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Colin Powell Endorses Obama (pg. 12)
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| josh4 |
| quote: | Originally posted by Fir3start3r
| quote: | Originally posted by The17sss
I agree with you to a point about something here... I am NOT a fan of Bush, and I hate how he has gone against everything conservative. I'm not in the least bit supportive of his massive expanision and spending tactics... he's part of the problem. |
I think this is something we can all agree with - Bush is an anomaly...:disbelief |
Then why is your camp only now coming out with this? None of you on this board have actively gone out of your way to condemn Bush as much as you have to apologize for him. Bush doesn't hold up to many of the conservative perspectives outlined by The17sss but there everyone was, marching in lockstep with his administration. |
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| Fir3start3r |
| quote: | Originally posted by josh4
Then why is your camp only now coming out with this? None of you on this board have actively gone out of your way to condemn Bush as much as you have to apologize for him. Bush doesn't hold up to many of the conservative perspectives outlined by The17sss but there everyone was, marching in lockstep with his administration. |
'my camp' as you so succinctly put it (even though technically I'm not even in that camp being Canadian and all) has been pretty clear about Bush's ballooning government not being a good thing...
Why is 'your camp' only figuring this out now? |
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| Groundhog Boy |
| quote: | Originally posted by Krypton
No wonder the Republican Party is disintegrating in front of our very eyes. Frankly, as a registered Republican, I'm glad. If they can't stick to their fundamental principles, low taxes WITH low expenditures, then to hell with them. |
I'm with you on that one. Maybe the party can be remade without idiots in charge of it. We can go back to an era when ideas and principles can be argued on merit, rather than supported by mindless morons with no respect for intelligence, fact, or logic. |
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| Groundhog Boy |
| quote: | Originally posted by LatinLover
Your lack of intelligence is the best proof of the Obama indoctrination. Save yourself.... changing to the GOP is your only salvation. |
Sure thing, professor.
:haha:
Related to that, just out of curiousity, why are delusions of grandeur so emblematic of your party these days? |
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| josh4 |
| quote: | Originally posted by Fir3start3r
'my camp' as you so succinctly put it (even though technically I'm not even in that camp being Canadian and all) has been pretty clear about Bush's ballooning government not being a good thing...
Why is 'your camp' only figuring this out now? |
Perhaps but I'm pretty active and have never heard it so explicitly stated until now. (On the boards and by prominent republicans.)
How can anything be expected to be accomplished in the party when dissent is not tolerated and clarity only comes with hindsight? |
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| Lebezniatnikov |
| quote: | Originally posted by Fir3start3r
Bush's ballooning government not being a good thing...
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Yet Reagan is mentioned more than God in conservative campaigns... interesting. |
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| Krypton |
| quote: | Originally posted by The17sss
That's a lot to get into, and you have some good points. You can't forget about the disaster Regan walked into... 12% inflation, 21% interest rates. Put your 10% unemployment rate figure in perspective please... it peaked in 1982 during that recession, but quickly changed and went down throughout the next 6 years. Inflation significantly decreased, and his administration created between 16-20 million jobs while he was in office. |
He did by drastically increasing the government deficit to record levels. Again, the failure of one's own principles, low taxes with low expenditures. |
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| MisterOpus1 |
| quote: | Originally posted by The17sss
I agree with you to a point about something here... I am NOT a fan of Bush, and I hate how he has gone against everything conservative. I'm not in the least bit supportive of his massive expanision and spending tactics... he's part of the problem. |
You do realize, however, that both you and Bush share the same hero with this fallacy - Reagan. |
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| MisterOpus1 |
| quote: | Originally posted by The17sss
That's a lot to get into, and you have some good points. You can't forget about the disaster Regan walked into... 12% inflation, 21% interest rates. Put your 10% unemployment rate figure in perspective please... it peaked in 1982 during that recession, but quickly changed and went down throughout the next 6 years. Inflation significantly decreased, and his administration created between 16-20 million jobs while he was in office. |
I concede that point. However those jobs created was at the expense of the biggest government expansion in history at that time, not to mention borrowing $ out the ass, creating a gigantic deficit and putting us all into debt for years to come, which resulted in a lovely recession in it's own in 1990-91.
