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So....PKC's dad made a new video
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| Lira |
And here I was hoping for a home video of a kid with a wizard robe fighting Tasmanian devils :(
As for the actual content of the video, I wish we lived in a world as simple as the one this guy portrays. Oh, how awesome would a world without religion/Islam be! We'd only have to worry about nationalism, hooliganism, political clashes, economic inequality, whether there are more naked pics of Scarlett Johansson on the web, and other trifling sources of conflict.
Edit: On second thought, SJ's pics are actually serious business. |
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| pkcRAISTLIN |
| quote: | Originally posted by Lira
We'd only have to worry about nationalism, hooliganism, political clashes, economic inequality, whether there are more naked pics of Scarlett Johansson on the web, and other trifling sources of conflict.
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Whereas dealing with all those issues with religion thrown into the mix makes them much more manageable, right? |
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| EddieZilker |
| quote: | Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN
Whereas dealing with all those issues with religion thrown into the mix makes them much more manageable, right? |
Just turn it all over...
...to God! :gsmile: |
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| Lira |
| quote: | Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN
Whereas dealing with all those issues with religion thrown into the mix makes them much more manageable, right? |
In a sense, and as counter-intuitive as it may sound when I drop the three letter answer, yes. The decrease in religiosity levels in Europe and Canada are correlated with many socio-economical changes, such as income gap and general development levels.
Here, just so you can have a taste, let's pick the US as an example and see what the states with the lowest HDI are (that's how they're ordered", and compare it with their Gini coefficient and ILJ Index, shall we? ILJ stands for "I Love Jesus Index" in the following table, and represents the percentage of people surveyed by Gallup who responded the question "Is religion an important part of your daily life?" in the affirmative.
| State | HDI (rank) | Gini Co. (rank) | ILJI | HDI comparable to | | Mississippi | 0.867 (#51) | 0.468 (#40) | 85 | Luxembourg | | Alabama | 0.888 (#49) | 0.472 (#45) | 82 | Israel | | South Carolina | 0.904 (#43) | 0.461 (#32) | 80 | Sweden | | Tennessee | 0.899 (#45) | 0.468 (#40) | 79 | Hong Kong | | Louisiana | 0.889 (#48) | 0.475 (#47) | 78 | Iceland | | Arkansas | 0.894 (#46) | 0.458 (#30) | 78 | Denmark | | Georgia | 0.922 (#38) | 0.468 (#40) | 76 | Slightly less than Australia | | North Carolina | 0.929 (#31) | 0.464 (#34) | 76 | Australia | | Oklahoma | 0.890 (#47) | 0.454 (#26) | 75 | Israel | | Kentucky | 0.900 (#44) | 0.466 (#36) | 74 | Japan | | Texas | 0.934 (#26) | 0.469 (#46) | 74 | Slightly less than Norway |
With the notable exception of one outlier (Texas), these are amongst the poorest states in the US (and, if you compare it to the world in general, they're not low indices). Texas has got, however, one of the worst income distributions in the country, and the other states aren't exactly beacons of equality either, which still points to a negative correlation between wealth and equality, on the one hand, and religiosity, on the other. So, yeah, fix this first (without slagging religious people off) and they'll either be more civil (is there a religious nutter here? No; are all TA's atheists? No) or just downright irreligious. Isn't it what happened in Canada/Europe/Oceania/Japan?
Battling religion head on without tackling these other problems first has only led to more fundamentalism, if anything. |
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| LAdazeNYnights |
| quote: | Originally posted by Lira
In a sense, and as counter-intuitive as it may sound when I drop the three letter answer, yes. The decrease in religiosity levels in Europe and Canada are correlated with many socio-economical changes, such as income gap and general development levels.
Here, just so you can have a taste, let's pick the US as an example and see what the states with the lowest HDI are (that's how they're ordered", and compare it with their Gini coefficient and ILJ Index, shall we? ILJ stands for "I Love Jesus Index" in the following table, and represents the percentage of people surveyed by Gallup who responded the question "Is religion an important part of your daily life?" in the affirmative.
