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what's the point of 'prayer'? (pg. 3)
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| Moral Hazard |
I pray. Normally I will thank God for the gift of my life and ask God to give me peace and the strength/wisdom to be a good man. Whether or not God grants my request or the act of prayer simply puts me at ease I cannot say but what I do know is that I do experience an easing of the troubles that normally pester me and I believe I am a good person. Ultimately that's what it's about.... making the person saying the prayer feel better. Whether it's a prayer for confession, profession of faith, or a plea for the peace of God it's all about satisfying some emotional/psychological need of the one praying. As long as it works I don't think it really matters whether or not God is answering the prayer or it's just a coping mechanism.
To those of you that mock prayer; Why do you begrudge people something that gives them peace or eases their mind, especially as it does not effect you? |
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| Moongoose |
| Oh but it does effect me. I dont know you, so i cant say if you are like this, but around here most of these praying pricks tend to think that everyone else needs to hear how good prayer has worked out for them. And they also seem to think that since they are so damn happy, if everyone else prayed they would also be happy. Now there are certain things i want and dont want in my life, and listening to a prick preaching to me that my life would be even better if i prayed to god isnt one of them. If you can keep your faith to yourself, i dont care who you pray to, pray to jahwe, satan, osiris, zeus, vishna or the flying spaghetti monster for all i care, just when you go out among people try to remember that not everybody is incapable of going troug life without the help of a higher power. |
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| Moral Hazard |
| quote: | Originally posted by Moongoose
Oh but it does effect me. I dont know you, so i cant say if you are like this, but around here most of these praying pricks tend to think that everyone else needs to hear how good prayer has worked out for them. And they also seem to think that since they are so damn happy, if everyone else prayed they would also be happy. Now there are certain things i want and dont want in my life, and listening to a prick preaching to me that my life would be even better if i prayed to god isnt one of them. If you can keep your faith to yourself, i dont care who you pray to, pray to jahwe, satan, osiris, zeus, vishna or the flying spaghetti monster for all i care, just when you go out among people try to remember that not everybody is incapable of going troug life without the help of a higher power. |
It's not prayer that effects you, it's the missionaries that believe it is their duty to try and beat the word of God into you. Please note that these people are truely misguided. While most Christian traditions hold that followers are to be apostles (meaning they are to spread the good news of God and the values taught by Jesus) most regard evangalism as a very poor way to accomplish this. Most Christian traditions teach their followers to lead by example rather then stand on a soap box and trying to shame others into conversion. I really dispise what the evangelicals (born agains in particular) do in their missionary efforts. I will challenge them every chance I get but at the same time I understand that they truely believe what they are doing is right and necessary.... even though I believe they have misinterpreted the message.
BTW, next time a born-again gets all up in your face telling you that you need to repent and be born-again else you'll burn in hell you can employ my little trick. Tell them you've read the Revelation of John and quote "the beast shall be thrown into the pit, the door locked and chained, and all the damned set free" (I'm sorry I cannot recall the chapter and verse). Follow that by saying... since if you're right I get out anyway I'm not too worried. Then simply walk away..... they'll be scrambling like no tomorrow to find a way to refute you but they know they can't.... it's fun to watch them decend into intellectual melt down. |
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| weymouth |
| quote: | Originally posted by Moongoose
Oh but it does effect me. I dont know you, so i cant say if you are like this, but around here most of these praying pricks tend to think that everyone else needs to hear how good prayer has worked out for them. And they also seem to think that since they are so damn happy, if everyone else prayed they would also be happy. Now there are certain things i want and dont want in my life, and listening to a prick preaching to me that my life would be even better if i prayed to god isnt one of them. If you can keep your faith to yourself, i dont care who you pray to, pray to jahwe, satan, osiris, zeus, vishna or the flying spaghetti monster for all i care, just when you go out among people try to remember that not everybody is incapable of going troug life without the help of a higher power. |
Maybe if you try not communicating at all with people you won't have the problem of disagreeing with what people say because from what you just wrote you are incapable of accepting others with different ideas. |
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| weymouth |
| quote: | Originally posted by Moral Hazard
It's not prayer that effects you, it's the missionaries that believe it is their duty to try and beat the word of God into you. Please note that these people are truely misguided. While most Christian traditions hold that followers are to be apostles (meaning they are to spread the good news of God and the values taught by Jesus) most regard evangalism as a very poor way to accomplish this. Most Christian traditions teach their followers to lead by example rather then stand on a soap box and trying to shame others into conversion. I really dispise what the evangelicals (born agains in particular) do in their missionary efforts. I will challenge them every chance I get but at the same time I understand that they truely believe what they are doing is right and necessary.... even though I believe they have misinterpreted the message.
