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Hamas to keep on killin'.... (pg. 9)
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| George Smiley |
| quote: | Originally posted by Yoepus
Sorry missed this question.
Short answer: I believe Israel should have all of it.
I didn't always feel this way, but I believe after the events of the past 5 years spliting or any other taking away of soverignty of Jerusalem will be a victory for terror. |
I've never been a fan of those kinds of principles (eg never negotiate with terrorists) cos it tends to ensure no discussion of why terrorism is occuring. I guess its the old debate about terrorist vs freedom fighter. You have to look at why they do this - sometimes it might be out of hatred, but more often than not it is a protest against something they have no power over. If you can work your way past the dogmatic principles, and understand why they are doing these acts, then your well on your way to finding a solution. Thats if its in your interests/aims to find a solution. If not, then you tell everyone the reason they are doing this is out of hatred and everyone agrees!
As for your view of Jerusalem, I think its unfair to blame everything that has happened on the Palestinians, and not only that use that as an excuse to get your own way over Jerusalem. Surely you can point to certain Israeli policies and think "ok, well that policy didn't help the peace and is likely to result in terrorist attacks"?? Settlements, the wall, house demolitions?
I wouldn't actually be opposed to a separation barrier if Israel just said, "we're withdrawing from the West Bank, have your state but dont come into our country for jobs" as long as there were commintments from the US, the EU and lets be fair, Israel to invest in infrastructures and the economy to lessen the reliance of Palestinians on Israel so they didn't need to cross the boarder...
...but thats not gonna happen cos Israel wants to annex large parts of the West Bank... |
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| hardcore trancer |
| quote: | Originally posted by LazFX
You are such an Idiot. You really are. Is it lonely bieng so ing stupid??? |
perhaps you can do a research on your own on this issue first before coming here and talking trash like that. |
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| Yoepus |
| quote: | Originally posted by George Smiley
I've never been a fan of those kinds of principles (eg never negotiate with terrorists) cos it tends to ensure no discussion of why terrorism is occuring. I guess its the old debate about terrorist vs freedom fighter. You have to look at why they do this - sometimes it might be out of hatred, but more often than not it is a protest against something they have no power over. If you can work your way past the dogmatic principles, and understand why they are doing these acts, then your well on your way to finding a solution. Thats if its in your interests/aims to find a solution. If not, then you tell everyone the reason they are doing this is out of hatred and everyone agrees!
As for your view of Jerusalem, I think its unfair to blame everything that has happened on the Palestinians, and not only that use that as an excuse to get your own way over Jerusalem. Surely you can point to certain Israeli policies and think "ok, well that policy didn't help the peace and is likely to result in terrorist attacks"?? Settlements, the wall, house demolitions?
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Its not the aims of the Palestinians (why they do what they do) that I am against. It is the methods they employ to reach those goals.
I don't think terrorism/suicide bombings in civilan populations should ever be employed - under any circumstances - and can never be justified.
Giving Jerusalem IMO proves that a war conducted by suicide bombings works - a precedent that should never be set. |
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| George Smiley |
| quote: | Originally posted by Yoepus
Its not the aims of the Palestinians (why they do what they do) that I am against. It is the methods they employ to reach those goals.
I don't think terrorism/suicide bombings in civilan populations should ever be employed - under any circumstances - and can never be justified.
Giving Jerusalem IMO proves that a war conducted by suicide bombings works - a precedent that should never be set. |
But at the same time as (rightly) criticising (some of) the methods of the Palestinians, surely you should also criticise (some of) the methods the Israelis use? I see both sides undertaking operations that in no way can be justified which is why I dont agree with your view that Israel should gets its way because of what the Palestinians have done, when exactly the same could be said about Israel... |
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| Yoepus |
| quote: | Originally posted by George Smiley
But at the same time as (rightly) criticising (some of) the methods of the Palestinians, surely you should also criticise (some of) the methods the Israelis use? I see both sides undertaking operations that in no way can be justified which is why I dont agree with your view that Israel should gets its way because of what the Palestinians have done, when exactly the same could be said about Israel... |
I don't know what you are taking about. Even the worst Israeli methods (what curfews? targeted assisnations? roadblocks?) Don't compare to the inhuman, savage methods exercised by the Palestinians.