| State | HDI (rank) | Gini Co. (rank) | ILJI | HDI comparable to | | Mississippi | 0.867 (#51) | 0.468 (#40) | 85 | Luxembourg | | Alabama | 0.888 (#49) | 0.472 (#45) | 82 | Israel | | South Carolina | 0.904 (#43) | 0.461 (#32) | 80 | Sweden | | Tennessee | 0.899 (#45) | 0.468 (#40) | 79 | Hong Kong | | Louisiana | 0.889 (#48) | 0.475 (#47) | 78 | Iceland | | Arkansas | 0.894 (#46) | 0.458 (#30) | 78 | Denmark | | Georgia | 0.922 (#38) | 0.468 (#40) | 76 | Slightly less than Australia | | North Carolina | 0.929 (#31) | 0.464 (#34) | 76 | Australia | | Oklahoma | 0.890 (#47) | 0.454 (#26) | 75 | Israel | | Kentucky | 0.900 (#44) | 0.466 (#36) | 74 | Japan | | Texas | 0.934 (#26) | 0.469 (#46) | 74 | Slightly less than Norway |
With the notable exception of one outlier (Texas), these are amongst the poorest states in the US (and, if you compare it to the world in general, they're not low indices). Texas has got, however, one of the worst income distributions in the country, and the other states aren't exactly beacons of equality either, which still points to a negative correlation between wealth and equality, on the one hand, and religiosity, on the other. So, yeah, fix this first (without slagging religious people off) and they'll either be more civil (is there a religious nutter here? No; are all TA's atheists? No) or just downright irreligious. Isn't it what happened in Canada/Europe/Oceania/Japan?
Battling religion head on without tackling these other problems first has only led to more fundamentalism, if anything. |
fascinating stuff, lira
where do you find that data? the ilj index doesn't refer solely to christianity then? i'd be interested to see if that particular correlation exists outside of the US as well. My intuition tells me it doesn't. Perhaps it would still hold true with just GINI and ILJ index (though I'm struggling to come up with an adequate reason why), but I don't see it being true with HDI. Maybe I just have an incomplete picture of the developing world, but I don't see SSA countries as being heavy into religion. Certainly not as big on it as countries in the middle east that are far more developed than they are. |
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| Bondor |
| "hooliganism" just became a real thing that i have 100% signed up for 13 years ago. |
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| Lira |
| quote: | Originally posted by LAdazeNYnights
fascinating stuff, lira
where do you find that data? |
I nicked it off Wikipedia (I didn't have THAT much time to kill :p)
| quote: | Originally posted by LAdazeNYnights
the ilj index doesn't refer solely to christianity then? |
The Gallup survey doesn't say anything about it, but I guess not. I just dubbed it "ILJ" and not "ILM" (I love Mohammed) or "ILB" (I love the Buddha) because Christianity is America's most important religion.
| quote: | Originally posted by LAdazeNYnights
i'd be interested to see if that particular correlation exists outside of the US as well. My intuition tells me it doesn't. Perhaps it would still hold true with just GINI and ILJ index (though I'm struggling to come up with an adequate reason why), but I don't see it being true with HDI. Maybe I just have an incomplete picture of the developing world, but I don't see SSA countries as being heavy into religion. Certainly not as big on it as countries in the middle east that are far more developed than they are. |
The correlation does hold abroad (naturally, my first comparison was too simplistic, but it's supposed to be just a sample). I don't have the time to make yet another table, but you can definitely spot the pattern:
Gini (I hope you're not colour-blind, this graph is a mess :p)
HDI (the darker the country, the higher the HDI)
Something akin to the ILJ Index
There are serious researchers, like Phil Zuckerman, who investigate the sociology of irreligion. If someone really wants to be an anti-theist, they're better off actually trusting science and following the advice of people like Zuckerman than taking the New Atheists too seriously. They're fun though, gotta give you that.
Edit: Fixed typo. |
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| Moongoose |
| quote: | Originally posted by Lira
, whether there are more naked pics of Scarlett Johansson on the web, and other trifling sources of conflict.
Edit: On second thought, SJ's pics are actually serious business. |
Its overwhelming, and its blocking the really important stuff. If there wasnt religion to bother you, maybe you would have noticed the half naked pics of Olivia Munn and Christina Hendricks i posted a couple of weeks ago. |
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| Lilith |
North Carolina 0.929 (#31) 0.464 (#34) 76 Australia
BRB, hanging some blacks.
Actually is it fair to compare a single US State against an entire country's demographic? |
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| Lira |
| quote: | Originally posted by Lilith
Actually is it fair to compare a single US State against an entire country's demographic? |
For argumentative purposes, yeah, it gives you a bit of an idea of what the number represents... but it's just ONE index, doesn't really make much sense without the context.
| quote: | Originally posted by Moongoose
Its overwhelming, and its blocking the really important stuff. If there wasnt religion to bother you, maybe you would have noticed the half naked pics of Olivia Munn and Christina Hendricks i posted a couple of weeks ago. |
I did see them :crazy:  |
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| LAdazeNYnights |
| What's really interesting about the GINI data for US states: the states with the least equitable distribution of wealth seem to all, politically, lean heavily to the right. That's been a hot topic this election already. |
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