Originally posted by zGoogleman
Most people can't afford to invest cause they have to keep supporting people like Halcyon and welfare types.
Maybe this society should focus on how to reduce the cost of living? One of the major costs is government "support".
:stongue: You're a ing mong.
zGoogleman
quote:
Originally posted by Joss Weatherby
:stongue: You're a ing mong.
What's a mong?
Nrg2Nfinit
quote:
Originally posted by Lews
The original elite were, yes; the problem is when you get families just holding on to ridiculous amounts of wealth forever.
so ? I think the bigger problem is people that borrow money, don't pay it back and then declare bankruptcy. This is far worse than "hoarding" money over generations. If that hoarded money isn't invested; inflation will take care of it very quickly. Not to mention day to day expenses and high cost assets that require maintenance (money that goes back into the system).
Watch a documentary on lottery winners and how they easily blow all their money in a span of less than 10 years.
quote:
Please, you know that most people can't afford to invest anywhere near enough for it to make a difference.
So by increasing taxation that's suppose to encourage investing? I'll use myself as an example again. last year i earned less than 50k salary before taxes, and managed to add an extra 16% extra (about 7.5K in gains) from investing before taxes. Now unfortunately that wasn't all in my tax free account, but had i been taxed my full marginal rate, i wouldn't bother investing.
There are also stock options that corporations give to their regular employees which they can match your contribution from your salary. when you sell those as well, you do not want to be paying full marginal rates.
Anyways, that's just my point of view; albeit biased as i do prefer to diversify where my income comes from.
Joss Weatherby
Again Karim it is laughable that you think you can have a dog in this fight when talking about the US. You have no idea how bad it is here apparently.
The infrastructure in this country is falling apart at the seams and the only entities that are capable of funding the repair and replacement (and hopefully the improvement) of that infrastructure is government through tax money.
Lews
quote:
Originally posted by Nrg2Nfinit
so ? I think the bigger problem is people that borrow money, don't pay it back and then declare bankruptcy. This is far worse than "hoarding" money over generations. If that hoarded money isn't invested; inflation will take care of it very quickly. Not to mention day to day expenses and high cost assets that require maintenance (money that goes back into the system).
Watch a documentary on lottery winners and how they easily blow all their money in a span of less than 10 years.
I'm very aware of what happens to most lottery winners. My comment was in response to your claim that most people in the elite have worked hard for that. I am responding that no, a lot of them haven't.
quote:
Originally posted by Nrg2Nfinit
So by increasing taxation that's suppose to encourage investing? I'll use myself as an example again. last year i earned less than 50k salary before taxes, and managed to add an extra 16% extra (about 7.5K in gains) from investing before taxes. Now unfortunately that wasn't all in my tax free account, but had i been taxed my full marginal rate, i wouldn't bother investing.
There are also stock options that corporations give to their regular employees which they can match your contribution from your salary. when you sell those as well, you do not want to be paying full marginal rates.
Anyways, that's just my point of view; albeit biased as i do prefer to diversify where my income comes from.
Where did I say that increasing taxation would encourage investing? Stephen's point was that the elite are able to make more money than poor people, are taxed less than poor people, and don't need to do any work to get any of this, and (I'm presuming) that perhaps it would be more fair to tax the rich at a higher rate in light of this. You responded glibly that the poor should simply invest more of their money. If they could do this, they wouldn't be poor! Your argument is basically:
It's both douchey and not a solution to the problem.
Joss Weatherby
Furthermore, I would encourage anyone to show me any evidence where this idea of trickle down economics has ever worked.
If you do that I will show you the literally hundreds (and thousands of national years when looking at countries at the same time) of years of evidence that taxation and then government investment have done wonders for economies.
So show me the evidence to why you feel your view on economics is right. I guarantee you that you will not find a single credible example of where Austrian style economics (which is what I am seeing offered here by a lot of people) works. You can't. You are in the same camp as flat earthers, creationists, and climate-change deniers. A bunch of ing jokers who want to just get away with what suits them best.
