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What do you like/dislike about Toronto (pg. 18)
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| malek |
| quote: | Originally posted by DigiNut
Leave it to the Star to keep publishing that pedestrian-only-street bullcrap. People walk on those streets anyway, the sidewalks aren't really overcrowded, but forcing cars and buses off definitely would cripple downtown transportation.
What we really need to do to improve this city is stop listening to the Toronto Star. |
pedestrian only streets are doomed for failure in north america... frigging useless.
not everything happening in europe can just be copied here. |
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| Zentac_75 |
| quote: | Originally posted by malek
pedestrian only streets are doomed for failure in north america... frigging useless.
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Until our gas prices are as high as their
are overseas. |
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| Orko |
| quote: | Originally posted by malek
pedestrian only streets are doomed for failure in north america... frigging useless. |
Why do you say that? As a pedestrian and biker, the idea seems appealing to me. |
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| smuncky |
| quote: | Originally posted by malek
pedestrian only streets are doomed for failure in north america... frigging useless.
not everything happening in europe can just be copied here. |
i don't think they are doomed for failure but i can see it happening because of the north american culture. i don't think that people here can even imagine having to close a street down to cars. there will be soooo much bitching about traffic that anyone who brought the idea up is going to regret it.
perfect example, jarvis st. in toronto. they wanted to take away the middle lane that's there now in part of revitalizing that area and put in a green median with planters and trees. most of the public started to cry about congestion and traffic. |
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| DigiNut |
| quote: | Originally posted by smuncky
perfect example, jarvis st. in toronto. they wanted to take away the middle lane that's there now in part of revitalizing that area and put in a green median with planters and trees. most of the public started to cry about congestion and traffic. |
Cry? It's a legitimate concern. Maybe if we had a metro system like Madrid or Barcelona we could actually even consider the idea of closing down lanes or entire streets, but right now the idea makes about as much sense as donating one of your kidneys when you're on Valium and scarfing down 3 tequila shots every hour.
We need every roadway and mass transit vehicle we can muster and then some. This isn't a quaint little European city where it's actually possible to walk from one end to the other. The Toronto core by itself is huge, and not only that, huge gobs of commuters are coming and going from 9 different suburbs every day. If we're totally choked up already, how is cutting off major arteries going to help the city? (Aside from ostensibly increasing the number of tourists which would make the congestion even worse)
There's a phrase for the act of beautifying something before it's actually ready for prime time. It's called turd polish. The most important thing is to get the city running smoothly; then and only then should we think about where the trees and pedestrian streets can go. |
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| malek |
what about not having the weather of barcelona and madrid?? People forget the winter we just had, people won't walk blocks to go shop.
2 streets will be closed the whole summer in Montreal this year, it will be a tragic failure and I will laugh my ass out. |
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| dEsidEL |
| quote: |
Toronto Not A "Must See" Destination For Tourists: Report
Friday May 9, 2008
CityNews.ca Staff
Toronto likes to tout itself as a world-class city, but according to a recent report on its ability to draw tourists our town has some serious work to do to wow visitors.
The culprit? According to city councillor Kyle Rae, it's our layout.
"Frankly, I think we're topographically challenged," he said. "We don't have mountains. We don't have great skiing, right? People will go to Niagara Falls..." But they won't make the detour to the Big Smoke.
The extensive study of Toronto attractions claims that our town is not a "Must See/Must Do" destination among Canadian and American travellers. Less than half of visitors surveyed in 2006 - 47 percent - said they were "very satisfied" with their visit, which is more than a 20 percent drop from eight years earlier. Only 17 percent of those polled said Hogtown "exceeded their expectations."
Our fellow Canucks don't see the nation's largest city as a very hospitable place, while Americans and overseas visitors view friendliness as one of Toronto's strengths, according to the report released Friday.
Our friends south of the border say they're consistently impressed with how friendly and clean Toronto is, but tourists from other parts of the world complain that our shopping is not on par with their expectations.
"Except for the CN Tower, I don't have any good idea of Toronto before coming," explained Vincent Eyraud, visiting from France.
Charlotte Soriano is also here from France, and her reasons for coming show a lack of knowledge of the city. "It was in Canada, big city, and it was similar to an American city," she outlined.
Still, she had a better grasp of T.O. than one Australian tourist. His reason for visiting? "The Rockies!"
The price tag that comes with a stay in Toronto turned a lot of tourists off, the study says, with many finding they didn't get good value at hotels and attractions. Just over a quarter of visitors said our sales tax was too high.
Other points that turned some people off Toronto noted in the study include:
* Stale sightseeing scripts
* Lack of multi-lingual services at attractions
* Inconsistent or poor service at attractions
* Lack of specialized tours
* Bad roads/Gridlock and traffic congestion
While Toronto enjoyed the reputation of being a very clean city for some time that image has started to tarnish. Many tour operators noted they don't take visitors out early Saturday and Sunday mornings because the streets and sidewalks are a mess.
