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Jews Killed Jesus/Passion of the Christ (pg. 2)
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| beema |
The Romans killed Jesus. They strung him up on the cross and killed him. There were some Jewish supporters of this I'm sure, but the Romans ordered it done, and carried it out. People were crucified all the damn time back then. It was a Roman form of execution which degraded you and put you through extreme suffering. They did it to make examples out of people in order to enforce their will.
There was a special report called "The Last Days of Jesus" on NBC last week. It's mainstream media sure, but they interviewed a lot of scholars on the subject, and it's something that uninformed people should look at to get atleast a general understanding of it. Here is a link: http://msnbc.msn.com/id/4315203/
Pontius Pilate, who was a procurator of the Roman empire, was the man who ordered Jesus' execution. Some stuff about him here: http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/12083c.htm -- Including the statement that "the Jews hated him."
Why then didn't some massive anti-Italian prejudice stem from Jesus' death? Think about it you ing WASP s. It makes no ing sense. |
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| Busy Child |
i was gettin all confused till i read beemas post. Yea pontius pilate was the one ordering jesus to be killed.
my views are of course gonna be different since im catholic. |
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| Shad0wmaster |
| quote: | Originally posted by TuanAnh213
religion = root of all evil |
WERD!
BTW: If I'm not mistaken, Jesus himself was born Jewish...therefore all the anti-semitic hatred of Christians towards Jews has no validity...hate groups are twats on parade. |
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| torontotrance |
you have just opened a huge can of worms, I'll take it up in pm instead. Sighs....cult...bahhhhh |
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| Cal |
| quote: | Originally posted by Heinz
This doesnt really apply to seculars so u can either flame on, or ignore this discussion, but the new Mel Gibson movie is stirring up a huge amount of controversy because many say it is anti-semetic.
many hate groups, white sepremesists a large majority have huge hate for jews. many normal people have mixed feelings about them. but it is all stemming from the belief that Jews killed Jesus. if you "dont" think about it. yes jews did kill jesus. such a horrible crime against the almighty god. but what many christians and other people alike dont understand is that, it was God's will that Jesus be crucified. The Jews actually did God's will by having jesus crucified. if jesus hadnt died in such a way, then we would not be able to be saved, have everlasting life, or ever be accepted into heaven, because of our sinful nature and unrightiousness. we would be doomed forever, because it is only by rightiousness that we are accepted into heaven, not through good works, or just because your a good guy.
jesus died for us, so that we could be saved from this doom, and if one accepts him, becomes christian, and follows the teachings of Jesus, giving up old life, starting anew, then we are righteous before god. none of this could happen if jesus hadnt died on the cross.
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maybe we should thank the jews. because all they did was unconsioussly follow God's will to save us from everlasting death. |
My sentiments exactly. People that hate jews because of this are missing the point of Christ's death. |
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| Heinz |
Pontious pilate had nothing gainst jesus. pontius carryed out what the jews were screaming for. the execution of this heretic, blasphemous jew named jesus. pontius, afraid of another jewish uprising, which would result in questions from rome, authroized his soldiers to crucify jesus. the jews had pilate order his soldiers to do the dirty work of crucifixtion.
but essentially, it was the jews who "had" jesus killed. so the assumption that pilate killed jesus can be taken literally, because he gave the order. but it was the jews who brought jesus before him, demanding his death. pilate just did what the people wanted.
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Matt Jay, that doom is everlasting death.
Revelation 14
11And the smoke of their torment rises for ever and ever. There is no rest day or night for those who worship the beast and his image, or for anyone who receives the mark of his name."
^^everlasting death as i said. what happens when u burn? u die right? how about being burned with unending fury? its a death that never ends.
we were all destined for this fate, because man could not become righteous in his own will. jesus gives us the will, holy spirit, and the righteousness. he suffered what we would have had to suffer if he didnt die for us. except our suffering would never end. here is promise..
John 3:16
"For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.
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this is the promise unfortunatly to those who reject god.
John 3:18
Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because he has not believed in the name of God's one and only Son.
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to the arguement of why believe if u cant see. the bible has this passage to say.
