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What's up with the Tiesto flaming (pg. 6)
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| Trance-Canada |
| quote: | Originally posted by ne1seenmykeys
OK, I have read all the replies in this thread, and have taken them all in with a grain of salt, both good and bad, and would just like to share my views on this topic, b/c I happen to feel svery strongly about this. Not just b/c Tiesto is one of my favorite DJ's, but b/c I think I have some very valid points that can pertain to ANY DJ out there.
1) He's trying to do too much right now. First of all, I know that this guy's heart and soul are in the right place, and I can tell through watching interviews and reading things he has written to fans, etc that do nothing but suggest that he feels sooo strongly about what he does/is - and entertainer. The way he talks about how music moves him, etc is awesome, and very heartfelt. With that said, I can only include that he would want to make his mark in every way possible. And for right now, I just think that may include biting off a little more than he can chew. I don't know what the guy's schedule is like, but right now, I feel that his production work (excluding his In My Memory album and Southern Sun, which I think are pure quality) is suffering from possib;ly trying to take on a whole lot of things at once. With that said, I also have to concede that I don't have a damn clue what goes on 100% of the time, so it is only pure speculation, at best, that we all give towards this matter
2) Give the guy a ing break. I know that harsh or whatever, but I just want to throw a few things out there for everyone to think about. 1st of all, he has a girlfriend, and for anyone that has (sucessfully) had a girlfriend knows what kind of time that takes. 2nd, add the tour(s) he does, the party nights, etc. 3rd, combine that with receiving/listening to promos he gets every week (if we could all be so lucky huh? LoL). PLUS, he owns a record company, record store, produces his own tracks, gets invitations to remix tracks, etc........now, throw that ALLLL together, and you have an average day in the life of Tiesto. I know what you're thinking..."aww, poor Tiesto" [/end sarcasm], but it's true. This man has to squeeze all this into the same 24-hour day everyone else does. PLUS, throw in the of everyday life.......deaths of family members/friends, or any other tragedy that everyone else deals with, and you can start to see how his mind wouldn't always be on top of things 100% of the time. Let's just say, for example, that he has a very colose friend die 2 weeks b4 he is to complete a remix for someone. The record company that is eventually going to have the rights to this song doesn't care about that (as far as sales go...they may personally). They care that he has [insert random remix] done by [insert date here]. So basically, what I'm saying is that you or I don't know 100% of the that goes on with him, or how that had affected his life, whether it be great or small. Now, I will agree with people that have said his productions have been less than stellar lately, but until you know WHY, don't just resort to saying "it's pure ." B/c no matter what you say, the WHY does matter.
3) PROGRESSION AS AN ARTIST. Now, I know that progression is normally associated with good things. But sometimes, and this is one of them, I think it can be associated with bad things, or not so good things. Every artsit, and I don't care what medium it is, is going to NEED a change every now and then. Think about ANY job you've had where you've said to yourself "god, if I had to do this every day for the rest of my life....." Now maybe you can understand what I'm saying. Right now just might be a time when he's trying to venture off into different areas and trying new things. Granted, once you do that you will lose a lot of the fan base that got you to where you are, but sometimes an artist needs to do something a little different to keep the creative spark alive. Even if half of us agree that what he's doing is not "what it used to be," he may be getting a sense of wholeness and a good feeling out of what he's putting out b/c it says that he's not one-dimensional (at least in people who like his stuff's eyes). I just don't understand everyone that wants him to stay with the syle that got him to the top year after year, set after set, etc. To ask that of an artist is asking them not to grow individually. And while it is US, the fans, that matters most in the end, I think we have a responsibility to the artist, in that we need to help them grow, even if it's not for the better. Hey, when worse comes to worse, he can look back and say "OK, that didn't work out so well, so time to try something different."
4) Speaking of responsibility to an artist, let me turn the tables on those of you who write things like "it's pure " or "it just sucks," etc. Say you had a work of art....whatever you are good at....on display somewhere. You have to know that not everyone is going to like it...that is a given. BUT, wouldn't you be a little concerned with WHY people didn't like it??? I know I sure as hell would. If you don't like a song, or even if you really do think it is 110% USDA cut-choice , without giving a reason as to WHY you don't like it brings no progress (in a good way...hehe) to the table. I see a lot of people writing "I wish he would go back to old-school Tiesto." Well, there's only one way that's going to happen. And it's NOT by saying "it's pure " without giving reasons why. What should he do to make it better? What was wrong with it to begin with, etc????? I know hardly any of us, myself included, have direct contact with these superstar DJ's, but there are forums that they vist. You could also write their record company to say "hey, I didn't like this song b/c [insert reason why]." Constrictive criticism is where it's at guys, I'm telling you. When noobs to DJ'ing get on here and post a mixto say "give me feedback...tell me what you think" people are normally pretty good at saying "ok, this was not so off b/c........." WHy can't it be that way for the big guys too?
