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Islam is a Religion of Peace? (pg. 8)
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| ziptnf |
| quote: | Originally posted by Kenny Rogers
have u seen how dogs without a charismatic, loving and strict owner act? |
You know that most societies have things called "governments", right? Religion doesn't dictate and regulate the actions of members living in those societies. People in the modern age use religion as a crutch to help them explain why the world works the way it does, it doesn't act as an "owner" to their entire functional lifestyle, unless of course, they are a religious extremist. |
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| EddieZilker |
| quote: | Originally posted by Kenny Rogers
argue with me damnit |
That should be your user title. |
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| Saka |
Why did the baker have smelly hands?
Because he kneaded a poo. |
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| Arbiter |
| quote: | Originally posted by Znack
A few world news items from the last couple of days;
15 12.2010 (Chahbahar, Iran) - Forty-one Shias are blasted to death in their own mosque by a Sunni suicide bomber.
15.12.2010 (Nalchik, Russia) - A moderate cleric is shot in front of his home for 'resisting religious extremism.'
15 12.2010.(Kandahar, Afghanistan) - Three children are disassembled by fundamentalists, who hide a bomb on a bicycle.
14.12.2010 (Baghdad, Iraq) - Sectarian rivals murder three more Shia pilgrims with a roadside bomb.
14 12.2010 (Diyala, Iraq) - Two Shia pilgrims are blown to bits by
Sunni bombers.
14.12.2010 (Peshawar, Pakistan) - Sunnis attack an 'unIslamic' shrine and shoot three Sufi infidels to death.
I have to say, they look pretty terrifying and violent to me, but I’m probably not looking at the poor oppressed perpetrators of these events with a sufficiently sympathetic eye. |
No ; the point is that there's no demonstrable increase, not that terrorism doesn't exist. I could find plenty of murders in the past few days by searching Google news, but there's a clear long-term downward trend in homicide rates.
Maybe if you came out from underneath your bed sheets once in a while and experienced the real world you'd grasp the difference. |
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| The17sss |
| quote: | Originally posted by Arbiter
Let's get a couple of things straight, son:
1. There is no "rise of terrorism and violence." Isolated incidents of terrorism have been going on for decades, and there is no evidence of any substantial upward trend in the number or severity of such incidents. On the other hand, there is a clear trend in worldwide violence: a downward one. So much for the rise of terrorism and violence. |
:wtf:
Last person I expected to have their head in the sand...
http://pewglobal.org/2006/06/22/the...iew-each-other/
I would say there's a problem in Nigeria... Quoth Mark Steyn: "You don’t have to subscribe to the view that every Muslim is a jihadist nutcake eager to hijack a 747 and head for the nearest tall building to acknowledge that at the very minimum these population trends put a large question mark over the future."
55% of Arabs surveyed believe offensive words or actions justify violence:
| quote: | | A YOUGOV poll commissioned by the Doha Debates has concluded that nearly one-third of all Arabs believe that Saudi Arabia is at greater risk from religious extremism than any other country in the world. The poll adds weight to the vote at a session of the Doha Debates held on March 3 in Doha, where the motion “This house believes that Muslims are failing to combat extremism”, was carried by more than 70% of the audience. In the YouGov survey, nearly half of all Arabs in the Gulf, Levant and North Africa said they have met someone who holds extreme religious views. Asked under what conditions violence is permissible, more than 60% cited Western interference in a Muslim country, while 55% said offensive words or behaviour was a trigger. |
http://www.gulf-times.com/site/topi...36&parent_id=16
From Reuters: One in 10 Indonesian Muslims back violent jihad. (for those of you scoring at home, that's about 22,000,000 people).
| quote: | JAKARTA, Oct 15 (Reuters) - Around one in 10 Indonesian Muslims support jihad and justify bomb attacks on Indonesia's tourist island of Bali as defending the faith, a survey released on Sunday showed.
Indonesia is the world's fourth most populous country, with 220 million people, 85 percent of whom follow Islam, giving the Asian archipelago the largest Muslim population of any nation in the world.
"Jihad that has been understood partially and practised with violence is justified by around one in 10 Indonesian Muslims," the Indonesian Survey Institute said in a statement.