Rae said in order for Toronto to thrive as a tourist destination, it must diversify the audience its marketing and reach out to attract more overseas tourists.
"We've been so linked to the American culture - we need to change that, we have to diversify our investments," he said.
Rae said tourists are drawn to events in the city that are popular among locals, including Gay Pride festivities and Caribana.
"What is tantalizing to the tourist is what is successful in our community," Rae added. He also spoke about creating a new attraction, like an aquarium.
"There is an interest, but it just never gets beyond the talk!" he exclaimed.
Despite some of the discouraging findings, the report did highlight some very positive points about the city, including:
* FDI Magazine, a subsidiary of the Financial Time of London, awarded the Greater Toronto Area the distinction of the second Top City Region of the Future, receiving top honours for Best Transport, Best IT and Telecom, Best Quality of Life and Best FDI Promotion Strategy.
* The city has been ranked as one of the World's Top 10 Economic Centres with a strong credit rating of AA (Standard & Poor's, 2006)
* It has the 12th strongest city brand in the world (Anholt GMI City Brands Index, 2005)
* Toronto was ranked 2nd in North America and placed 15th worldwide in the Mercer Human Resources Quality of Living Survey 2007
* Identified a leading city in the world in terms of reducing carbon emissions by the Carbon Group
* Toronto was ranked as the 3rd in the world as most desirable destination for business travel in The Economist's Intelligence Unit business trip index 2006
* Toronto's skyline was ranked 11th in the world on its visual impact according to Emporis Skyline Ranking 2007.
To read the full report, click here.
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source:
http://www.citynews.ca/news/news_22551.aspx
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| dEsidEL |
"It's going to take a lot longer to bring samosas and sandwiches to the streets, and until then the hot dog, the sausage, and the veggie dog will remain street food monopoly/podium sitters. I understand the food safety and fair competition measures that need to be considered, but for crying out loud, why do we need so much red-tape to do something so simple. A five year pilot project?"
- http://www.blogto.com/
| quote: |
Hot dog to remain king of the street
Downtown carts selling more diverse fare won't be rolled out until next spring
May 28, 2008
Vanessa Lu
City Hall Bureau Chief
Hoping to munch on samosas, souvlaki or spring rolls on the street, now that warmer weather is here? Dream on.
Toronto's plan to cook up more diverse street food won't be happening this summer as promised, though it was still being touted on the city's website yesterday.
In what looks like a red-tape mess, the latest idea calls for 13 street vendors, mostly downtown, to start selling their non-hot-dog snacks next spring.
It would be part of a pilot project lasting five long years so that vendors who invest in specialized carts can recoup their costs.
"We have to micromanage everything," said Councillor Case Ootes, complaining about how the plan turned out.
"We should have focused on the food-inspection issue. You set parameters for the size of the cart and then let the private sector do it."
Last summer, when Health Minister George Smitherman amended provincial law to allow for a wider variety of foods to be sold on the street, Toronto decided to hold off on opening up the menu until a firm plan was in place.
Initially, the city thought of borrowing $700,000 to buy 35 carts that it would lease out at $450 a month, as a way to keep control and block "cart conglomerates" from emerging.
Given the optics of a cash-poor city spending money on that project, Mayor David Miller shut down the proposal.
The latest idea – dubbed Toronto à la Cart – would get going next April with 13 vendors.
Most pilots last only two years, not five, officials concede, but they promise an evaluation after a year that could result in changes or expansion.
Or the city "could terminate it earlier, if it was a fiasco," said the city's economic partnership adviser, George Wheeler.
The proposal, to be debated at executive committee next Tuesday, would involve leasing or buying carts from Brantford-based Crown Verity, the sole bidder on a tender the city put out this spring. Its partner, Equilease, a leasing brokerage company, would find financing for vendors if needed.
Interested vendors would be required to purchase or lease specific carts from Crown Verity. A non-refrigerated cart would cost $26,100; one with refrigeration runs $32,300.
Lease rates over five years would be $7,056 and $8,796 per year, respectively, at a minimum interest rate of 12.5 per cent. That rate would be available to candidates with food business experience and above-average credit. Others would face a higher rate, negotiated case by case.
Vendors would be selected based on their business plan and the type, diversity and quality of the food, its nutritional content and use of local food where appropriate.
An expert panel will sample the items to be sold and select the winning vendors. They include John Higgins of George Brown College's hospitality program and Marney Levitt of Whole Foods.
Locations have been identified, with annual fees ranging from $2,300 for Trinity-Bellwoods Park to $10,400 for the east side of Nathan Phillips Square.
Other sites include Metro Hall, Mel Lastman Square, College Park, Queen's Park, George Hislop, Roundhouse, HtO, Allan Gardens and Berczy Park.
Councillor John Filion, who has championed diverse street food for years, says he's not happy the carts won't be on the street this summer.