Just some things to think about. I'm sorry this was so long, but I DO feel strongly about it....GREAT TOPIC!!!!!! |
Wow, perfectly said :) |
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| Miss Proximus |
| quote: | Originally posted by X-Hale
Tiesto is basically just a dissappointment at the moment. He used to be a master, his mixing was spot on, his tune selections were class, his sets and CDs were a joy to listen to. Recntly, Tiesto opted for a change in style and not for the better. His recent sets have been very samey, playing the same tunes for months! Hes dropped Lethal Industry in every t/l I've seen since April!
He needs to get some new tracks, his mixing is also suffering.
I hope Tijs can pull it around :) |
I'm sorry to but in, but I just wanted to tell you that Tiesto has been repetetive from the start. Nothing new about it, so why start bashing him now? :)
to any1seenmukeys: very good post :) (speechless now) |
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| 24K |
ne1seenmykeys- you made some awesome points that should help put a rest to the Tiesto hating/bashing.
HHAHHAHAHAHHAHHHA NICE! |
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| Arbiter |
Allow me to be the first person to disagree with the points you have made, although I commend the civil manner of your expressing them.
| quote: | Originally posted by ne1seenmykeys
OK, I have read all the replies in this thread, and have taken them all in with a grain of salt, both good and bad, and would just like to share my views on this topic, b/c I happen to feel svery strongly about this. Not just b/c Tiesto is one of my favorite DJ's, but b/c I think I have some very valid points that can pertain to ANY DJ out there.
1) He's trying to do too much right now. First of all, I know that this guy's heart and soul are in the right place, and I can tell through watching interviews and reading things he has written to fans, etc that do nothing but suggest that he feels sooo strongly about what he does/is - and entertainer. The way he talks about how music moves him, etc is awesome, and very heartfelt. With that said, I can only include that he would want to make his mark in every way possible. And for right now, I just think that may include biting off a little more than he can chew. I don't know what the guy's schedule is like, but right now, I feel that his production work (excluding his In My Memory album and Southern Sun, which I think are pure quality) is suffering from possib;ly trying to take on a whole lot of things at once. With that said, I also have to concede that I don't have a damn clue what goes on 100% of the time, so it is only pure speculation, at best, that we all give towards this matter |
He has the option of cutting things out of his schedule whenever he wants. If he can't perform at the level he used to, it is his responsibility (if he wishes to retain my respect, at least) to do what it takes to lighten the load so that he CAN continue to produce quality new tracks and add greater variety to his sets. If George W. Bush nuked Italy, I doubt very much an explaination of "Sorry, I had a lot of things going on at the time and it affected the quality of my decision making" would suffice. You have to be able to manage your time. Sometimes, that means not doing everything you want to do. He doesn't get a break from this responsibility just because of his fame.
| quote: |
2) Give the guy a ing break. I know that harsh or whatever, but I just want to throw a few things out there for everyone to think about. 1st of all, he has a girlfriend, and for anyone that has (sucessfully) had a girlfriend knows what kind of time that takes. 2nd, add the tour(s) he does, the party nights, etc. 3rd, combine that with receiving/listening to promos he gets every week (if we could all be so lucky huh? LoL). PLUS, he owns a record company, record store, produces his own tracks, gets invitations to remix tracks, etc........now, throw that ALLLL together, and you have an average day in the life of Tiesto. I know what you're thinking..."aww, poor Tiesto" [/end sarcasm], but it's true. This man has to squeeze all this into the same 24-hour day everyone else does. PLUS, throw in the of everyday life.......deaths of family members/friends, or any other tragedy that everyone else deals with, and you can start to see how his mind wouldn't always be on top of things 100% of the time. Let's just say, for example, that he has a very colose friend die 2 weeks b4 he is to complete a remix for someone. The record company that is eventually going to have the rights to this song doesn't care about that (as far as sales go...they may personally). They care that he has [insert random remix] done by [insert date here]. So basically, what I'm saying is that you or I don't know 100% of the that goes on with him, or how that had affected his life, whether it be great or small. Now, I will agree with people that have said his productions have been less than stellar lately, but until you know WHY, don't just resort to saying "it's pure ." B/c no matter what you say, the WHY does matter. |
I disagree wholeheartedly. The "WHY" is totally beside the point. In any industry, including music, you are responsible for the quality of product or service you provide regardless of your personal circumstances. If you run a small computer repair shop, and some relative dies, and you just take off and leave and nothing gets done for a week, and your customers need their equipment back for business operations, they're not going to be happy. They might say your service "is pure ." And they would be right. And if they told other people of their opinion, and recommended against them choosing you, they would be entirely justified in doing so. Unfortunate things do happen, but they do not excuse substandard performance.
