If you can't understand how similar hardware and software are, you don't really see the big picture. I woukd go further than that and say software opens up a million more avenues to create from scratch than hardware. And raphies decision seems to imply software involves your example of dj Ryan while hardware doesn't. It is a personal choice. Hardware has presets. The jp 8000 was trance's NI massive.
tehlord
quote:
Originally posted by Looney4Clooney
If you can't understand how similar hardware and software are, you don't really see the big picture. I woukd go further than that and say software opens up a million more avenues to create from scratch than hardware. And raphies decision seems to imply software involves your example of dj Ryan while hardware doesn't. It is a personal choice. Hardware has presets. The jp 8000 was trance's NI massive.
I'm not talking about the medium, I'm talking about the user.
Software is awesome, but it's user base is largely unskilled. To make a choice to use 'restrictive' hardware simply from a personal preference point of view indicates that the person involved has made an artistic choice.
The same can be said of a person that uses software only, or a combination. For the most part however I don't see that as being true at all.
I personally believe it's easier to be lazy using software as well. It's not like I'd ever give it up because it provides too many useful options in terms of sound design and flexibility, but having used both a lot I know that my preference is with the immediacy of hardware.
But again that's not the point. It's not about presets at all, it's about the process of creativity.
itsamemario
quote:
Originally posted by Raphie
let's not go there, your initial point was?
:stongue:
Well.. Not that it really has any bearing on the discussion.
But Mastering isn't a creative task. If making the song is drawing the picture with charcoal, then mastering is spraying on the coating that doesn't make it smudge.
Without the mastering, the song will still be a song, but without the song, the mastering has no reason to exist. Thusly we can gather that the creative part of the work is in the writing, and the mastering is nothing but the gloss on an apple. It makes the apple last a little longer and shine a little brighter. But it's all fake ;)
itsamemario
quote:
Originally posted by tehlord
The difference being described here is that person A sits down in front of a collection of musical instruments and (within the realms of their ability) creates something entirely from scratch with as little preconceived notion as possible.
Person B scrolls through Beatport to see what's current, then through Beatports sound pack selection, matches the two up and throws a few loops in Live and releases it as a single. If you're really lucky they might click a few notes in the piano roll and call it 'a melody'.
You could pick a million holes in each of these examples, but if you can't see the fundamental difference then you've probably not done both.
What about Person C who's all ITB on a laptop, but never uses the same sample twice?
Or person D who's also on a computer, but synthesizes all his sounds with a program he's written himself?
(Edit:Both of these guys pretty much falls in under person A. When I first read "collection of musical instruments" i was thinking all hardware like Raphie)
All your (Raphie's) arguments fall apart when you use broad sweeping generalisations like that. There aren't two types of producers, and even proposing the idea that every producer on a computer uses loops and presets is so preposterous that all your statements seem as poorly thought out as that one. The fact that you're making music in a specific way doesn't make your music better by that fact alone. Neither is it impressive. It's quirky if anything.
cryophonik
WTF was this thread about again? Ohhhhh yeah, that's right......
quote:
Originally posted by kadomony
Daaaamn this looks nice. Anybody running this at the moment?
Yeah, it does look nice. :)
Raphie
quote:
Originally posted by tehlord
The difference being described here is that person A sits down in front of a collection of musical instruments and (within the realms of their ability) creates something entirely from scratch with as little preconceived notion as possible.
Person B scrolls through Beatport to see what's current, then through Beatports sound pack selection, matches the two up and throws a few loops in Live and releases it as a single. If you're really lucky they might click a few notes in the piano roll and call it 'a melody'.
You could pick a million holes in each of these examples, but if you can't see the fundamental difference then you've probably not done both.
that's a fair summary!
Raphie
quote:
Originally posted by itsamemario
:stongue:
Well.. Not that it really has any bearing on the discussion.
But Mastering isn't a creative task. If making the song is drawing the picture with charcoal, then mastering is spraying on the coating that doesn't make it smudge.
Without the mastering, the song will still be a song, but without the song, the mastering has no reason to exist. Thusly we can gather that the creative part of the work is in the writing, and the mastering is nothing but the gloss on an apple. It makes the apple last a little longer and shine a little brighter. But it's all fake ;)
we don't dissagree? Again, what's wrong with people hiring someone to make their apple shine the brightest? And how does that relate to your initial statement about taking credits in a simmilar way as using a few loops and call yourself a producer?
itsamemario
Read 2nd post. I pretty much explained it all there.
Your "take a few loops and call yourself a producer"-argument is innately flawed and it has been explained to you why, so I'm not gonna waste any more time on that now.
Raphie
quote:
Originally posted by itsamemario
Read 2nd post. I pretty much explained it all there.
Your "take a few loops and call yourself a producer"-argument is innately flawed and it has been explained to you why, so I'm not gonna waste any more time on that now.
i'm sorry your comparison makes no sense to me (or anyone else)
Richard Butler
quote:
Originally posted by Raphie
composing has "evolved" to content selection and mangling
posing with other peoples talent.
I keep thinking about where this 'content selection' style of producing is going. Maybe it's an opportunity rather than a negative in that if more and more people start using those producer packs and loops, they will start to sound very similar.
itsamemario
quote:
Originally posted by Raphie
i'm sorry your comparison makes no sense to me (or anyone else)
2nd post. As in the one below the one you're referring to.
And don't speak on behalf of anyone else when you're clearly in the minority. ing dumbass.
Raphie
quote:
Originally posted by itsamemario
2nd post. As in the one below the one you're referring to.
And don't speak on behalf of anyone else when you're clearly in the minority. ing dumbass.
let's keep it nice, or do you want me to prove my point, with your little lame "i can push an Ableton button too video" ?!? I understand you feel discriminated as a loop pusher, so you should. Now, shall we play nice? Or do you want to go next level, your call.......
