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milwaukee harley-davidson for teh lose (pg. 4)
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| DJ RJT |
| quote: | Originally posted by D-res
you've opened pandoras box dude. this is the type of i live for. so let me start.
you obviously dont get this but in order for a building to be built, they need to secure financing. in the case of commercial developments, you must secure a large enough tenant or enough tenants who commit to office space before they build the building, otherwise the developers make blank office space and lose money. that doesnt happen so unless a tenant is secured, they dont build the building. the same thing goes for condos. they wont build unless a certain percentage of the condos are bought. generally, depending on the size of the project or the price of condoes this can vary from 30% to 70%. most of the condos being built in milwaukee have a 40% or a 60% minimum. considering how many buildings are being built or converted into condos throughout downtown, the third ward and the east side, this means that indeed people ARE buying condos. the js does articles on things like this all the time. they just did one about people from the chicago suburbs buying condos in the 3rd ward on the river as vacation homes due to the fact that its so much less expensive than the ones in chicago, although i cant imagine 300,000 being cheap. this is also leading to a steady INCREASE in the downtown population.
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Just because a percentage is sold doesn't mean people will keep them, nor does it mean the building will EVER be filled to capacity. Rationalizing solely that the building of these condo towers will somehow signify a major turn around in the city of Milwaukee is both naive and ignorant with respect to the hundreds of other social and cultural factors lending to the decline of Milwaukee. Just because downtown is booming, doesn't mean the city is healthy.
Also, relying on the Journal Sentinal for unbiased and accurate information regarding your city isn't exactly brilliant. Their bias cannot be denied.
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the marquette interchange project is happening because, even since the original was built, it has been inefficient and dangerous. the old one was built to handle about 150,000 cars a day but it current handles nearly 350,000 a day. the marquette interchange project itself will be happening into 2008 but this is actually just the first step in a large highway renovation going down throughout the metro area and along I94 to chicago.
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And the construction of which is also the subject of intense scrutiny with regard to its efficiency, safety, and adherence to regulations regarding constructions impact on the environment. The city and state are both under an immense microscope right now for the corners they've cut in order to save money to finish the project. There is little, to no chance, that you will see construction finished before the next decade arrives.
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the population decline is due to a lot of factors which i wont go into because i dont have that much time but its NOT the only city to experience decline although due to the fact that its the only true major city in the state, it follows a simliar trend that most other major cities in the midwest have followed. after the industrial decline decades ago people lost jobs. we all know that. its common knowledge. this is where the name "rust belt" for the midwest was coined. milwuakee along with st loius, indianapolis, detroit, cinncinatti, colombus and even minneapolis have experienced population decline due to these factors. along with those, people with money including families and young professionals seek the american dream and move to the suburbs. thats why the metro populations for all these cities is constantly experiencing growth. urbn sprawl is a huge problem. a lot of people are moving out of cold climates for year around warth. this, along with the trend of sprawl have contributed to the metro areas of cities like atlanta, charlotte and pheonix to skyrocket. of course sprawl isnt necessarily a good thing. the metro area of atlanta has become a huge problem and its swallowing up the entire state of georgia. unplanned suburban deveolpment and everyones desire for a 2 story house with a big backyard means turns into constant outward development from the city center, which explains why these metros are growing at such an alarming rate. i fear for pheonix because considering its location in the middle of the desert, they dont have any good source of water and have nearly sucked the colorado river dry to make manmade lakes around golf courses and so everyone can sprinkler their grass and keep it green, but im getting off topic.
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You won't go into the many factors regarding Milwaukees population decline only because you clearly don't understand them, and your response to the issue of it was to write it off to a national trend. The fact of the matter is that this ISN'T happening everywhere in the midwest, northeast, or northwest, all areas that have cold climates and formerly strong industrial communities. Your comparison "st loius, indianapolis, detroit, cinncinatti, colombus and even minneapolis" isn't even close to apt, as each of those cities has their own unique reason for their decline. Detroit has crime and GM layoffs, St. Louis and Colombus have a significantly declining industrial population, and so on. If you really think blanket generalizations can write of unique problems with cities, you my friend should go into politics, because you seem to have a natural knack for hiding behind generalizations and taking a "See no/Hear No?Speak No Evil" approach to life.