| quote: |
3) PROGRESSION AS AN ARTIST. Now, I know that progression is normally associated with good things. But sometimes, and this is one of them, I think it can be associated with bad things, or not so good things. Every artsit, and I don't care what medium it is, is going to NEED a change every now and then. Think about ANY job you've had where you've said to yourself "god, if I had to do this every day for the rest of my life....." Now maybe you can understand what I'm saying. Right now just might be a time when he's trying to venture off into different areas and trying new things. Granted, once you do that you will lose a lot of the fan base that got you to where you are, but sometimes an artist needs to do something a little different to keep the creative spark alive. Even if half of us agree that what he's doing is not "what it used to be," he may be getting a sense of wholeness and a good feeling out of what he's putting out b/c it says that he's not one-dimensional (at least in people who like his stuff's eyes). I just don't understand everyone that wants him to stay with the syle that got him to the top year after year, set after set, etc. To ask that of an artist is asking them not to grow individually. And while it is US, the fans, that matters most in the end, I think we have a responsibility to the artist, in that we need to help them grow, even if it's not for the better. Hey, when worse comes to worse, he can look back and say "OK, that didn't work out so well, so time to try something different." |
If he wants to try something different, that's fine with me, but I think what he's trying now sucks. I'm not going to pretend I like his recent work just because it might be part of some touchy-feely artistic experience for him. If he changes again to a style I can appreciate again, I'll respect him again, but he isn't doing anything right now to impress me, and I really don't care why he made the decision to change. If Ferry Corsten decided to switch styles and start producing Country/Western, I'd say his stuff "was pure " too.
4) Speaking of responsibility to an artist, let me turn the tables on those of you who write things like "it's pure " or "it just sucks," etc. Say you had a work of art....whatever you are good at....on display somewhere. You have to know that not everyone is going to like it...that is a given. BUT, wouldn't you be a little concerned with WHY people didn't like it??? I know I sure as hell would. If you don't like a song, or even if you really do think it is 110% USDA cut-choice , without giving a reason as to WHY you don't like it brings no progress (in a good way...hehe) to the table. I see a lot of people writing "I wish he would go back to old-school Tiesto." Well, there's only one way that's going to happen. And it's NOT by saying "it's pure " without giving reasons why. What should he do to make it better? What was wrong with it to begin with, etc????? I know hardly any of us, myself included, have direct contact with these superstar DJ's, but there are forums that they vist. You could also write their record company to say "hey, I didn't like this song b/c [insert reason why]." Constrictive criticism is where it's at guys, I'm telling you. When noobs to DJ'ing get on here and post a mixto say "give me feedback...tell me what you think" people are normally pretty good at saying "ok, this was not so off b/c........." WHy can't it be that way for the big guys too?[/QUOTE]
Most of the time, I agree that it would be nice if people would give more information as to why they didn't like something than saying, "it's pure ." But they're perfectly entitled to express their opinions without justifying them, as long as they don't expect their statements to be very useful or convincing. Besides, the problems with most of Tiesto's latest work are frequently so blatantly obvious that they go without saying. When he plays only one or two different songs between sets, it doesn't take a genius to figure out that the reason people don't like them is because they're boring by virtue of being repetitive. His recent remixes, likewise, might be considered "pure " by a lot of people because, uh, maybe, they don't have a melody to speak of???
