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Religion (pg. 2)
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| LiquidX |
| quote: | Originally posted by tiesto14
Religion over the centuries has been directly responsible for:
- Countless deaths
- Imprisonments
- Needless suffering
- Torturing
- Genocide
- The oppression of people on grounds of sex, race, color, sexuality or belief
- The Crusades
- The Inquisition
- The Holocaust
- Witch trials in Europe and America
- Persecution of heretics - e.g. Galileo for daring to suggest that the earth orbits the sun
- Children dying because their parents refused them medical treatment on religious grounds; relying instead on faith healers and prayer
- Slavery, supported by scripture (slaves, obey your earthly masters with respect and fear, just as you would obey Christ. St.paul, Ephesians 6:5)
- Holy wars in the name of benevolent, loving and merciful gods
- The destruction of great works of art considered being pornographic/blasphemous, and the persecution of the artists
- Censorship of speech, art, books, music, films, poetry, songs and, if possible, thought
- Persecution of blasphemers
- Serial killers believing they are doing the work of Satan (or sometimes Jesus)
- Wwhole societies divided by minor differences in belief or doctrine, resulting in violence.
- Mass suicides of cult-members following a charismatic leader who believes the world is about to end
- The discouragement of rational, critical thought
- The spread of sexually transmitted diseases (e.g. aids) due to churches prohibiting the use of condoms.
- Suicide bombers taught to believe that martyrs go straight to paradise
- The indoctrination of children into the religion of their parents, giving them an arbitrary, life-long belief that is almost entirely dependent on their place of birth
- Women treated as second-class citizens or even slaves
- Hatred of gays and lesbians
- Abuse of power, authority and trust by religious leaders (for financial gain or sexual abuse of followers and even children)
- Cults stockpiling weapons to defend themselves from the armies of Satan (the police and gov).
Religion is so damn great
:rolleyes: |
Let me say it again, is not religion, is PEOPLE who dont know how to use religion ;) .. People is not perfect, therefore, they distort every good sense of religion. Look @ Bush, saying that God told him to invade Iraq.. wtf is that.. is sad, it gives a bad perception to all the good things religion is supposed to bring.. this is what I call, Extremists, or, OPPORTUNISTS. Blame the individuals, who use the name of "religion" to abuse the powers. |
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| nic01445 |
| quote: | Originally posted by LiquidX
Let me say it again, is not religion, is PEOPLE who dont know how to use religion ;) .. People is not perfect, therefore, they distort every good sense of religion. Look @ Bush, saying that God told him to invade Iraq.. wtf is that.. is sad, it gives a bad perception to all the good things religion is supposed to bring.. this is what I call, Extremists, or, OPPORTUNISTS. Blame the individuals, who use the name of "religion" to abuse the powers. |
Actually, I would say that the people who use religion for their own gain are those who use it the best. The best, not in the sense that what they are doing is right, but in the sense that they are able to use religion as a tool for their own advancement. They indeed DO know how to USE religion, but use it as a tool rather than a means of self-actualization. |
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| JOEBIALEK |
| some excellent points...perhaps religion will someday evolve into spirituality |
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| trancaholic |
| quote: | Originally posted by occrider
My theory is that he wants to join the best polit forum ever. So he's sampling each and every single one of them, subjecting them to tests to find the best one. Then he'll actually become a regular member and engage in, you know, discussions and stuff. |
WTF? You mean interaction? Isn't that, like, totally reckless argumentation style? :wtf:
My own theory is that "Joe" is a computer program running in some social science/AI lab, periodically fed with an opening post, and then replying on its own in an insightful manner. BIALEK is probably some naughty abbreviation of the programmers' names. In a couple of years a series of articles will be written on "Joe" and how it tricked hundreds of internet users.
| quote: | Originally posted by occrider
Pick us!!! We're cool!!!! We'll treat you right joe baby! |
Yeah, we're cool. We have loads of stuff going for us. Like...eh...??? |
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| DrUg_Tit0 |
| quote: | Originally posted by ::TranceVanDyk::
humanity is a currupt race. war, murder, rape, incest, genocide, curruption, fraud, totalitarianism, islamic fundamentalism, neo-nazi's, drug empires, divorce, illegitamite children, drug addicts, abuse, mechanical failures, computer glitches, etc. |
Eh, I did follow you up to one point, but how on earth are mechanical failures and computer glitches a reflection of human courrpution?
| quote: | | the human race can never fix its imperfections on its own. |
Sure we can, in a few years we'll be able to genetically engeneer our offspring to be just the way we'd like them. But we can never be gods if that's what you mean. At least it seems so for now, but hey, you never know.
| quote: | Originally posted by a troll
some excellent points...perhaps religion will someday evolve into spirituality |
Is it just me or is this message universally applicable to pretty much any possible argument a person could come up with? |
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| ::TranceVanDyk:: |
| quote: | Originally posted by tiesto14
War?...more wars have been fought in the name of God then any other reason
Murder?...more people have died in the name of God then any other way since the beginging of time.
Rape/Incest?...Read the bible..then read on priests.
Genocide?...The Holocaust, Rwanda, shall i go on?
I would answer the rest of your claims....but not worth it.
Humanity is only corrupt BECAUSE of religion! |
wrong, more people have died from atheistic wars and regimes than any other reason in the entire history of the world. 50 million people died because of hitler. untold millions died under stalin. atheistic doctrines held eastern europe captive for half a century.
just because one dedicates a cause in the name of god does not mean it is of god. if u look at the crusades, there is no where in the bible to support such a venture. no where in the bible, does it sanction the spanish inquisition, purgatory, "holy wars", and other practices that have mostly been practiced under the catholic church, that non-theists like to through out as an arguement.
and are you telling me, you have never stolen, lied, thought about if u could physically hurt someone, been greedy, and the list goes on and on? |
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| nic01445 |
| quote: | Originally posted by ::TranceVanDyk::
wrong, more people have died from atheistic wars and regimes than any other reason in the entire history of the world. 50 million people died because of hitler. untold millions died under stalin. atheistic doctrines held eastern europe captive for half a century. |
Which wars and regimes are you refering to?