"They approved the bombings conducted ... in Bali with the excuse of defending Islam," it added, saying the percentage of such support "is very significant". |
http://www.jihadwatch.org/2006/10/o...ihad-group.html
From Pew Reporting: Millions of Muslims believe that violence against civilian targets in the name of Islam can be justified: http://pewglobal.org/files/pdf/253.pdf
25% of Younger US Muslims Approve of Suicide Bombings:
| quote: | | One in four younger U.S. Muslims say suicide bombings to defend their religion are acceptable at least in some circumstances, though most Muslim Americans overwhelmingly reject the tactic and are critical of Islamic extremism and al-Qaida, a poll says. |
http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation...americans_N.htm
Cleverly, the article focuses on the fact that "the majority" of them reject it- but 25% approving of suicide bombings is a tad high, wouldn't you say?
Great Britain currently looking at 4000 terrorism suspects:
| quote: | Up to 4,000 terrorism suspects and their supporters are active in Britain, the former Metropolitan Police Commissioner Lord Stevens said yesterday.
Lord Stevens said the security service MI5 had recently suggested a figure of 2,000 but the true number was "probably nearer 4,000".
Police and MI5 were "still too underfunded and undermanned to cope with the task they face in the decades to come. And that's how long this will last," he said.
The "infection" had spread out from "hot spots" such as Luton, the West Midlands and Finsbury Park in London and those involved in the fertiliser bomb plot case which finished this week were "ordinary and British".
Lord Stevens also gave warning that al-Qa'eda-linked extremists were already trying to infiltrate the police and the security services and that dozens had already been weeded out. |
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/ukn...ects-in-UK.html
But uh, yeah there's just a few of 'em out there... no trends. Can't be blaming one of the world's "great religions" (according to who?) on just a few whackjobs!
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| EddieZilker |
Please refer to every piece of dialogue strewn throughout this -hole of a thread to find some rather clear delineations between causation and correlation and how both concepts relate to Islam and Terror. |
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| pkcRAISTLIN |
| quote: | Originally posted by Arbiter
No ; the point is that there's no demonstrable increase, not that terrorism doesn't exist. I could find plenty of murders in the past few days by searching Google news, but there's a clear long-term downward trend in homicide rates.
Maybe if you came out from underneath your bed sheets once in a while and experienced the real world you'd grasp the difference. |
Im not necessarily disagreeing with you (I haven’t seen the data) but homicides aren’t the same thing as terrorist acts. No, I don’t want this to devolve into a pointless attempt to codify what terrorism is, it’s like pornography. I know it when I see it. |
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| EddieZilker |
| quote: | Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN
Im not necessarily disagreeing with you (I haven’t seen the data) but homicides aren’t the same thing as terrorist acts. No, I don’t want this to devolve into a pointless attempt to codify what terrorism is, it’s like pornography. I know it when I see it. |
Sure could go for some lesbian bondage terrorism, if you know what I mean. ;) |
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| eckmek |
| quote: | Originally posted by Banora
Ugh, you embarrass Denmark. I bet you're the kind of person who supports that horrible Pia woman, too, aren't you? |
+1 |
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| MrJiveBoJingles |
How are those links supposed to relate to Arbiter's (true) observation?
There is no "rise in terrorism." But there is a rise in media attention to it, and more obvious friction between Muslim immigrants and Europeans because of their recent higher numbers. |
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| Arbiter |
| quote: | Originally posted by The17sss
(snip) |
I really don't know why this is such a difficult concept for people, but "there is no rise of terrorism" is not the same thing as "there is no terrorism." There's plenty. Has been for centuries. It's not a new phenomenon, and there's no data suggesting it's getting any more common, at least on a global level. I'm sure there are some regions where terrorism is way up; on the other hand, there are regions where there has been a marked decline in terrorism.
There is terrorism. It's bad. We should go after it a lot more aggressively than we are now. But none of that has anything to do with whether or not terrorism is actually increasing. |
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| Arbiter |
| quote: | Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN
Im not necessarily disagreeing with you (I haven’t seen the data) but homicides aren’t the same thing as terrorist acts. No, I don’t want this to devolve into a pointless attempt to codify what terrorism is, it’s like pornography. I know it when I see it. |
Sheesh. It's called an analogy. I guess this just goes to show that there's nothing like a little fear-mongering to turn otherwise right thinking people into a pack of slavering neanderthals. |
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