I don't know why people feel like they need to make excuses for Tiesto. He is an entertainer. It is his job to entertain. Right now, I, and many others, do not find what he is doing entertaining. Why should we respect an entertainer who does not entertain us when we know from past experience that he is fully capable of doing so? Disappointing people is not a good way to maintain their respect. Tiesto has lost mine because he has disappointed me too many times lately. I'd like nothing more than for him to earn it back. But he has to EARN it, it will not, and should not, be given, just because he _might_ have a reason for being disappointing. |
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| orange4 |
| quote: | Originally posted by ne1seenmykeys
1) He's trying to do too much right now. First of all, I know that this guy's heart and soul are in the right place, and I can tell through watching interviews and reading things he has written to fans, etc that do nothing but suggest that he feels sooo strongly about what he does/is - and entertainer. The way he talks about how music moves him, etc is awesome, and very heartfelt. With that said, I can only include that he would want to make his mark in every way possible. And for right now, I just think that may include biting off a little more than he can chew. I don't know what the guy's schedule is like, but right now, I feel that his production work (excluding his In My Memory album and Southern Sun, which I think are pure quality) is suffering from possib;ly trying to take on a whole lot of things at once. With that said, I also have to concede that I don't have a damn clue what goes on 100% of the time, so it is only pure speculation, at best, that we all give towards this matter
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even when? come back tiesto to your correct way that we all know.
right, he can to try that way, but maybe dont be the true way for his fans.
i'll always love his old works.... |
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| 24K |
| Arbiter- Nothing like beating a dead horse huh? And nice one on comparing Tiesto to George Bush nukeing Italy. LMFAO |
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| ne1seenmykeys |
| quote: | Originally posted by Arbiter
Allow me to be the first person to disagree with the points you have made, although I commend the civil manner of your expressing them. |
Likewise to you.....it seems to be ararity when discussions like this come up.....so, back atcha!!!!
| quote: | | He has the option of cutting things out of his schedule whenever he wants. If he can't perform at the level he used to, it is his responsibility (if he wishes to retain my respect, at least) to do what it takes to lighten the load so that he CAN continue to produce quality new tracks and add greater variety to his sets. If George W. Bush nuked Italy, I doubt very much an explaination of "Sorry, I had a lot of things going on at the time and it affected the quality of my decision making" would suffice. You have to be able to manage your time. Sometimes, that means not doing everything you want to do. He doesn't get a break from this responsibility just because of his fame. |
I totally agree with what you're saying, and I guess I need to clear something up so there's no mix-up in my statements about Tiesto. When I list the possible reasons as to why he is not up to par lately, it is by no means a way to EXCUSE what he is doing lately. B/c yes, he DOES have the choice to cut back, etc on what he does so one area does not become lacking. Hope that clears that up, and yes....if too much at once is the problem, then he needs to revaluate his priorities. Possibly even rest for awhile....take a vactaion from things for a little while and let himself regain whatever it is that he lost???????
| quote: | | I disagree wholeheartedly. The "WHY" is totally beside the point. In any industry, including music, you are responsible for the quality of product or service you provide regardless of your personal circumstances. If you run a small computer repair shop, and some relative dies, and you just take off and leave and nothing gets done for a week, and your customers need their equipment back for business operations, they're not going to be happy. They might say your service "is pure ." And they would be right. And if they told other people of their opinion, and recommended against them choosing you, they would be entirely justified in doing so. Unfortunate things do happen, but they do not excuse substandard performance. |
Again, I am in aggreance with you, and never did I say he should be excused by it. Possibly you read my post wrong in that I am trying to provide excuses for him, as opposed to what I REALLY was providing.....resons (not excuses...there is a difference) as to why his work might be suffering. I guess we will just have to agree to disagree in the fact that the WHY is as important as what is going wrong. Maybe I could/should have said that they WHY should be important to him, as opposed to the fans. That way, if HE evaluates why things are going so poorly in order to correct them, WE don't have to discuss topics like this :)
| quote: | | If he wants to try something different, that's fine with me, but I think what he's trying now sucks. I'm not going to pretend I like his recent work just because it might be part of some touchy-feely artistic experience for him. If he changes again to a style I can appreciate again, I'll respect him again, but he isn't doing anything right now to impress me, and I really don't care why he made the decision to change. If Ferry Corsten decided to switch styles and start producing Country/Western, I'd say his stuff "was pure " too. |
Again, I am with you. I do NOT like what he has been doing lately, and it is very diheartening to me, as a true fan, to watch him make this decline into mediocrity. But I have to add again, at the threat of sounding repetitive, that I am not excusing him by listing this reason. If I was wanting to excuse what he is doing, I would say "he is doing this because....." but what I have said is the possibilities of what is going on. I also mentioned the fact that if he is trying to fill some creative void in himself, he will risk losing the fan base that has been loyal to him and got him to the top, which is apparently happening based on responses to threads such as these. So again, I DO NOT like what he is doing right now, and that if this is some attempt to venture out into other areas, he needs to stop and continue with what made him so popular to begin with.