Well, in fairness to us non-theists, while Hitler himself might not have been "christian," the idea of clensing the world of non-Aryans did in some part have to do with exterminating non-christians. |
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| George Smiley |
| quote: | Originally posted by nic01445
Which wars and regimes are you refering to?
Well, in fairness to us non-theists, while Hitler himself might not have been "christian," the idea of clensing the world of non-Aryans did in some part have to do with exterminating non-christians. |
World War Two had nothing to do with religion. Hitler's brand of fascism was based on race - the Jews are a race, not just a religion. But that is irrelevent, we did not go to war with Germany to save the Jews, we (and when I say we yes, I mean the UK and Russia!!) went to war with Germany cos they treatened our security, sod all to do with religion. Vietnam was another nasty war, again, nothing to do with religion. I know this will get shot down, but I would say the Israel-Arab wars are not as much about religion as they are percieved. If you are aware, it was only in the late 80s when the Islamists (Hamas) came on the scene (well this was the time they took up arms anyway). Before that, the Palestinian commando groups were all aethiest/Marxists (and so were the Arab states who attacked Israel - pan Arab nationalism was socialist, altho they did use religious rhetoric as legitimation) and during the first Intifada Fatah members would go around Mosques trashing them and beating up clergy men (thats why they fight with Hamas so much - they are aethiests). Clearly Zionism is based on religion and without that ideology this conflict probably would not have taken place, and the situation we have now, with the Islamists popular, is also clearly religious. At the same time, there is nothing in Islam that says you must hate Jews. Jews and Muslims got on fine thoughout history, with the latter giving protection to the Jews during the Crusades. They hate each other now because of the land Arabs (Christian as well as Muslim) lost in 1948. Those lands were taken away because of a religious project, but from the Arab point of view, can you see why it is not as much as a religious issue as it is made out to be? |
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| Chris T. Dot |
| I think religion itself is good. It's the leaders of these religions, the ones who supposedly represent these faiths that mess everything up. Too many of these "representatives" look at differences instead of similarities. They interpret the scriptures in totally wrong ways, etc. If you study each religion, which I have, having read both the Bible, the Quran, Buddist scriptures, etc, you notice that each religion teaches the same basic things: To love God and to love one another. It's human nature that causes bad things to happen in the world. Some wacko does something "in the name of God" and boom, they mess up the image of a certain faith. Extremists and fundamentalists never truly represent what a certain religion teaches. Unfortuneately, many people look at them and believe they do. I would consider myself pretty religious Catholic wise and I have close friends who are deeply Islamic, Jewish, Hindu, and Buddist. And none of us never had any problems getting along because of religious differences, when if u think about, don't exist. We all accept each other's views and as long as everyone treats others with respect and kindness, everything is peaceful. |
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| tiesto14 |
| quote: | Originally posted by George Smiley
World War Two had nothing to do with religion. Hitler's brand of fascism was based on race - the Jews are a race, not just a religion. But that is irrelevent, we did not go to war with Germany to save the Jews, we (and when I say we yes, I mean the UK and Russia!!) went to war with Germany cos they treatened our security, sod all to do with religion. Vietnam was another nasty war, again, nothing to do with religion. I know this will get shot down, but I would say the Israel-Arab wars are not as much about religion as they are percieved. If you are aware, it was only in the late 80s when the Islamists (Hamas) came on the scene (well this was the time they took up arms anyway). Before that, the Palestinian commando groups were all aethiest/Marxists (and so were the Arab states who attacked Israel - pan Arab nationalism was socialist, altho they did use religious rhetoric as legitimation) and during the first Intifada Fatah members would go around Mosques trashing them and beating up clergy men (thats why they fight with Hamas so much - they are aethiests). Clearly Zionism is based on religion and without that ideology this conflict probably would not have taken place, and the situation we have now, with the Islamists popular, is also clearly religious. At the same time, there is nothing in Islam that says you must hate Jews. Jews and Muslims got on fine thoughout history, with the latter giving protection to the Jews during the Crusades. They hate each other now because of the land Arabs (Christian as well as Muslim) lost in 1948. Those lands were taken away because of a religious project, but from the Arab point of view, can you see why it is not as much as a religious issue as it is made out to be? |
Hence today I believe that I am acting in accordance with the will of the Almighty Creator: by defending myself against evil, I am fighting for the work of the Lord. Adolf Hitler (Mein Kampf)
Religion:rolleyes: |
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| tiesto14 |
| quote: | Originally posted by ::TranceVanDyk::
wrong, more people have died from atheistic wars and regimes than any other reason in the entire history of the world. 50 million people died because of hitler. untold millions died under stalin. atheistic doctrines held eastern europe captive for half a century. |
Hence today I believe that I am acting in accordance with the will of the Almighty Creator: by defending myself against evil, I am fighting for the work of the Lord. Adolf Hitler (Mein Kampf)
For to even hint that more people have died, in the history of time, for any thing other than religion/in the name of God is absurd.
| quote: | Originally posted by ::TranceVanDyk::
and are you telling me, you have never stolen, lied, thought about if u could physically hurt someone, been greedy, and the list goes on and on? |
Yes i have.....whats your point?
"With or without religion, you would have good people doing good things and evil people doing evil things. But for good people to do evil things, that takes religion." Carey Goldberg. |
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