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Crime is not increasing by any means either. violent crime is in fact down and crime in general has stayed quite steady and has declined since last year. the city gov't is doing a lot to help this but my fingers are getting tired so i'll spare you the reading. i think you need to go to milwaukee and take a serious tour with someone who knows the city and knows the kinds of developments that are going on around the area before you open your mouth and compare milwaukee to the of the world. also, consider going here: clicky
i joined that site with the same mentality that milwaukee was a hole and people just like my current self showed me exactly why thats a completely ignorant viewpoint. |
Crime has been down for 1, count it ONE year. Show me professionally documented evidence otherwise and I'll eat my hat.
For now, I'm just going to agree to disagree, but I'll tell you this much, if you're happy moving to and living in Milwaukee, good for you. When all these massive changes you list happen and Milwaukee, WI is picked to host the Summer Olympics as the pinnacle development of American society, I'll gladly listen to you yell "Owned" and will sadly depart TA with my hat in my hand.
And Myra, if you feel like listening to D-Res spout political propaganda about Milwaukee and believing it, that's fine with me. But IMO following this D-Res, you're just an uneducated, pompous, blind prick who doesn't really care to see the faults in something he takes so much pride in. |
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| D-res |
| quote: | Originally posted by lücid
[IMG]http://images5.fotki.com/v65/photos/1/192770/797460/DSCF0002_02-vi.jpg[IMG]
:toothless |
thats an old pic. i can see 1522 On The Lake being built in the background which was completed in 03.
this is the one im speaking of.
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| Boomer187 |
get some casinos in there and then we can start talking.....
although on average casinos make no difference in population or crime increases |
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| Masonious |
This thread needs more Balki.
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| ivanbee |
#1 - harley davidson motorcycles are for poser n00bs. those bikes
#2 - drinking and driving is for morons
#3 - los angeles > milwakee. live over here, it's better |
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| UWM |
| quote: | Originally posted by DJ RJT
D-Res, you're just an uneducated, pompous, blind prick |
Criticizing someone for using personal insults and then resorting to them yourself is a bit hypocritical don't you think? |
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| lücid |
| quote: | Originally posted by DJ RJT
Crime has been down for 1, count it ONE year. Show me professionally documented evidence otherwise and I'll eat my hat.
...and will sadly depart TA with my hat in my hand.
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you really like your hat, huh? :p
with of all the facts and figures you 2 are stating about the city, we could sit here and argue all day whether we think Milwaukee is improving or not. i can't really say anything because i haven't been living here long enough and i really don't read or keep myself up to date on what's going on in the city... so i'm just going by what you kids tell me, and it appeared that Andy knew what he was talking about. call me ignorant or stupid but i just don't find it interesting to learn all the boring statistics about crime rate, population, etc...
and yeah that pic is mad old... its from the summer that i moved to Milwaukee (2002). |
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| Masonious |
| quote: | Originally posted by DJ RJT
Mason, you ever post Balki on these forums again I'll have your head on a in' stake, got it? |
:( |
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| DJ RJT |
| quote: | Originally posted by Masonious
:( |
Bah, I tried to delete that because it was inappropriate...
Edit: Completely, inappropriate. Apologies. |
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| lücid |
| quote: | Originally posted by DJ RJT
Bah, I tried to delete that because it was inappropriate...
Edit: Completely, inappropriate. Apologies. |
yeah... inappropriate. |
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| all-nite-freak |
| all these words dont chnage the fact that Milwaukee is in my top 3 lists of "big" cities ive been to that are ugly holes.:p |
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| D-res |
| quote: | Originally posted by DJ RJT
Just because a percentage is sold doesn't mean people will keep them, nor does it mean the building will EVER be filled to capacity. Rationalizing solely that the building of these condo towers will somehow signify a major turn around in the city of Milwaukee is both naive and ignorant with respect to the hundreds of other social and cultural factors lending to the decline of Milwaukee. Just because downtown is booming, doesn't mean the city is healthy. |
i realize that condo booms cant single handedly turn around the city and i am aware that milwaukee does have a long way before it will be a top notch tourist destination due to its preservation of early german architecture and the sort.