BTW, next time a born-again gets all up in your face telling you that you need to repent and be born-again else you'll burn in hell you can employ my little trick. Tell them you've read the Revelation of John and quote "the beast shall be thrown into the pit, the door locked and chained, and all the damned set free" (I'm sorry I cannot recall the chapter and verse). Follow that by saying... since if you're right I get out anyway I'm not too worried. Then simply walk away..... they'll be scrambling like no tomorrow to find a way to refute you but they know they can't.... it's fun to watch them decend into intellectual melt down. |
I understand that there may be some evangelicals that street witness and you may have met them and felt threatened because of their overt style of witnessing but to simply say that all evangelical missionaries are out to "beat the word of God into you" is far from the truth. Most missionaries will either become a part of the society they are at or create a church in the area. The ones that become a part of society will witness through their work, actions, and befriending people first. The ones with an already established structure will invite people to come to their meetings. Granted the style of witnessing is much different depending on the area of the world you are in but to say all evangelical missionaries are the type you believe them to be is short sited. |
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| Moongoose |
| quote: | Originally posted by Moral Hazard
BTW, next time a born-again gets all up in your face telling you that you need to repent and be born-again else you'll burn in hell you can employ my little trick. Tell them you've read the Revelation of John and quote "the beast shall be thrown into the pit, the door locked and chained, and all the damned set free" (I'm sorry I cannot recall the chapter and verse). Follow that by saying... since if you're right I get out anyway I'm not too worried. Then simply walk away..... they'll be scrambling like no tomorrow to find a way to refute you but they know they can't.... it's fun to watch them decend into intellectual melt down. |
Making obnoxious religious people descend into intellectual melt down has been my hobby for years. Thank for another tip on how to achieve that, I can use this one when i dont have time for a lenghty discussion :D
| quote: | | Maybe if you try not communicating at all with people you won't have the problem of disagreeing with what people say because from what you just wrote you are incapable of accepting others with different ideas. |
I will advise you to read my comment again. I said i am perfectly fine with a persons beliefes as long as that person keeps them to them selves. I dont have a problem with them until they themselves make it my problem. Unfortunately there seems to be quite a lot of people that find my lack of faith in god disturbing and are trying to convince me that its in my best interest to change my beliefes therefore they are making their beliefes my problem. |
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| Moral Hazard |
| quote: | Originally posted by weymouth
I understand that there may be some evangelicals that street witness and you may have met them and felt threatened because of their overt style of witnessing but to simply say that all evangelical missionaries are out to "beat the word of God into you" is far from the truth. Most missionaries will either become a part of the society they are at or create a church in the area. The ones that become a part of society will witness through their work, actions, and befriending people first. The ones with an already established structure will invite people to come to their meetings. Granted the style of witnessing is much different depending on the area of the world you are in but to say all evangelical missionaries are the type you believe them to be is short sited. |
I agree with you. My comments were restricted to those that agressively preach in the street, not all, I should have qualified my statements better. |
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| Moral Hazard |
| quote: | Originally posted by Moongoose
I will advise you to read my comment again. I said i am perfectly fine with a persons beliefes as long as that person keeps them to them selves. I dont have a problem with them until they themselves make it my problem. Unfortunately there seems to be quite a lot of people that find my lack of faith in god disturbing and are trying to convince me that its in my best interest to change my beliefes therefore they are making their beliefes my problem. |
As much as I can identify with your complaints I would again point out that these people honestly believe that it is their duty/calling to spread the word. They honestly believe that they are helping you. While that won't make it any less annoying you should keep that in mind. In fact, if you were to tell them you understand the above and then inform them that you really aren't interested in hearing "the good news" right now they will probably be more apt to simply allow you to carry on your way. |
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| tctitan |
B.I.B.L.E. - Basic Instructions Before Leaving Earth
"Why should you die to go to heaven when the Earth is already in space?" |
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| weymouth |
| quote: | Originally posted by Moongoose
I will advise you to read my comment again. I said i am perfectly fine with a persons beliefes as long as that person keeps them to them selves. I dont have a problem with them until they themselves make it my problem. Unfortunately there seems to be quite a lot of people that find my lack of faith in god disturbing and are trying to convince me that its in my best interest to change my beliefes therefore they are making their beliefes my problem. |
I read it again and have a hard time finding where you said that you are perfectly fine with people believing what they want without attacking them and calling them pricks or making yourself seem better because you dont pray. |
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| weymouth |
| quote: | | Originally posted by Moral Hazard Tell them you've read the Revelation of John and quote "the beast shall be thrown into the pit, the door locked and chained, and all the damned set free" (I'm sorry I cannot recall the chapter and verse). Follow that by saying... since if you're right I get out anyway I'm not too worried. Then simply walk away..... they'll be scrambling like no tomorrow to find a way to refute you but they know they can't.... it's fun to watch them decend into intellectual melt down. |
Revelations is a difficult book of the Bible to discuss but I think you might of misunderstood the verse. I don't really want to get into a Rev. debate or especially a Biblical debate of infallability and inerrantness but I'm reading from the KJV of Revelations 20:3 "And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fullfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season." This was right after Armageddon and leads into the 1,000 year reign of Christ on earth. After the 1,000 years Satan is let loose one last time and gathers an army of men from the nations of the world. The only one set free was Satan, not the false prophet, the beast, or the "damned". Then after that final battle 20:10 "and the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever." Perhaps it was a different version that you read and if you can find the part where it mentions all the damned shall be set free I would love to study it and check it out. |
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| weymouth |
| To get back on subject: Prayer is fellowship with God. Just like any relationship, the more time you spend together the closer you become. To an aetheist this would sound absurd as many of you expressed with your comments. The original poster is just another attempt to try to redicule believers, he already made up his mind what prayer was and it having no point. |
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