:
Originally posted by Junior Chavez
i love how the business man in suit and tie blatently said to the camera "COLLUSION WITH THE MILITARY IS OUR BUSINESS."

haha. if that's not obvious i don't know what is...


here's the full thing...

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:)
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