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Also, relying on the Journal Sentinal for unbiased and accurate information regarding your city isn't exactly brilliant. Their bias cannot be denied. |
they are biased indeed but they do accurately report facts. the fact is people are buying condos and while no one keeps their conod forever, theres the constant flow of more incoming young professionals looking for a place to live on the riverfront. assuming milwaukee doesnt dive into another massive urban decline that has murdered its urban population statistics over the past few decades, this is good news. of course this is complete assumption and its never good to assume but the city is trying to move away from the manufacturing and such as large employers and it is. in fact as of right now, the largest employer in the city is health care. i dont remember the top 5 employers but banking was also on that list if i remember correctly and again assuming my memory serves me correct, industrial, unskilled labor doesnt touch the list.
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And the construction of which is also the subject of intense scrutiny with regard to its efficiency, safety, and adherence to regulations regarding constructions impact on the environment. The city and state are both under an immense microscope right now for the corners they've cut in order to save money to finish the project. There is little, to no chance, that you will see construction finished before the next decade arrives.
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again this is compeltely speculative. its said to be done in early to mid 2008. of course when that is done they want to redo the road condition of I94 to chicago, the 45 (zoo) interchange west of miller park and possibly even the airport interchange.
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You won't go into the many factors regarding Milwaukees population decline only because you clearly don't understand them, and your response to the issue of it was to write it off to a national trend. The fact of the matter is that this ISN'T happening everywhere in the midwest, northeast, or northwest, all areas that have cold climates and formerly strong industrial communities. Your comparison "st loius, indianapolis, detroit, cinncinatti, colombus and even minneapolis" isn't even close to apt, as each of those cities has their own unique reason for their decline. Detroit has crime and GM layoffs, St. Louis and Colombus have a significantly declining industrial population, and so on. If you really think blanket generalizations can write of unique problems with cities, you my friend should go into politics, because you seem to have a natural knack for hiding behind generalizations and taking a "See no/Hear No?Speak No Evil" approach to life. |
i understand that milwaukee has suffered from more than just job loss due to industry closings. all cities decline in their own way. i was simply stating that it is a SIMILAR trend in many other midwester cities of similar size. chicago is exempt from this list but of course chicago is on a whole nother level from the other midwestern cities i mentioned.
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Crime has been down for 1, count it ONE year. Show me professionally documented evidence otherwise and I'll eat my hat. |
i know it hasnt been on a steady decrease for the last decade but it has to start somewhere. all this improvement throughout milwaukee has been very subtle for the last 10 years and only in the past couple as stepped out. slow but steady bro. there are a lot of problemns plaguing this city but until YOU understand the processes that the city is going through to change, dont badmouth milwaukee like you obviously enjoy doing.
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For now, I'm just going to agree to disagree, but I'll tell you this much, if you're happy moving to and living in Milwaukee, good for you. When all these massive changes you list happen and Milwaukee, WI is picked to host the Summer Olympics as the pinnacle development of American society, I'll gladly listen to you yell "Owned" and will sadly depart TA with my hat in my hand. |
speaking of olympics, chicago is trying to extend its metra rail to downtown instead of its current limit at kenosha. the midwest is also on its way to try and create a midwest-wide high speed rail system considering the inefficiency of amtrak and chicago wants to put in a bid for the olympics in whcih if it were to win, assuming the high speed rail has gone through, they may use milwaukee to host events such as baseball and also use some of milwaukees hotel space for athletes. its a joint project. of course its getting a lot of criticism because olympic project get built and when the olympics is done, those projects sit vacant.
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And Myra, if you feel like listening to D-Res spout political propaganda about Milwaukee and believing it, that's fine with me. But IMO following this D-Res, you're just an uneducated, pompous, blind prick who doesn't really care to see the faults in something he takes so much pride in. |
ouch. thats a dick move man. theres nothing wrong in being proud of where you reside. you just have a lot of learning to do yourself about the positives here. its not just one heaping pile of decline. go to the site i linked you to. theres a lot i think YOU could learn as well.
btw im taking a class about urban problems and milwaukee is one of the centers of discussion. i dont blindly decide to not believe the past because i know this city has been to and back but i am looking forward and OPENING MY EYES to what this city IS NOW and is trying TO BECOME. |
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