And that's why I don't toot the horn of the great economic expansion under Reagan so much - when it comes at the expense of creating a giant deficit and trade debt, how wonderful is it really?
| quote: | | BTW, I'm all for voicing dissention towards things done during the Bush administration. No problem. The issue about abortion, for me personally, is the one thing I buck the trend on... because I do support the woman's right to choose. But to make the point from the conservative side, the reasoning is simple and can also be respected: as I said before, conservatism stands for "life, liberty, pursuit of happiness." Without life, there is nothing else here, and if we're going to sit around indiscriminately deciding who lives and who dies based on our own convenience, that's not conservative. The essence of innocence is a child in the womb who has no choice over what happens to it. If conservatives don't stand up for that person, if the government won't, then nobody will. |
I understand the viewpoint of conservatives, just as I do for liberals. As I've stated numerous times in the past, I tend to be a fence-sitter on this one, if not lean slightly more into the pro-life camp. My point, however, was simply pointing out the potential irony of standing up for all liberties, as some Conservatives claim, yet often times end up picking and choosing those which are most convenient. This wasn't the case for you in this specific instance, however, so I'll let it go. |
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| The17sss |
| quote: | Originally posted by Groundhog Boy
Calling a spade a spade is not a personal attack. Stop crying like a little bitch.
I'm far past trying to convince you. I'm just pointing out to everyone else how idiotic most of your rants are and expressing my complete lack of respect for any of your ideas. I mean, for one thing, you consider me to be this extremist liberal who supports a complete nanny state, which couldn't be further from the truth. |
Who's crying like a little bitch? You're the one who goes berzerk if someone disagrees with your political world view. If you support Obama and his far left policies, then you do support a nanny state... simple. He and his cronies want to tax and spend the out of us, and create new massive government expansion and entitlement programs because it's "fair"... it's the people who achieve that will be punished, not just the rich. Your boy Barney Frank isn't even hiding it anymore, since he feels vicory is in sight. Biden's out there telling people he's going to go after the rich's pensions to "even the playing field." What ever happened to your money being your money? Obama's policies will depress investment in businesses and innovation, and the creation of new jobs if he's saying once you get to that $250K plateau, your tax burden will increase even more; where's the incentive if you're success is going to be punished by "spreading the wealth around"? I don't know about you, but I don't know anybody who ever got a job from a poor person. You are a walking contradiction. And an ignorant one at that. |
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| The17sss |
| quote: | Originally posted by MisterOpus1
I concede that point. However those jobs created was at the expense of the biggest government expansion in history at that time, not to mention borrowing $ out the ass, creating a gigantic deficit and putting us all into debt for years to come, which resulted in a lovely recession in it's own in 1990-91.
And that's why I don't toot the horn of the great economic expansion under Reagan so much - when it comes at the expense of creating a giant deficit and trade debt, how wonderful is it really?
I understand the viewpoint of conservatives, just as I do for liberals. As I've stated numerous times in the past, I tend to be a fence-sitter on this one, if not lean slightly more into the pro-life camp. My point, however, was simply pointing out the potential irony of standing up for all liberties, as some Conservatives claim, yet often times end up picking and choosing those which are most convenient. This wasn't the case for you in this specific instance, however, so I'll let it go. |
right on... right on... you make good points |
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| Lebezniatnikov |
| quote: | Originally posted by The17sss
where's the incentive if you're success is going to be punished by "spreading the wealth around"? |
Ask Adam Smith:
"The necessaries of life occasion the great expense of the poor. . . . The luxuries and vanities of life occasion the principal expense of the rich, and a magnificent house embellishes and sets off to the best advantage all the other luxuries and vanities which they possess. . . . It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion." |
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