| quote: | | But they're perfectly entitled to express their opinions without justifying them, as long as they don't expect their statements to be very useful or convincing. |
Couldn't agree more. People can say what they want, but JUST making those comments do NOTHING to contribute to anything, other than adding one more to their post total.
| quote: | | I don't know why people feel like they need to make excuses for Tiesto. He is an entertainer. It is his job to entertain. Right now, I, and many others, do not find what he is doing entertaining. Why should we respect an entertainer who does not entertain us when we know from past experience that he is fully capable of doing so? Disappointing people is not a good way to maintain their respect. Tiesto has lost mine because he has disappointed me too many times lately. I'd like nothing more than for him to earn it back. But he has to EARN it, it will not, and should not, be given, just because he _might_ have a reason for being disappointing. |
You should respect him simply b/c of what he has done in the past. You seem to be saying that at some point in the past you have enjoyed his work/DJ'ing. If that is truly so, then why not keep some kind of respect for THE MAN HIMSELF??? I'm not saying respect the crap he is putting out right now.......but since youknow what he is capable of doing, why not try to keep some sort of optimism towards what he can do? I know it doesn't seem fair when he is disappointing you so much lately, but.....I dunno. I guess the only thing I can compare it to is sports. If fans just literally stopped coming to games simply b/c their team sucked over and over, what would be their motivation?
Again, thanks for the constructive reply. It's ones like these that I enjoy taking a part of on a daily basis. I agree with most of the stuff you said, and I think we are prettymuchsaying the same things.....just different ways. Have a great day, and also.....have faith!!!!!! :toocool: |
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| DuMonde TrAnCeR |
i heard tiesto last night, i can honestly say...
...good!
none of this 2 year old tunes, lost vagueness, carera 2, bollocks!
some uplifting techy tunes and a quality hard tune! its was eeeeevil. |
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| Arbiter |
| quote: | Originally posted by ne1seenmykeys
Again, thanks for the constructive reply. It's ones like these that I enjoy taking a part of on a daily basis. I agree with most of the stuff you said, and I think we are prettymuchsaying the same things.....just different ways. Have a great day, and also.....have faith!!!!!! :toocool: |
Since we seem to agree on most everything, just from different prespectives, I'll just add one last thing: I think he can, and might very well, again become the kind of entertainer we want him to be. I just think that the more people express their disappointment with him, the greater chance that he will see that many of his former fans are being disappointed (although I certainly agree that constructive criticism is far superior to a simple expression of opinion).
Cheers,
Arbiter |
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| ne1seenmykeys |
| quote: | Originally posted by Arbiter
Since we seem to agree on most everything, just from different prespectives, I'll just add one last thing: I think he can, and might very well, again become the kind of entertainer we want him to be. I just think that the more people express their disappointment with him, the greater chance that he will see that many of his former fans are being disappointed (although I certainly agree that constructive criticism is far superior to a simple expression of opinion).
Cheers,
Arbiter |
w0rd |
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| Durafei |
IMHO the only people who are dissapointed with Tiesto are hardcore "download it ALL 24 hours within release" tranceaddicts like us on this web-site.
Ask anybody who has seen Tiesto once, or who has a few of his albums and he'll tell you that Tiesto is the best DJ there is ! And he won't be dissapoited when he sees him live again ! |
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| Trancejedi |
| quote: | IMHO the only people who are dissapointed with Tiesto are hardcore "download it ALL 24 hours within release" tranceaddicts like us on this web-site.
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I feel the same way. It's been said before, he's spinning for the live crowd. He's NOT spinning for the mp3 dl's. If you don't like the music he's spinning now, fine, listen to someone else. I don't think it makes sense to flame him for playing similar sets, unless your following him around the world. :)
By the way...I thought his set at GK last night was mint. A lot of new tunes. |
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