John 1:18
No one has ever seen God, but by God the One and Only, who is at the Father's side, has made him known.
the One and Only is Jesus, who has made God known to us, as our friend, father, and personal savior. it is through jesus we know god. i dont think there is any other religion where a worshipper can truelly say they "know" their god. and jesus was somebody you could see, he was god, not a mere human. |
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| Floorfiller |
| quote: | Originally posted by torontotrance
you have just opened a huge can of worms, I'll take it up in pm instead. Sighs....cult...bahhhhh |
well...since i don't see any pm i'll just say that i did not mean that in an offensive way. of course, all religions are essentially cults, but what separates say islam and christianity from other religions is that they are so widely accepted. cult is not meant to be a deragatory term, its just been made into that with its association with dark arts and other radical extreme forms of organization. |
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| Floorfiller |
| quote: | Originally posted by Shad0wmaster
WERD!
BTW: If I'm not mistaken, Jesus himself was born Jewish...therefore all the anti-semitic hatred of Christians towards Jews has no validity...hate groups are twats on parade. |
i would just like to say that the lines between Christianity and Jewish sects were very blurred in antiquity. it is hard to tell the exact point in time when they are distinct groups. you must admit however, that at a time in the Roman empire, the distinction was made, and at this point we can no longer consider jesus as Jewish because he believes that he is the messiah and is leading a new religion based upon his teachings. At this point, when he is persecuted, it is not because he is jewish, but more because he is actively confrontational to the roman republic through his teachings of christianity. |
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| torontotrance |
He was put to death for saying he was God. Pilate did not want to piss off the Roman Emperor, who could have him put to death but did not want to execute an innocent man, so he let the crowd decide and they wanted the murderer released.
I'll send the pm later...lol.....too busy doing stuff. |
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| Floorfiller |
| quote: | Originally posted by torontotrance
He was put to death for saying he was God. Pilate did not want to piss off the Roman Emperor, who could have him put to death but did not want to execute an innocent man, so he let the crowd decide and they wanted the murderer released.
I'll send the pm later...lol.....too busy doing stuff. |
looking forward to it ;) |
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| gOOD-tRiP |
| the jews didnt kill jesus. It was one person that made the call to. Its like saying an american judge ordered the call to kill a man on death row, therefore the Americans killed that one person. |
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| astroboy |
| quote: | Originally posted by Heinz
Pontious pilate had nothing gainst jesus. pontius carryed out what the jews were screaming for. the execution of this heretic, blasphemous jew named jesus. pontius, afraid of another jewish uprising, which would result in questions from rome, authroized his soldiers to crucify jesus. the jews had pilate order his soldiers to do the dirty work of crucifixtion.
but essentially, it was the jews who "had" jesus killed. so the assumption that pilate killed jesus can be taken literally, because he gave the order. but it was the jews who brought jesus before him, demanding his death. pilate just did what the people wanted.
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You're inferring all of this from the bible... We've all heard it and know the story. Unfortunately the bible is as unreliable a historical text as you can get. When people talked about the Romans killing Jesus earlier, they were talking about historical inference drawn from a number of different sources. If people had hear of Jesus, he would only have been known in Nazareth and Jerusalem, not throughout all of Judaea. The fact is, the Jews (particularly in Jerusalem) were very divided at the time, SO to suggest that a majority of them had a united view about one particular sect, is unlikely. Most of these people, like anyone at the time, were struggling to survive and didn't particularly care what some nut said... these guiys were all over Jerusalem preaching revolutionary ideas. To suggest that they would have been so worked up as to gather in massive crowds and drag Jesus to the authorities is highly unlikely. The people that might have cared were the people at the top of the religious beaurocracy, because they are always paranoid about having their power undermined (the same impetus that drove the Vatican to put people with radical doctrines or scientific beliefs that contradicted the bible to death as heretics). So it is likely that the high priests (btw, many bible scholars will tell you that often when the New Testament says "the Jews" it refers specifically to the priests) exerted their influence on Roman authorities to catch this guy and make an example of him. The Romans were happy to oblige because it was in their interest to maintain good relations with the Jewish authorities, and after all Jesus was reaking the law. |
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