"It's my biggest disappointment after 26 years in politics – that a good idea is having so much trouble getting off the ground," Filion said.
He wants to see the pilot limited to six months, next spring and summer. He also wants the cart financing method changed to ensure the city or its agency has control.
Filion argues a three- or five-year lease makes it prohibitively expensive for the street-food entrepreneurs the city wants to target, such as new immigrants with food experience but little capital.
Councillor Brian Ashton said the latest proposal reveals a city bogged down in regulation.
"We're not creative, we're regulators," Ashton said. "Risk is one of our biggest fears."
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source:
http://www.thestar.com/News/GTA/article/432152
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| Orko |
| quote: | | "We have to micromanage everything," said Councillor Case Ootes, complaining about how the plan turned out. |
And that about sums it up. Inefficient, and ineffective micromanagement. Good job Toronto, you finally know what your problem is. 
Thanks dEsidEL, for keeping us posted and up to date. |
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| smuncky |
| Did anyone go to the Toronto the Good party last night? |
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| Jayx1 |
The good old canadian saying
"if it moves, tax it. If it keeps moving, regulate it. If it stops, subsidize it."
And you wonder why toronto is falling apart? Our governments cant even trust adults to sell samosas without being babysat!
Truly disgusting |
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| dEsidEL |
| quote: | Originally posted by Jayx1
The good old canadian saying
"if it moves, tax it. If it keeps moving, regulate it. If it stops, subsidize it."
And you wonder why toronto is falling apart? Our governments cant even trust adults to sell samosas without being babysat!
Truly disgusting |
taken right from the article:
| quote: |
Councillor Brian Ashton said the latest proposal reveals a city bogged down in regulation.
"We're not creative, we're regulators," Ashton said. "Risk is one of our biggest fears." |
| quote: |
Street food burned by red tape
May 29, 2008
Royson James
What a great idea. Why is the city bent on messing it up?
Councillor John Filion should be commended for trying to add spice and variety to Toronto's street food fare. Put a little jerk in the chicken, add some bite to the dog, and toss in some salads for the vegans and crepes for the sophisticates.
But oh, how they've wrapped and trapped the spring rolls in red tape and bureaucracy at city hall.
You'd have thought this to be a simple matter: Change provincial laws that prohibit the sale of anything but pre-cooked meat; establish testing and inspections; announce the new regime; watch enterprising vendors enter the marketplace. And Torontonians are smiling in their samosas and crying in their hot curry.
But no, too easy. The meddlers had to engineer it into delay and confusion. First, the city wanted to borrow $700,000 to buy 35 carts and lease them out for $450 a month. Why not just set the cart standards and leave it to the private sector to provide and sell? Because the city wants to block "conglomerates" from taking over this new venture.
The goal is to have the little guy get a fair chance at making a living, Filion and others said. Think how many residents from Toronto's at-risk neighbourhoods could get on the gravy train, advocates said.
When the public didn't buy the idea of the needless cash outlay from a cash-poor city, Mayor David Miller short-circuited the lease plan. But the micromanaging philosophy remained – as seen in a report to the executive committee next Tuesday.
For one, we won't get the new foods until next spring at the earliest, not this summer as hoped, because of the confusing and complicated start-up plan.
Secondly, the bureaucratic, legal and financial requirements are so lengthy and strangling that the little guy will surely be turned off and turned away. Consider:
You must lease or buy a cart from the lone city-selected provider. Cost is $26,100 for a non-refrigerated cart and $32,300 for a refrigerated one. Lease rate is between $7,056 and $8,796 per year. Minimum interest? 12.5 per cent.
That preferred rate is good only for vendors with food business experience and above-average credit. Others – remember the poor guy from the at-risk neighbourhood that we are trying to shelter from the cart conglomerate cartel? – will pay more.
That hurdle cleared, does the vendor now hit the street and start selling and if people like what they taste they'll return for more? Not the way the city sees it.
Vendors are to be selected based on the diversity and quality of food, nutritional content and use of local food where appropriate. An expert panel from George Brown and some guy from Whole Foods will sample and choose the winners.
How did we get ensnared in such an involved, time-consuming, entangled, bureaucratic web? All a guy wants is a patty and coco bread, without the taste testers and fancy carts and lease plans.
Some 3,557 people responded to a city online survey regarding their preference for expanded street food and, apparently, suggested the following menu, in order of popularity: Chicken/pork souvlaki, spring rolls, corn-on-the-cob, noodle dishes, hot beverages, samosas, tacos, fruit salads/skewers, dim sum, baked potatoes, falafels, roti, rice dishes, fish and chips, jerk chicken, salads, crepes, pretzels, curry dishes, soups, empanada, waffles, enchiladas, sushi, kebabs.
We're starved already. Can city hall just let us eat? Please.
Royson James usually appears Tuesday, Thursday and Saturday. Email: rjames @ thestar.ca
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source:
http://www.thestar.com/GTA/Columnist/article/432722
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