At least Israel is trying to fight with honor and civility.
There seems to be no respect by the purpitrators of suicide attakcs of the simple fact that Israelis - like everyone else - are human and deserve human dignity.
Like I said, I wasn't always against it - I am today however. And it might take 10-25 years if Palestinians disassociate their methods and take on new paths before I might be more inclined to think that way again (assuming no final status negotiations have been made by then).
"Its not what you say, its how you say it" |
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| hardcore trancer |
| quote: | Originally posted by Yoepus
I don't know what you are taking about. Even the worst Israeli methods (what curfews? targeted assisnations? roadblocks?) Don't compare to the inhuman, savage methods exercised by the Palestinians |
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You dont think it is fair then perhaps you can supply them with a proper army like the the one Isreal has this way it'll be fair game.
| quote: | | At least Israel is trying to fight with honor and civility. |
lol fair game??are you joking?IDF fights with civility?demolishing houses, or shooting at children in the head for throwing rocks at them?or how about those so called assasinations?shooting rockets into a crowded area.perhaps those things are fair to you :o
| quote: | | There seems to be no respect by the purpitrators of suicide attakcs of the simple fact that Israelis - like everyone else - are human and deserve human dignity. |
and the Palestinians arent human and dont deserve dignity? |
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| Cyrus King |
| quote: | Originally posted by LazFX
You are such an Idiot. You really are. Is it lonely bieng so ing stupid??? |
This is expected coming from a hick texan ahahahhhahahah |
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| Yoepus |
| quote: | Originally posted by hardcore trancer
You dont think it is fair then perhaps you can supply them with a proper army like the the one Isreal has this way it'll be fair game. |
They had an army in 1948, 1956, 1967, 1973.... and the Russians supplied it, not me.
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lol fair game??are you joking?IDF fights with civility?demolishing houses, or shooting at children in the head for throwing rocks at them?or how about those so called assasinations?shooting rockets into a crowded area.perhaps those things are fair to you :o |
I believe these type of acts were a direct result/response to terror. Looking through history you don't see the IDF use such tactics prior to the war of suicide bombings.
Also note I didn't say the IDF does fight with civilty and honor, but that it tries to. Palestinians terrorist haven't even put that effort.
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and the Palestinians arent human and dont deserve dignity? |
I never said that. I simply said they don't deserve Jerusalem;) |
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| LazFX |
| quote: | Originally posted by Cyrus King
This is expected coming from a hick texan ahahahhhahahah |
Hick?? and you are???
Oh yeah, STUPID! |
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| LazFX |
| quote: | Originally posted by hardcore trancer
perhaps you can do a research on your own on this issue first before coming here and talking trash like that. |
Oh like you?? ??
I lost a close cousin in the WTC attacks that these DOGS did, that is all the research I need. So FOAD terror lover,
As far as I am concerend these people are Dogs and so are the people that support them, or come on this board and make excuses for them.
So run off with your tail between your legs. |
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| LazFX |
| quote: | Originally posted by Cyrus King
They dont have a country becuase those terrorist zionists came into PALESTINE and stole their land.. burnt down or confiscated villiages which they renamed... and formed a greater israel than was proposed by the UN. Since then.. the zionists have not allowed the palestinians a country of their own. It will be their worst nightmare.
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Lets take it back a bit.....
Correct me if I am wrong, but when Ishmial was born and was told that he would father a great nation, was he told that he would be given the promiss land?? Uh No. |
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| George Smiley |
| quote: | Originally posted by LazFX
Lets take it back a bit.....
Correct me if I am wrong, but when Ishmial was born and was told that he would father a great nation, was he told that he would be given the promiss land?? Uh No. |
Well bare in mind there is no such thing as "God", then nobody else was promised land so what's your point? |
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