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Studio subwoofers
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| david.michael |
Yeah, I know, I'm about to get in trouble.
You hear it time and again... keep subwoofers out of the studio... But, I think I'm going to break the rules.
Every single one of my mixdowns turns out bass-heavy. Ridiculously. Every time. Thank god I'm thorough enough to listen to all of my tracks on various systems before making them public. Car stereos reveal all. :stongue:
I'm one of those producers that makes almost all my decisions off of my ear. I never have any idea that my song is a mud-puddle of bass when I'm listening through my monitors.
Maybe I just need bigger or different monitors. I'm using Event ALP5's and I'm sure that has something to do with it. But, still... everyone pushes all this "flat" and "accurate" response stuff all the time... yet I can't help but realize that you can't tweak something you can't hear.
Anyway, I know I'm going to get harassed for even considering this, but I'm mainly curious to see if there is anyone else here who had to add a sub/change to bigger monitors/started using hi-fi speakers/etc. because of this problem. |
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| Kenny Rogers |
| how bout some bigger/better monitors instead? a sub will only help on the subs, while a bigger monitor will also help you get more detail 80-150Hz area where 5" is messy. doesnt seem your monitors have any room correction mode either so they are probably very boomy around the freq mentioned because u have them placed directly on the table and you might try to make up on that adding sub freqs. i did add a sub, it only helped enjoying the music more, not the mixdowns. i sold it, got new monitors instead and it was the best decision ive made since buying Reason (Reason was good to me incase you took it the wrong way). get genelec 8030/40! |
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| david.michael |
| quote: | Originally posted by Kenny Rogers
how bout some bigger/better monitors instead? a sub will only help on the subs, while a bigger monitor will also help you get more detail 80-150Hz area where 5" is messy. |
Yeah, not a bad idea and that's a good point.
| quote: | | doesnt seem your monitors have any room correction mode either so they are probably very boomy around the freq mentioned because u have them placed directly on the table and you might try to make up on that adding sub freqs. |
Not so sure on that one... I don't add sub freqs (at least, not intentionally) because I can't even hear them. That's kinda my point. Though, we may be making the same point here, lol.
Basically, I can't hardly make sub-bass lines because I can't even hear them happening. Push on the midi keyboard and I see meters going, just can't really hear much. :)
| quote: | | i did add a sub, it only helped enjoying the music more, not the mixdowns. i sold it, got new monitors instead and it was the best decision ive made since buying Reason. |
That might be a better approach. Dealing with a 5" driver might be really causing my issues. |
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| Kenny Rogers |
| while 5" is good on vocals etc they usually suck on bass. note usually. you could try putting them on stands to fix the messynes/boomyness in the 100Hz, maybe youll hear the subs then. |
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| DJ RANN |
Get bigger(better) monitors. As you've assessed, you're mixes are bass heavily becuase you can't hear the bass in the forts place.
A sub, will just give you big low end and you'll have this nice gap between where the monitors roll off and the sub kicks in (in terms of frequency).
I also HATE monitors and sub combos anyway (apart from if you have a DJ setup and the sub is purely used for enjoyment purposes (if you like that sort of thing).
I don't even call it 2.1 anymore as that would denote it has a separate channel for the LFE, which stereo system + a sub don't have.
The 8030/40's are very nice, and I'm sure you're aware of my commission scheme with Yamaha (HS80) and JBL (LSR 2325P) but anything (apart from KRK) that is 6" and above will probably give you better bass response. |
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| Mise |
| go for 8' you wont regreat it! |
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| david.michael |
| quote: | Originally posted by DJ RANN
I also HATE monitors and sub combos anyway (apart from if you have a DJ setup and the sub is purely used for enjoyment purposes (if you like that sort of thing). |
No worries... I have legit performance speakers for that. :) A pair of QSC K-12's.
| quote: | | The 8030/40's are very nice, and I'm sure you're aware of my commission scheme with Yamaha (HS80) and JBL (LSR 2325P) but anything (apart from KRK) that is 6" and above will probably give you better bass response. |
Commission scheme? |
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| Kenny Rogers |
would also love to hear some opinions on the focal cms65 from someone i know, maybe you could demo them? they are serious competition of the 8040 it seems. i dont trust a single word on gearslutz so would be nice to hear it from someone here instead who actually listen to real music (lol).
edit: budget first, i forgot about that, whats your budget? :D |
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| Rodri Santos |
i always listen with a sub on but not when mixing down, is a part of the test:
- Monitors
- Headphones
- Car
- Kitchen player
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listening with a sub is like testing how it would sound in a club, but if you mixdown with your subwoofer switched on most probably the whole kick and bass wouldn't work on the rest of listening scenarios. |
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| DJ RANN |
| quote: | Originally posted by david.michael
No worries... I have legit performance speakers for that. :) A pair of QSC K-12's.
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Nice - you're sorted then in that respect
| quote: | Originally posted by david.michael
Commission scheme? |
Just an ongoing joke relating to the amount of times I've recommended them. I own the JBL LSR 2325p and I think I've convinced at least 5 people to buy HS80's so far.
@palm - Personally I think the CMS65's are EXTREMELY good monitors (heard/used them in one session) but the thing I have trouble with is that when you're spending that much, I reckon just bite the bullet and go all the way to Focal twins which are just in a different league until you spend $4000+. The only provision to that is if you have a small room, the focals won't work and if you're going that far make sure you don't have square glass goldfish tank of an apartment with no desk and acoustic treatment ;)
The MCS65's work better in smaller spaces and you're also not spending all that money on the expensive twins, especially when you can't get the full benefit of the focal due to environmental concerns. |
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| orTofønChiLd |
| I hate the sound of subwoofers. The only time i like them is when i'm watching a movie or playing video games |
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| UXC |
To get a sub to work for your as a reasonable reference you have to make sure the crossover settings you use work. You will need to acoustically treat your room for all the low end frequencies and that alone is a mind job and a half because doing it right is rather costly and requires lots of analysis. Some frequencies you will not be able to fix so you have to insure to compensate using some sort of eq (this could get costly if done right and it usually does more harm than good if not done right).
Oh and you have to position it right in your room, that is if you have a decent room ratio and size. The size is comparable to the sub/subs you want to use, also using more than one sub is often needed to insure a proper listing environment (even in the sweet spot).
All in all, as you can see low end is a bitch, am in the middle of figuring out my sub situation and its basically making re consider my whole listing environment. In a way it was the push i needed to finally construct a real studio space.
Keep in mind i'm a noob at this but i'm in the same boat as you but I totally realize its an uphill battle.
Ideally I would like to simply use the sub for A/B comparison using a foot switch (club vs normal listening) while I work. |
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