Disgusting.
zGoogleman
quote:
Originally posted by Joss Weatherby
Furthermore, I would encourage anyone to show me any evidence where this idea of trickle down economics has ever worked.
If you do that I will show you the literally hundreds (and thousands of national years when looking at countries at the same time) of years of evidence that taxation and then government investment have done wonders for economies.
So show me the evidence to why you feel your view on economics is right. I guarantee you that you will not find a single credible example of where Austrian style economics (which is what I am seeing offered here by a lot of people) works. You can't. You are in the same camp as flat earthers, creationists, and climate-change deniers. A bunch of ing jokers who want to just get away with what suits them best.
Disgusting.
Trickle down only works if you have connections. And again, you fail to prove that the infrastructure in the states is that bad. It isn't. You obviously have never seen what a Russian road looks like or Mexican. I wouldn't expect for the US to have roads like Germany cause Germans are good drivers. But for the numbers of drivers the states have, they have some really good roads.
And the government receives more than enough money to fix everything. They can't cause most of the money goes over shores to bank accounts of lawmakers. Or the lawmakers give jobs to contractors that charge ten times the price of what the work would cost anybody else. Corruption works.
Joss Weatherby
quote:
Originally posted by zGoogleman
Trickle down only works if you have connections. And again, you fail to prove that the infrastructure in the states is that bad. It isn't. You obviously have never seen what a Russian road looks like or Mexican. I wouldn't expect for the US to have roads like Germany cause Germans are good drivers. But for the numbers of drivers the states have, they have some really good roads.
And the government receives more than enough money to fix everything. They can't cause most of the money goes over shores to bank accounts of lawmakers. Or the lawmakers give jobs to contractors that charge ten times the price of what the work would cost anybody else. Corruption works.
And you are a conspiracy nutjob who should play in the streets, preferably one of our highways, and get hit, preferably by a private automobile.
That or die in a fire. Either one would be a more productive use of electricity than you ranting about a level of corruption that doesn't exist.
Nrg2Nfinit
quote:
Originally posted by Lews
I'm very aware of what happens to most lottery winners. My comment was in response to your claim that most people in the elite have worked hard for that. I am responding that no, a lot of them haven't.
i disagree. my point about the lottery winners is that if you aren't well versed in saving and earining (most importantly saving) the money goes back into the system very quickly; whether its for maintaining expensive assets or simply blowing it all on frivolous things. So even if someone inherits a load of money; they should be entitled to it, as most probably this is the intitial earners choice (should be fair as it is their earned money to delegate out!)
quote:
Where did I say that increasing taxation would encourage investing?
you didn't, but by that response i assume you want to decrease investment; because that's exactly what increasing taxation on investment will do. Especially those who are trying to break into alternative income means.
conversely, your graphic about buying more money; i would consider myself lower to middle income; and yes i would like to buy more money with my money ie invest it. I think everyone should learn to save and diversify their income methods and especially add risk to their portfolio at a younger age. I also find it amusing that as an investor yourself you don't promote this type of lifestyle.
The first thing that most americans need to learn however is to live within their means. before you can earn you have to learn to save.
Joss Weatherby
quote:
Originally posted by Nrg2Nfinit
The first thing that most americans need to learn however is to live within their means. before you can earn you have to learn to save.
You really have no idea how it is do you?
Nrg2Nfinit
quote:
Originally posted by Joss Weatherby
Again Karim it is laughable that you think you can have a dog in this fight when talking about the US. You have no idea how bad it is here apparently.
The infrastructure in this country is falling apart at the seams and the only entities that are capable of funding the repair and replacement (and hopefully the improvement) of that infrastructure is government through tax money.
well you can be thankful for mitt romneys 1.9 million dollar contribution to taxation; and on the same tken dissapointed at your ty bank system with loose lending policies; exacerbated by ignorant americans living beyond their means being dooped into sub prime mortgages / defaulting on their loans.
its a bitch to borrow money in canada; but looking at the US i should be thankful. i agree i do not have a dog in this fight.
